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To: Kolokotronis; annalex; Pyro7480
I would caution us in the use of the phrase "her death" because people do not understand the difference between the death of a saint and the death of the lost. For that reason we speak of the Dormition of Our Lady or the Dormition of St. Nicholas for that matter. The Falling-Asleep of the More Glorious than the Seraphim was far more than the death which I will one day die, though I may pray to die as holy and good a death as possible.

I am put in mind again of what a very holy Armenian hierarch related to me from one of their ancient antiphons: that when she drew her last breath on earth, she drew her first breath in heaven.

The dogmatic pronouncement on the Assumption of the Virgin makes no such judgement as to whether or not Our Lady died or not. It simply acknowledges that she was indeed taken body and soul to the Father. There has been a wealth of pious opinion in the Latin Church that she entered Paradise as Enoch did and as did St. Elijah. That these things are not known with certainty is the reason that the Assumption speaks as it does also allowing for belief in the death and burial of Our Lady and her rising 3 days later as some have maintained as well as other traditions whether in Ephesus or in Jerusalem.

85 posted on 08/02/2005 11:20:59 AM PDT by Siobhan ("Whenever you come to save Rome, make all the noise you want." -- Pius XII)
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To: Siobhan

But the encyclical itself speaks of Virgin Mary's death, albeit not pointedly, even though, of course, "dormition" is the proper term when referring to death of a saint. Do you consider the Orthodox icon showing Christ comforting Mary's separated soul, -- and hence Mary in the state of death, -- incompatible with the dogma of the Assumpion?


87 posted on 08/02/2005 11:29:43 AM PDT by annalex
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To: Siobhan; annalex

I certainly understood what you wrote. I also happen to share your belief on this matter. Yours too, Annalex. So far as I can see, at least as between the Latin Church and the Greek Church, the difference seems to lie in whether we call the Assumption theologoumenon or dogma, with the implications of each for the beliefs of the faithful (which are admittedly great but probably say more about the phronemas of the two Churches than anything else.)


93 posted on 08/02/2005 12:04:44 PM PDT by Kolokotronis (Christ is Risen, and you, o death, are annihilated!)
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