Uhh, no. Bethelgrad is correct. It is not a matter of understanding. It is a matter of informed, intelligent, Biblically based, disagreement. Only members of the Roman church believe that the Roman church is the Catholic church, and that the doctrins of Rome are correct.
Until that realization happens, Roman church members will continue their condescending "they just don't understand" attitude.
Until that realization happens, Roman church members will continue their condescending "they just don't understand" attitude.
Uh, no. Bethelgrad may be correct, but not in the way that he imagines (nor are you).
I don't believe you can find a quote where I said that the Latin Church (you call it the Roman Church) is the Catholic Church. If you can, please cite it.
Secondly, I believe that any of the posters here who are members of any of the historic, apostolic, particular churches will agree with this statement...
The problem is, at least based upon conversations I've had with my Protestant friends, is that they do not comprehend that there is one Church and that is that (cf 1 cor 3:1-5, 1 cor 12:12ff, Eph 5:27, etc.). Jesus Christ is the head of that Church and is the bridegroom of that Church (cf Eph 5:23). He installed Peter as his "prime minister," to deal with the temporal issues relating to that Church (Matt 16:19, cf Isa 22:20-23). Additionally, they do not comprehend the concept of Apostolic succession (cf Acts 1:15ff, and many other examples of episcopal ordinations, cf 2 Ti 1:6, Acts 20:28, etc.).
The only area of even the slightest disagreement is the role of the See of Peter. And that disagreement is slight. But we all (that is those who are part of the historic, apostolic, Church) agree that Rome has the first order of precedence, followed by Constantinople (as the new Rome). How do I know this? Because my Orthodox brethren support the ecumenical councils that so state (cf., Chalcedon Can. XXVIII, 1 Constantinople Can III, 2 Nicea Can IV "...For Peter the supreme head of the Apostles commands...).
See, the problem is not a Biblically-based disagreement. The problem is that the private interpretation of the Bible (strongly discouraged by 2 Pet 1:20) has led generations of people astray from the true, apostolic Faith. And succeeding generations have become more and more blind to that fact until they actually are silly enough to believe in their hearts of hearts that the apostolic church is the one that is apostate. It's really sort of sad when you think about it.
I would suggest you consider the following passage of scripture:
Peace.2Ti 3:1 But understand this, that in the last days there will come times of stress.
2Ti 3:2 For men will be lovers of self, lovers of money, proud, arrogant, abusive, disobedient to their parents, ungrateful, unholy,
2Ti 3:3 inhuman, implacable, slanderers, profligates, fierce, haters of good,
2Ti 3:4 treacherous, reckless, swollen with conceit, lovers of pleasure rather than lovers of God,
2Ti 3:5 holding the form of religion but denying the power of it. Avoid such people.
2Ti 3:6 For among them are those who make their way into households and capture weak women, burdened with sins and swayed by various impulses,
2Ti 3:7 who will listen to anybody and can never arrive at a knowledge of the truth.
2Ti 3:8 As Jannes and Jambres opposed Moses, so these men also oppose the truth, men of corrupt mind and counterfeit faith;
2Ti 3:9 but they will not get very far, for their folly will be plain to all, as was that of those two men.
Although it is not widely known in our Western world, the Catholic Church is actually a communion of Churches. According to the Constitution on the Church of the Second Vatican Council, Lumen Gentium, the Catholic Church is understood to be "a corporate body of Churches," united with the Pope of Rome, who serves as the guardian of unity (LG, no. 23). At present there are 22 Churches that comprise the Catholic Church. The new Code of Canon Law, promulgated by Pope John Paul II, uses the phrase "autonomous ritual Churches" to describe these various Churches (canon 112). Each Church has its own hierarchy, spirituality, and theological perspective. Because of the particularities of history, there is only one Western Catholic Church, while there are 22 Eastern Catholic Churches. The Western Church, known officially as the Latin Church, is the largest of the Catholic Churches. It is immediately subject to the Roman Pontiff as Patriarch of the West. The Eastern Catholic Churches are each led by a Patriarch, Major Archbishop, or Metropolitan, who governs their Church together with a synod of bishops. Through the Congregation for Oriental Churches, the Roman Pontiff works to assure the health and well-being of the Eastern Catholic Churches.
While this diversity within the one Catholic Church can appear confusing at first, it in no way compromises the Church's unity. In a certain sense, it is a reflection of the mystery of the Trinity. Just as God is three Persons, yet one God, so the Church is 22 Churches, yet one Church.
The Catechism of the Catholic Church summarizes this nicely:
"From the beginning, this one Church has been marked by a great diversity which comes from both the variety of God's gifts and the diversity of those who receive them... Holding a rightful place in the communion of the Church there are also particular Churches that retain their own traditions. The great richness of such diversity is not opposed to the Church's unity" (CCC no. 814).
Although there are 22 Churches, there are only eight "Rites" that are used among them. A Rite is a "liturgical, theological, spiritual and disciplinary patrimony," (Code of Canons of the Eastern Churches, canon 28). "Rite" best refers to the liturgical and disciplinary traditions used in celebrating the sacraments. Many Eastern Catholic Churches use the same Rite, although they are distinct autonomous Churches. For example, the Ukrainian Catholic Church and the Melkite Catholic Church are distinct Churches with their own hierarchies. Yet they both use the Byzantine Rite.
To learn more about the "two lungs" of the Catholic Church, visit this link:
A Roman rite Catholic may attend any Eastern Catholic Liturgy and fulfill his of her obligations at any Eastern Catholic Parish. A Roman rite Catholic may join any Eastern Catholic Parish and receive any sacrament from an Eastern Catholic priest, since all belong to the Catholic Church as a whole. I am a Roman Catholic practicing my faith at a Maronite Catholic Church.