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Catholic conservatism on the rise as priest refuses funeral for 'sinner'
The Times ^ | 7/22/05 | Richard Owen

Posted on 07/21/2005 11:10:46 PM PDT by Crackingham

A parish priest has refused to give an Italian woman a Christian funeral because she had “lived in sin”. Father Giuseppe Mazzotta, parish priest at Marcellinara, near Catanzaro in Calabria, said that he had denied a Christian funeral to Maria Francesca Tallarico, who died of breast cancer at the age of 45, because she had lived with her partner but never married him. Her partner was separated and had an 11-year-old daughter.

“She lived with her lover, so she was a public sinner,” Father Mazzotta said. “I decided not to celebrate an official Mass for this woman, who was not in communion with the Church.”

Father Mazzotta said that he had performed the liturgy of absolution for the dead. He added that he was close to the dead woman’s family and had offered them “words of comfort”.

Father Antonio Sciortino, the Editor of Famiglia Cristiana, a popular Catholic magazine, accused Father Mazzotta of “excessive zeal”. Mario Paraboschi, a local councillor, said that he was perplexed. Father Mazzotta said that his action carried a message: “Marriage is a sacrament. We cannot simply pretend.”

The priest’s decision has underlined the growing power of conservative Catholicism in Italy. The liberal and secular Left is increasingly alarmed by the return to “Catholic values” in politics and everyday life, which has clear implications for the general election, due next May.

Yesterday Romano Prodi, the leader of the opposition Centre Left, who hopes to oust the ruling Centre-Right coalition of Silvio Berlusconi, came under fire from the Church and the Right for suggesting that he would follow “the French example” and recognise homosexual “civil unions” if he were returned to power.

Signor Prodi said that he would not go so far as Spain and legalise gay marriage, but Il Giornale, the conservative newspaper owned by the Berlusconi family, said that that was the logical next step.


TOPICS: Religion & Culture
KEYWORDS: catanzaro; catholic; dumbideas; funeral; funeralrite; goodpriest; italy; priest; rite; riteoffuneral
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To: eastsider

Too funny...


101 posted on 07/22/2005 1:35:08 PM PDT by milquetoastdog
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To: redgolum
From the Catechism of the Catholic Church:

2301 Autopsies can be morally permitted for legal inquests or scientific research. The free gift of organs after death is legitimate and can be meritorious.

The Church permits cremation, provided that it does not demonstrate a denial of faith in the resurrection of the body.93

93 Cf. CIC, can. 1176 § 3.

Canon Law

TITLE III: CHURCH FUNERALS

Can. 1176 ß1 Christ's faithful who have died are to be given a Church funeral according to the norms of law.

ß2 Church funerals are to be celebrated according to the norms of the liturgical books. In these funeral rites the Church prays for the spiritual support of the dead, it honors their bodies, and at the same time it brings to the living the comfort of hope.

ß3 The Church earnestly recommends that the pious custom of burial be retained; but it does not forbid cremation, unless this is chosen for reasons which are contrary to Christian teaching.

102 posted on 07/22/2005 1:56:09 PM PDT by A.A. Cunningham
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To: A CA Guy
Jesus established the Authority of the Church (leadership) himself here on earth, not only the Bible. So the other Christian faiths do well in accepting Jesus as their Lord and Savior for their salvation, but without the established authority of Christ, they are floating aimlessly in other ways...

Obviously as a Catholic that would be your belief. Protestants believe otherwise. I don't really want to restart the 100 Years War, I just wanted to clarify why a Catholic priest and a Baptist minister might treat the situation differently.

103 posted on 07/22/2005 2:25:15 PM PDT by Hugin
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To: TattooedUSAFConservative
Most Catholics are not very good with the Bible... Careful now.

TattooedUSAFCOnservative wrote:

Careful now.

Okay, I am the one not very good with the Bible...

I also suffer from foot in mouth disease at times.

104 posted on 07/22/2005 3:22:32 PM PDT by topher (God bless our troops and protect them)
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To: smpb

You made a good point about hilter and the mafioso. Seriously doubt that hitler would have asked for a Catholic funeral as he hated them as much as he hated the Jews. Have heard that hitler had Jewish back ground.


105 posted on 07/22/2005 3:37:10 PM PDT by tob2 (Old Fossil and Proud of It!)
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To: Conservative til I die

I think we probably agree on the wrongness of unrepetentant sin.


106 posted on 07/22/2005 3:37:31 PM PDT by k2blader (Was it wrong to kill Terri Shiavo? YES - 83.8%. FR Opinion Poll.)
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To: Conservative til I die

If a Catholic commits suicide, will he/she be able to receive a Catholic funeral?


107 posted on 07/22/2005 3:38:58 PM PDT by k2blader (Was it wrong to kill Terri Shiavo? YES - 83.8%. FR Opinion Poll.)
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To: Hugin

The Catholic view would be...

The Catholic Church is the Only True Church

"Whom do you say that I am? Simon Peter answered and said: Thou art Christ, the Son of the living God. And Jesus answering, said to him: Blessed art thou, Simon Bar-Jona: because flesh and blood hath not revealed it to thee, but my Father Who is in Heaven. And I say to thee: Thou art Peter; and upon this Rock I will build My Church, and the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it." (Matthew 16:16-18)

JESUS GIVES HIS AUTHORITY TO THE APOSTLES
"And Jesus coming, spoke to them, saying: All power is given to Me in Heaven and in earth. Going therefore, teach ye all nations; baptizing them in the name of the Father, and of the Son, and of the Holy Ghost. Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you: and behold I am with you all days, even to the consummation of the world." (Matthew 28:18-20)

Can you learn to save your soul just by reading the Bible?
No, because some of the things in the Bible can be misunderstood and because the Bible does not include everything that God taught.
"Understanding this first, that no prophecy of scripture is made by private interpretation." (2 Peter 1:20)


"As also in all his [St. Paul's] epistles, speaking in them of these things; in which are certain things hard to be understood, which the unlearned and unstable wrest [twist], as they do also the other scriptures, to their own destruction." (2 Peter 3:16)


What did Jesus do to make sure that His teaching would never be misunderstood?
He established a church.
"The house of God, which is the church of the living God, the pillar and ground of the truth." (1 Timothy 3:15)


When did Jesus establish His Church?
Over two thousand years ago.


How many churches did Jesus establish?
Only one.
"Upon this Rock I will build My church." (Matthew 16:18)


"There shall be one fold and one shepherd." (John 10:16)


How long did Jesus plan His Church to last?
Until the End of the World.
"I am with you all days, even to the consummation of the world." (Matthew 28:20)


How did Jesus establish His Church?
By giving His authority to the Apostles to rule and to teach.
"Teaching them to observe all things whatsoever I have commanded you." (Matthew 28:20)


Did the people have to obey the Apostles?
Yes, because they spoke with the authority of Jesus, and therefore, to disobey them would be a sin.
"He that heareth you, heareth Me; and he that despiseth you, despiseth Me; and he that despiseth Me, despiseth Him that sent Me." (Luke 10:16)


Did the authority of the Apostles die with them?
No, they handed down their authority to others, since Jesus instituted His Church to last until the end of the World.
Some of the men who received authority from the Apostles: Matthias (Acts 1:22), Paul and Barnabas (Acts 13:2), Timothy, Silas, Sylvanus, Titus, Luke, Mark (Acts 17:14; 2 Corinthians 1:19; 2 Timothy 14:11)


Which Church today has the same authority?
The Catholic Church, because it is the only Church established by Jesus Christ.


How do you know the Catholic Church is the only true church?
History shows that it is the only church that can be traced back to Christ.


Does everyone have to obey the Catholic Church?
Yes, because She alone has the authority of Jesus to rule and to teach.
To disobey the Catholic Church knowingly is just as much a sin as to disobey Jesus Christ or His Apostles.


Where did the Protestant churches come from?
They were established by men who had no authority to start churches of their own.


Who started the first Protestant church?
The first Protestant church was established less than 500 years ago in Germany by Martin Luther, in 1520.


Name the founders of other leading Protestant churches.
Name of church Founder When Where
Episcopalian King Henry VIII 1534 England
Presbyterian John Knox 1560 Scotland
Congregationalist Robert Browne 1583 England
Baptist John Smith 1600 Holland
Methodist John Wesley 1739 England
Adventist William Miller 1831 New York
Christian Scientist Mary Baker Eddy 1879 Massachusetts


PRACTICAL POINTS

A non-Catholic who suspects that the Catholic Church is the one true Church of God and does not investigate Her claims with a mind to join if Her claims prove to be true, cannot be saved, because outside of Christ's Mystical Body (the Catholic Church), there is no salvation.

You should try to bring others "to the knowledge of the Truth" (1 Timothy 2:4) by prudently suggesting that they take instructions in the True Religion.


108 posted on 07/22/2005 3:52:34 PM PDT by A CA Guy (God Bless America, God bless and keep safe our fighting men and women.)
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To: Crackingham

Praise the Lord, we have a Catholic Priest with backbone willing to defend Church teaching instead of trying to avoid it.

God Bless You, Father Giuseppe Mazzotta!

Pace e Bene.


109 posted on 07/22/2005 8:12:20 PM PDT by HighlyOpinionated (It translates as "72 raisins of startling white clarity" NOT 72 fair skinned maidens.)
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To: smpb; tob2
Should a mafioso who was an active and unrepentant criminal until hs death be given a Catholic funeral?

And they aren't given Catholic funerals or burials. There is a cemetery in New York called Sr. John the Baptist where many of them are buried. It is not consecreted ground and none of those mafioso were granted a funeral Mass.

110 posted on 07/22/2005 9:30:51 PM PDT by Desdemona (Music Librarian and provider of cucumber sandwiches, TTGC Ladies' Auxiliary. Hats required.)
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To: Rytwyng
I think you mean the books of Maccabees, not the book of Malachi. Maccabees is where praying for the dead is found. It's part of the Septuagint but not the Palestinian canon, which is why it's been controversial since St. Jerome's time.

Right. It is 2 Maccabees 12:38-46 (in particular).

But I also heard someone say that God is timeless. This is found in the burning bush where God tells Moses to tell the Hebrew people that God's name is "I AM". Also, I believe it is in the Gospel of John that Jesus says that before Moses, "I AM".

So God must take into account our prayers for someone who has died AFTER they have died. He knows what we will ask once we find out the person has died and also future prayers -- which can be applied to the Judgement at death.

We human beings have trouble with a concept that God knows what will happen, what has happened and what is happening.

So if one hundred thousand people cry out to God: "God do not let this soul go to hell", and they are faithful followers of God, then why should God not answer that prayer?

I think the first time I heard a sermon along these lines, I was confused and in disbelief, but, ironically, time has cured that and allowed understanding...

God is All Knowing, All Powerful, All Wise, and All loving, so maybe it is not so hard to understand if we God to be what He is, always will be, and always has been...

111 posted on 07/22/2005 9:36:29 PM PDT by topher (God bless our troops and protect them)
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To: Salvation
Hmmmm.

Though one might be denied a funeral Mass, there is nothing that says that such a person might not be enrolled for Masses for the dead or Memorial Masses at a Church.

I think in this case, those who saw this person living the way she did, it was an example of them "not to live that way".

One interesting question, which only the priest would know, is did she tried to receive the sacrament of the Last Rites, including confession. If it was known that she had not been to confession for years, and did not have the sacrament of Last Rites, then the priest was using his authority in a proper way to set an example.

In the Roman Catholic Church, a Pastor of a church is given the authority to decide issues. Even the local Bishop cannot override the Pastor. The Bishop would only be allowed to remove the Pastor and replace him (I learned this directly from Father John Corapi, S.O.L.T., at a private luncheon).

So the bottom line is we do not have the information that priest might have from the confessional (or lack thereof), or information about Last Rites.

Finally, we can all pray for such a person that God's mercy might grant her salvation, but at the same time, the bad example she lived must be shown in a serious light -- to help save others.

112 posted on 07/22/2005 10:03:12 PM PDT by topher (God bless our troops and protect them)
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To: Crackingham; NYer; little jeremiah; Salvation
An interesting story along these lines was the death experience of a mystic, which she told me personally.

She had had two miscarriages before giving birth to her second son -- so she had one boy (alive) and was delivering a second baby boy when she was clinically dead.

She states that she saw Jesus and Mary, and "Dawn" and "Angel" (her miscarried children). One of them said: "Mommie, go back, you have work to do on earth."

I guess the next thing she remembers is waking up in the hospital.

The point of the story is partly about the unborn, but about what might happen when we die, and our Judgement (and perhaps how fluid that can be can).

Please pray for the unborn!

113 posted on 07/22/2005 10:13:26 PM PDT by topher (God bless our troops and protect them)
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To: Desdemona
Thanks for the insight. Always thought those mafiosos were awfully hypocrites. And then those gaudy huge funeral wreaths....lol
114 posted on 07/23/2005 7:14:13 AM PDT by tob2 (Old Fossil and Proud of It!)
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To: hispanichoosier
" As an aside, I ask those of you who will shortly villify Karl Keating as a modernist to refrain from doing so"

You're really sticking your head above the trench here. I've got no particular horse in the Karl Keating race, but do you honestly think you can introduce an exemplar into a thread and not expect him/her/it to be held up to the light?

115 posted on 07/23/2005 12:15:42 PM PDT by Selous
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To: topher
A lesser story is that of Saint Padre Pio -- Italian monk and Priest who lived from 1887 to 1968. He once had a woman who asked about a countess or baroness who had died -- as he was known to have gifts about knowing spiritual things (he predicted to the Pope John Paul in the late 1940's that he would become Pope when the Polish priest visited him).

I have never heard that story before. Where did you read or hear about that?

116 posted on 07/23/2005 1:07:04 PM PDT by GipperGal
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To: NYer

That photo is amazing! He looks so life-like -- as if he were just sleeping.


117 posted on 07/23/2005 1:08:33 PM PDT by GipperGal
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To: GipperGal
Mary Pyle is interesting, though Padre Pio was prevented from writing, Mary Pyle was able to compile a number of stories of Padre Pio, and she was also fluent in a number of languages (she was tutored by Dr. Maria Montessori).

The story is from Mary's House by Dorothy M. Gaudiose. Unfortunately, it is an out-of-print book, but I was able to get a copy after I gave mine away (after quite a bit of searching).

The story is of a thirty-three year old baroness who jumped out a building. A woman visiting Mary Pyle received word of this via telephone (February 1962), and the next day, Helena, a friend of Mary Pyle, went to confession and asked about this. The woman (Helena) did not have the heart to tell the woman (Nancy) that the woman went straight to hell. But Mary Pyle convinced Helena to tell her. The woman (Nancy) was told, and she changed her life -- getting rid of her materialism and giving money to charity.

This is on pages 15-16 of that book (ISBN 0-8189-0646-4)

118 posted on 07/23/2005 1:48:45 PM PDT by topher (God bless our troops and protect them)
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To: topher
Actually, (and I'm sorry for being so obtuse in my original question) I was wondering where you heard the story about Padre Pio's prediction to Pope John Paul II? Is it in the same book?

But thanks for the story about Mary Pyle! I'll try an alibra search for the book.

119 posted on 07/23/2005 4:16:42 PM PDT by GipperGal
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To: GipperGal
I was wondering where you heard the story about Padre Pio's prediction to Pope John Paul II? Is it in the same book?

It is mentioned in that book, but also others. But they would have to be printed after Pope John Paul became pope.

The visit occurred in 1947 by the pope-to-be.

I know I have seen it other books, but I would have to research (I have about 7 to 8 books on Padre Pio).

120 posted on 07/23/2005 6:08:34 PM PDT by topher (God bless our troops and protect them)
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