Where Have All the Protestants Gone?

NOR ^ | January 2006 | Thomas Storck

[Full Court]

They didn't say it wasn't true,

They did claim parts of Scripture are not true.

[Full Court]

Is our salvation dependent on a literal understanding of Genesis? No, of course not, but it is important to understand that God is the cause of all, and that is the bottom line of the creation story.

John 5:46

 For had ye believed Moses,
ye would have believed me:
for he wrote of me.

47  But if ye believe not his writings,
how shall ye believe my words?

[Full Court]

I find your assertion that the Church instructed the faithful that the Bible is "not to be trusted" and "not true" to be highly specious at best.

Then you can write the Bishops in question and tell them they are dead wrong.

[Full Court]

Answer the questions then, why did Jesus have to die if you Catholics can save yourselves through the sacraments.

[Conservative til I die]

Not to mention I love watching you present yourself as one who's obviously gone to finishing school on a pirate ship. That's half the fun.

Says the person who got banned within the last month.

[Conservative til I die]

Our Scriptures comprise 2/3's of your Bible, The title of this thread was too good to resist and I'm a former Catholic and Protestant. Too bad I'm out of popcorn.

Will Zoroastrianism be next?

[Conservative til I die]

The Roman Catholic church advances, supports and teaches evolution, which is at odss with God's Holy Word.

You're refuting a statement with another statement. Would you be kind enough to explain how the Catholic Church advances, supports, and especially how it teaches evolution?

Also, did God tell you that He is odds with evolution. By what authority do you say this?

[Cronos]

You, like all Protestants, Hi peg -- let's not resort to generalisations like tenn.

[Cronos]

I have been studying Catholic teachings for at least 20 years now.

Might I also ask which "Catholic teachings" you have read besides J Chick? have you read the Catechism of The Church?

The Bible also states that Jesus has brothers and sisters.

Ah, yes, another PERFECT example of ignorance of biblical culture and a reason why individual interpretation fails -- not due to lack of clariy in God's Word but in the shortcomings in all of us individual mortals.

you make the same error as tenns2005

In post # 741 you say "The fact of the matter is that the Bible is so straigntforward and understandable that to misunderstand it you must have the help of a Priest, Rabbi, or Preacher."

To which I said in post #769: "REally, then what was YOUR interpretation about Christ's "brothers and sisters"

Tenns #775: "Christ brothers and sisters were his half brothers and sisters. Is that hard for you to understand"

You never bothered to read my post number #603: "Exactly -- the problem with personal interpretation is that it is made without any background understanding -- so many readers of the Bible light on the verse "Jesus and His brothers and sisters" and say "AHA!! He HAD brothers and sisters -- perhaps they were born of Mary or just step-siblings" -- these people do not know that in the middle east and even in Greece it is common to call your cousins (first and second) your brothers and sisters"

This was in response to wmfights's #595 "This point is a perfect example of how different Christians and Catholics are. Christians will leave a church and form a new one, or join another denomination if they find doctrine contrary to SCRIPTURE"

[Cronos]

The Bible says that husband and wife do not keep themselves from each other, so therfore, Mary had sex with Joseph, since she was his wife.

oh, now you make an inference? You're guessing aren't you?

The OT also said not to eat pork so I guess in 2000 years there was never any Jew who ate pork ? I know what you'll say next: "oh, those weren't true jews" -- so you make more statements to support your false assumption

[Cronos]

The RCC teaches that if anyone claims that faith in Jesus Christ saves you then you are anethema, which I just spelled wrong, but you know what I mean.

Nope, that's what YOU say the RCC teaches.  You've created your own false slander against God's Church.  Congratulations.

[Cronos]

In fact, the modern Southern Baptist movement would be to my way of thinking part of the broad gate, yes.

Ok, so everyone except you have no idea about the Bible, I guess.  You are the sole interpreter of the Bible, eh?  Even though you get such simple things wrong as talking about Christ's brothers and sisters -- sheesh, it's such a simple proof that you, tenns and b's ideas about reading the Bible like a book and coming to your own childish conclusions (oh, and all us individual mortals are childish, me included).

Only a group of persons can even START to comprehend the enormity that is God.  That's why God left us a Church and why the early Christians prayed together and why the idea of the TRinity didn't get pieced completedly until the 4th century -- because it takes so many individual mortals to GET that idea.

[Cronos]

yes, actually. Don't really sleep more than 3 hours though. And remember -- InterDev is your friend -- just copy the silly posts there.

[Cronos]

I understand that to admit that the Lord could accomplish His will, reveal His Holy Word through Scripture, provide Salvation to His creation, guide His flock through the power of His Spirit, without the Roman Catholic Church is hard for you to grasp.

What about the other Churchs that make up the Catholic Church (btw there are 22 Churchs in the Catholic Church

Although it is not widely known in our Western world, the Catholic Church is actually a communion of Churches. According to the Constitution on the Church of the Second Vatican Council, Lumen Gentium, the Catholic Church is understood to be "a corporate body of Churches," united with the Pope of Rome, who serves as the guardian of unity (LG, no. 23). At present there are 22 Churches that comprise the Catholic Church. The new Code of Canon Law, promulgated by Pope John Paul II, uses the phrase "autonomous ritual Churches" to describe these various Churches (canon 112). Each Church has its own hierarchy, spirituality, and theological perspective. Because of the particularities of history, there is only one Western Catholic Church, while there are 22 Eastern Catholic Churches. The Western Church, known officially as the Latin Church, is the largest of the Catholic Churches. It is immediately subject to the Roman Pontiff as Patriarch of the West. The Eastern Catholic Churches are each led by a Patriarch, Major Archbishop, or Metropolitan, who governs their Church together with a synod of bishops. Through the Congregation for Oriental Churches, the Roman Pontiff works to assure the health and well-being of the Eastern Catholic Churches.

While this diversity within the one Catholic Church can appear confusing at first, it in no way compromises the Church's unity. In a certain sense, it is a reflection of the mystery of the Trinity. Just as God is three Persons, yet one God, so the Church is 22 Churches, yet one Church.

The Catechism of the Catholic Church summarizes this nicely:

"From the beginning, this one Church has been marked by a great diversity which comes from both the variety of God's gifts and the diversity of those who receive them... Holding a rightful place in the communion of the Church there are also particular Churches that retain their own traditions. The great richness of such diversity is not opposed to the Church's unity" (CCC no. 814).

Although there are 22 Churches, there are only eight "Rites" that are used among them. A Rite is a "liturgical, theological, spiritual and disciplinary patrimony," (Code of Canons of the Eastern Churches, canon 28). "Rite" best refers to the liturgical and disciplinary traditions used in celebrating the sacraments. Many Eastern Catholic Churches use the same Rite, although they are distinct autonomous Churches. For example, the Ukrainian Catholic Church and the Melkite Catholic Church are distinct Churches with their own hierarchies. Yet they both use the Byzantine Rite.

To learn more about the "two lungs" of the Catholic Church, visit this link:

CATHOLIC RITES AND CHURCHES

A Roman rite Catholic may attend any Eastern Catholic Liturgy and fulfill his of her obligations at any Eastern Catholic Parish. A Roman rite Catholic may join any Eastern Catholic Parish and receive any sacrament from an Eastern Catholic priest, since all belong to the Catholic Church as a whole.

[Cronos]

If I want to learn more of my faith, why should I go to a Catholic web site.

as cons pointed out -- you keep criticising what you think are Church teachings, but have no knowledge about it whatsoever, so before you make any more silly statements, READ.

[Cronos]

You cannot deny that when Israel walk righteously with the Lord we blessed them and when they did not he not only withdrew His favor but punished them.

Huh?  YOU blessed Israel?  Isn't that a little bit too much of deification?

[Cronos]

some of the statements ARE quite out there, aren't they?

[Cronos]

a former Catholic and Protestant

just curious -- are you a kabbalaist?

[Invincibly Ignorant]

just curious -- are you a kabbalaist?

Negative.

[Cronos]

I totally agree that Mary and Joseph knew each other in the Biblical sense. They had sex.

Yup, you guys were there to verify it, eh? Come on, how can you make such silly, easily refutable statements? Sheesh -- there are so many Protestants with sensible differences of opinion, but here all you put forth are unread opinions and guesses.