Are Catholics Born Again?

Catholic Educators ^ | Mark Brumley

[wmfights]

"It is worldly knowledge that gives us a foolish desire to rebel against God's will."
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Free will.

I can't believe that anyone who reads the Bible with an open heart and an open mind can walk away not being a believer, but it does happen.

[Forest Keeper]

Hope is not the same as assurance.

Oh, but it can be. You seem to rely on your interpretation of the meaning of the word "hope" being "something wished for but not certain". In my American Heritage Dictionary that is the first definition. However, succeeding definitions include: "To have confidence, trust ... A wish or desire accompanied by confident expectation of its fulfillment ... Trust in God's mercy, tempered by fear of divine justice."

The weakness of human fear does not alter the truth of the finality of salvation. Paul reveals his humanity. Certainty can be had if we apprehend it. As we are continually sanctified we apprehend the truth of God's promises to us and the fear falls away.

[Forest Keeper]

We are sealed with God's Holy Spirit which is our guarantee of our inheritance. It isn't anything that we do but it is everything that He has done. We do nothing but thank God for His grace.

Amen. In support I add the following: "When he had received the drink, Jesus said, 'It is finished.' With that, he bowed his head and gave up his spirit." (John 19:30). It is finished. The debt is paid in full with a receipt.

[PetroniusMaximus]

'It is finished.'

And at that point ALL our sins were still in the future.

[bremenboy]

1 Peter

21The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:


Baptism is the answer so what is the question?
how do you get a good conscience?

answer baptism

How?
Romans chapter 6 buried with him into his death
Jesus shed his blood at his death


a good conscience is a conscience without sin.

one should let the Bible interpret the Bible

Hebrews 9

14How much more shall the blood of Christ, who through the eternal Spirit offered himself without spot to God, purge your conscience from dead works to serve the living God?


how do you get a good conscience?

Hebrews 10


1For the law having a shadow of good things to come, and not the very image of the things, can never with those sacrifices which they offered year by year continually make the comers thereunto perfect.

2For then would they not have ceased to be offered? because that the worshippers once purged should have had no more conscience of sins.

[the old law was not perfect it could not take away sin and give them a good conscience}

3But in those sacrifices there is a remembrance again made of sins every year.

Hebrews 10:22
Let us draw near with a true heart in full assurance of faith, having our hearts sprinkled from an evil conscience, and our bodies washed with pure water.

how do you get a good conscience?


1 Peter


21The like figure whereunto even baptism doth also now save us (not the putting away of the filth of the flesh, but the answer of a good conscience toward God,) by the resurrection of Jesus Christ:


Was Paul sins taken away before or after baptism?

[jo kus]

Rom 6:20-23 For when you were slaves of sin, you were free in regard to righteousness. Therefore what benefit were you then deriving from the things of which you are now ashamed? For the outcome of those things is death. But now having been freed from sin and enslaved to God, you derive your benefit, resulting in sanctification, and the outcome, eternal life.

You are either a slave to sin or a slave to righteousness. You're not free to choose whether you want to be one or the other.

Read Romans 6 more carefully. It says "WHEN YOU WERE slaves"... We are no longer slaves to sin, once we are baptized into the Lord. We are slaves to the Lord. "NOW THAT YOU HAVE BEEN FREED"... we can choose the Lord.

Ugh. I hope I don't regret this post...

Regards

[jo kus]

does marriage continue after death? Is IT eternal?

No. At least that what Christ said to the Sadducees.

Regards

[Conservative til I die]

Blah blah blah. I grew up Catholic, spent 16 years in Catholic school and university, and was proudly Catholic for 32 years. NOT ONCE in all that time, did anyone ever explain to me how I could FOR SURE have eternal life.

Now I am a born again Christian, an adherent of the Reformed faith, and a disciple of Messiah Jesus.

SO basically you shopped around until you found a sect that told you what you wanted to hear. That's sure a way to finding the truth.

[Conservative til I die]

Personally, I find that most Catholics, including those with otherwise excellent Catholic educations, are surprisingly uninstructed when it comes to the Bible.

Let me guess. You've met about 5 Catholics in your life, never set foot in a Catholic Church, never attended Mass, never spoke to a priest, etc.

What you're really saying is that Catholics aren't buying the usual Protestant misinterpretations of the Bible and they really should.

[Conservative til I die]

Are you the same poster as gamarob1, who was thrown out of here last week for being one of the worst and most vicious bomb-throwers on the Religion forums?

[Conservative til I die]

The only "platform" that I have is that we are simply saved by God's grace and there is NOTHING that we do or will do to earn, maintain, entertain favor, or to cooperate-anything. It is a gift from God given by the Father to the Son to the praise of His glory.

So basically it's a gift forced upon us? I don't agree with this statement. A gift has to be accepted.

[Conservative til I die]

I look back now at my life and see the transforming power of the Holy Spirit that began working in my life from that moment. At the time I didn't realize what was happening, or how much I was changing. The "works" that I do today are to buy nothing. I do them out of a desire to please the LORD and be more Christlike in my daily life.

So you don't need to do anything since you one day found faith? So if you wanted to gamble and fornicate, that makes no difference in your salvation? If you say one with real faith will show works, well then we're just back to Catholic teaching.

[Conservative til I die]

I am discussing this on an orthodox forum and was wondering what the Catholic beleif is: does marriage continue after death? Is IT eternal?

No, which is why widowers can remarry but the divorced cannot (without the annulment of course).

[PetroniusMaximus]

"No, which is why widowers can remarry "


Very interesting... and insightful.

[HarleyD]

No one save you.

Eze 36:27 "I will put My Spirit within you and cause you to walk in My statutes, and you will be careful to observe My ordinances.

Joh 6:44 "No one can come to Me unless the Father who sent Me draws him; and I will raise him up on the last day.

[HarleyD]

"...we can choose the Lord."

Joh 6:65 And He was saying, "For this reason I have said to you, that no one can come to Me unless it has been granted him from the Father."

Psa 23:1-3 The LORD is my shepherd, I shall not want. He makes me lie down in green pastures; He leads me beside quiet waters. He restores my soul; He guides me in the paths of righteousness For His name's sake.

Is there a pattern here?

Joh 10:26-27 "But you do not believe because you are not of My sheep. My sheep hear My voice, and I know them, and they follow Me;"

There are God's sheep who He has choosen and there are those who are not His sheep. Our Lord Jesus takes care of His sheep and leads them in the paths of righteousness FOR HIS NAME'S SAKE.

Ugh. I hope I don't regret this post...

I hope we both don't. ;O)

[HarleyD]

So basically it's a gift forced upon us? I don't agree with this statement. A gift has to be accepted.

Rom 9:25-26 As He says also in Hosea, "I WILL CALL THOSE WHO WERE NOT MY PEOPLE, 'MY PEOPLE,' AND HER WHO WAS NOT BELOVED, 'BELOVED.'" "AND IT SHALL BE THAT IN THE PLACE WHERE IT WAS SAID TO THEM, 'YOU ARE NOT MY PEOPLE,' THERE THEY SHALL BE CALLED SONS OF THE LIVING GOD."

God does the calling. It is man's arrogance's to think he can refuse God.

Joh 6:37 "All that the Father gives Me will come to Me, and the one who comes to Me I will certainly not cast out.

We are given to the Son by the Father. The Son will not cast out those who the Father has given Him.

[jer33 3]

...bookmark

[madconservative]

I am not really sure why you have such a problem with positional sanctification. What about the atonement does not gel with this doctrine?
I was declared a sinner 2000 years ago, and Jesus substituted himself for me when it came to the punishment for that sin. As Christians, I think we can agree on that. The Bible says in Ephesians 1:7 - 2:7 that because of this substitution, and my belief in that, to God (who is outside of time) I am even now "seated in the heavenly realms in Christ". That is my "position" in Christ.

Another example is my previous "position", in sin, and in Spiritual separation from God. Substitution and separation both as a matter of terms imply a position.

So you can mock the phraseology if it makes you feel good, but I am not going to stop declaring what God has made available to US because you refuse to see it.

If it makes you feel better to use more mutually agreed upon phraseology, then feel free to use "Divine imputation of the righteousness of Christ" which a believer has access to. This is clearly not his own righteousness, and it is made possible because of the "Divine Imputation of Sin to the Lamb of God on the cross".

[madconservative]

" The engine (faith) may be the instrument that moves the car, but fuel (works) is what makes the engine an engine in the first place."

I truly appreciate your attempt to find mutually agreed upon middle ground (no sarcasm whatsoever). But your analogy falls short to the Protestant. A Protestant would agree that Faith is the engine, but Grace is the fuel, and our works are the emissions:) Unless by works as fuel, you refer to those of Christ.

God bless.