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Hello .30Carbine

You write

> I found this "classic" the most pornographic, licentious, selfish pleausure-promoting, fallen human ego-aggrandizing, Way of Christ-bashing and senselessly violent reading I've done in a long time.

Oops!... I certainly meant you no offense by the recommendation. And I'm genuinely sorry you didn't enjoy the book. I found Aramis (the priest-Musketeer) a particularly interesting character, with his struggles between following the way of the cloth (which he ultimately does, in the end) and being a Musketeer, and the dichotomy that this presents him with.

(These would be struggles I can relate to in my day-to-day life).

I thought his intended thesis, which followed the lines of "nothing is worth sacrificing if it is not accompanied by regret" to be particularly profound.

All the more interesting because this work of fiction is based largely on real, historical characters and events. Porthos, Athos, Aramis, and D'Artagnan, DeVille, Cardinal Richelieu, King Louis, Buckingham -- all real people.

Granted, it *is* a wee bit of a rollicking read: I suppose I had just filtered that, much like I have to filter what's on the telly and what I encounter in the streets. I'd find it difficult to live my life if I were easily scandalized: over the years I have developed a very thick skin.

(That said, I try to hold myself to a high personal standard of morality and ethic and conduct.)

I guess I forgot that not everybody would find The Three Musketeers entertaining, for the reasons you raise: my recommendation clearly has caused you upset, and for that I am deeply sorry.

The offense was inadvertent.

> what god do you believe in and how does The Three Musketeers embrace and promote your religious values/your idea of who God is and what He requires?

I'll do my best to explain.

As to the Trinity, I have a very simple Faith: the three-in-one is a concept I have a great deal of difficulty getting my head around. Not being able to understand something is a barrier to Faith, for me.

So I explain it to myself like this: God is the Father and is both eternal and immortal. Jesus is His only begotten Son, not eternal (for he was conceived and born of the Virgin Mary) and once mortal (for he died on the Cross) but raised to Immortality at the Resurrection and is now at the right hand of God. The Holy Ghost is the practical outworking of God's power, manifested.

This makes sense to me because I take a very prima facie reading of the Bible. Possibly this is a simplistic approach, perhaps too "face value" but for me I can understand this.

I used to have a Religion. After a series of trials and setbacks in my life, I of necessity took a small step back from my Religion and developed in its place a very simple yet deep Christian Faith.

I lost a strict dogma and gained a deep and rewarding Spirituality. In all, this is working in my daily walk and has given me Direction, whereas what I had before was not.

I hope you are still doing OK with your campaign to quit smoking?

Kindest regards
"DieHard"

[" I found this "classic" the most pornographic, licentious, selfish pleausure-promoting, fallen human ego-aggrandizing, Way of Christ-bashing and senselessly violent reading I've done in a long time."-30carbine ]

Quite a beautiful passage written by our sister, a sweet spirit.. Her experience of and in the that book was my experience of several major denominations and few minor ones and even a cult or two.. over the years..

The Holy Spirit is definitely NOT welcome many of those places.. and I would suspect Jesus isn't either, the real one.. I can relate to what you've written here.. and to 30carbine too.. The only way I can think kindly of "those Church's" and congregations is I that noticed along the way.. That some view Jesus as a human body extant, and others as a Spirit using a human body for awhile..

The "Ones" that relate to Jesus as a human seem to glory in being a human themselves with all the pros and cons related to that.. The "Others" relate to Jesus as a Spirit before, after and during his human episode.. and being human was merely divine contact; on several levels..

1) Answer to Prophecy from prophets..
2) An Object Lesson for teaching..
3) An Epilogue to the Jewish experience..
4) A Prologue to the Spiritual experience..
5) And a hint to future ultimate Universal experience..

Was Jesus human or divine?.. Or a human masking divinity.. Important questions.. Was Jesus God?.. A human selected to do divine things.. Or God incarnate?.. If he was God incarnate then he was God before the incarnation, God being an eternal being.. Who specifically is the Godhead; God, the Holy Spirit and Jesus, "the Christ(Messiah)".. It don't say anywhere the answer to that.. Actually in Exodus Ch 3;3 it says(basically) "its none of our business".. Who they are.. i.e. "I am; sent you. I am that I am"..

Yes... Jesus(Spirit) riding a human body around like a donkey will/can give an expanded view of "the Plan".. For as I see it, that is promoted through metaphor all over the Old and New Testaments.. "We" are, also, spirits in human bodies.. Always were, all of us, understanding scripture especially the New Testament requires knowing that..

And IF "the Vision(or revelation) of Jesus"(Rev ch 1;1) is taken into account.. With its vision of the past, present and future events.. A prologue (metaphorically) is given to an extremely Spiritual future.. The human experience it seems then is based in humility and gratitude.. Properly humble with the right amount of gratitude we as humans who are really spirits can then see scripture spiritually and be encouraged that the architect of our spirits is building even today a proper spiritual dwelling place to house your and my spirits..

I got quite a bit of encouragement from this discourse between you and 30carbine.. Thanks to all involved.. For if the Spirit of the Christ is nothing its the TRUTH.. Truth rings like rubbing a wet crystal wine glass to me..

Thank you for your reply, DieHard!

I found Aramis (the priest-Musketeer) a particularly interesting character, with his struggles between following the way of the cloth (which he ultimately does, in the end) and being a Musketeer, and the dichotomy that this presents him with. (These would be struggles I can relate to in my day-to-day life). I thought his intended thesis, which followed the lines of "nothing is worth sacrificing if it is not accompanied by regret" to be particularly profound.

From what I gathered, this Musketeer "sacrificed" the head of his girlfriend in the sight of the rest of the band at the end of the book. That's just the opposite of what Jesus, the perfect Man, did for His Beloved. Rather than killing her for her sins, He dies in her place!

it *is* a wee bit of a rollicking read: I suppose I had just filtered that, much like I have to filter what's on the telly and what I encounter in the streets. I'd find it difficult to live my life if I were easily scandalized: over the years I have developed a very thick skin. (That said, I try to hold myself to a high personal standard of morality and ethic and conduct.) I guess I forgot that not everybody would find The Three Musketeers entertaining,

I am not easily scandalized: oh, if you knew my life before Christ, or the true life stories I hear at the pregnancy center!

I am not entertained by what was in the book or even what is on television these days, just as I do not find my sinful past at all entertaining and the stories I deal with in crisis pregnancy center ministry are far from entertaining.

I don't own or watch TV because it is so incredibly violent and pornographic. Scripture commands me to guard my heart and like Job I make a covenant with my eyes--windows to my very soul.

It was not entertaining for me to read about grown men not working for a living, using women as sex objects, using women as sugar-mamas, and killing for fun and sport. As I said, the last straw for me was that line on page 105: "Love is the most selfish of all the emotions." That is a horrible lie: It was love that held Jesus to the cross. What this book referred to as love was not what the Bible refers to as love, and the Bible is my source of truth.

It is because I have been soaking up the Truth for twelve years that my tastes were so unaccustomed to what your tastes found "entertaining" in The Three Musketeers or what you can put up with on TV. What you find entertaining--something to do in your down time--I use (in REAL life) as cause to fall on my face before the living God and plead His blood over, so that men may be set free! This is why Jesus, the God/Man came, and why He died: Because He lives it is possible to be in this world but not of it; dead to sin and alive unto God!

I thank you that the reading you recommended out of your pleasure was a way for me to see how little this world pleases me and how eager I am to please my Father in heaven and to be like unto Him in all things. It is a miracle of His Spirit in me that has so transformed my mind that even The Three Musketeers, a classic in this world's sight, is such rubbish to me.

Hosepipe, if you have been in churches that fit my description of The Three Musketeers I am very sorry for you. I hope you have found a biblical, loving, true family with which to worship our Lord and Savior and in which to serve His interests here on earth until He comes! Amen!