Are We Punished For Adam's Sin?

CARM ^ | Matthew J. Slick

[P-Marlowe]

Are We Punished For Adam's Sin?

        Are we punished for Adam’s sin? Will God hold us accountable for what Adam did in the Garden of Eden? It doesn’t make sense that we should be punished for something we didn’t do. After all, we weren’t there in the Garden. We didn’t do anything. So, are we punished for Adam’s sin?
     The answer is yes and no.
     On one hand, we suffer the consequences of Adam's disobedience and have inherited a sinful nature from him (Rom. 5:12-23). The Bible states that ". . . through one man sin entered into the world, and death through sin, and so death spread to all men, because all sinned," (Rom. 5:12 - all Bible quotes are from the NASB). Adam sinned. We didn’t. He was in the Garden of Eden. We were not. When we face God on the day of judgment, the Lord won’t say to us, "Adam sinned, so you are going to pay for it." We are responsible for our own sins, not the sins of others. 

     On the other hand, we are affected by Adam’s sin. This is how. Before the fall, Adam was sinless, perfect, and good (Gen. 1:31). He had a ‘good’ nature. But, after the fall, he became a sinner. His nature was changed from ‘good’ to ‘bad.’ Since we are his children, we inherit his sinful nature (Rom. 5:12). In this sense, we suffer for what Adam did; that is, he caused his descendants to have sinful natures and all of us suffer because of it. This is called original sin. It means that we have inherited a sinful nature and that all of what we are as individuals (mind, body, soul, spirit, emotions, and thought) is touched by sin. But this does not mean that we are as sinful as we can be. After all, God has written His Law on our hearts (Rom. 1:19; 2:15).
     In addition, creation was also affected by the fall. God had given dominion of the world to Adam. Adam sinned and sin entered the "world" as it says in Romans 5:12. That means that death entered the world along with disease, pestilence, earthquakes, famine, etc. They all have their root in the fall. That is why the Bible states that creation is longing for its redemption (Rom. 8:18-22).

Different Views on Original Sin

Calvinism
     Generally speaking, the Calvinists maintain that the sin of Adam was imputed (made to count for) to the whole human race.  This is maintained largely in regard to the concept of Federal Headship.  This is  a theological term for one person representing another person or group. Consider Hebrews 7:7-10,

But without any dispute the lesser is blessed by the greater. ⁸And in this case mortal men receive tithes, but in that case one receives them, of whom it is witnessed that he lives on. ⁹And, so to speak, through Abraham even Levi, who received tithes, paid tithes, ¹⁰for he was still in the loins of his father when Melchizedek met him.

      Levi was a descendant of Abraham, but because he was still in the loins (seed) of his Father Abraham, when Abraham paid tithes to Melchizedek, Levi is said to have paid them also. The concept is that Abraham represented his descendants and the tithes were counted to Levi as well. 
     Therefore, if Adam's sin was imputed to his descendants, all of them are guilty of sin and justly deserve punishment.

Arminianism    
     Generally speaking, the Arminians maintain that we inherited a sin nature from Adam and sin due to that nature.  We are not guilty for Adam's sin and cannot be punished unless we actually sin.

     Whichever view or combination of these views you hold, we suffer for Adam’s sin by effect as well as nature.  We are sinners and live in a sinful world.  We are suffering the consequences of Adam’s sin.  We have our own sin to contend with because we are by nature, children of wrath (Eph. 2:3). We are sinners.

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Matthew J. Slick, 1996, 1997, 1998, 1999, 2000, 2001, 2002, 2003

 

[TeenagedConservative]

The Arminians are saying that Adam didn't hurt us at all. Adam could sin, but started out sinless. Saying the same of us and thus denying the need for Christ's death is wrong.

[Liberal Bob]

Are We Punished For Adam's Sin?

Yes and the punishment is death.

Gen 3:22 The Lord God said, "Since man has become like one of Us, knowing good and evil, he must not reach out, and also take from the tree of life, and eat, and live forever." 23 So the Lord God sent him away from the garden of Eden to work the ground from which he was taken. 24 He drove man out, and east of the garden of Eden He stationed cherubim with a flaming, whirling sword to guard the way to the tree of life.

[kosta50]

M. Slick: Are We Punished For Adam's Sin?

Liberal Bob: Yes and the punishment is death

The answer is No. God clearly stated that if they eat the fruit they will "surely die." Once they ate, they tarnished their pristine nature and decayed. It is not God who punishes us, but Eve who believed the Serpent, and Adam who believed Eve rather than God. Thus, they both separated themselves from God, not the other way around, and brought sin to all their generations, and with sin death. The disease is passed from generation to generation.

If God tells you not to touch live wires because you "will surely die" and you touch them and die, it is not His punishment, but the consequence of your disobedience.

If death were God's punishment, then God would be the author of sin. As Alexander Kalomiros says ("Rivers of Fire") Western theologies predominantly believe that "God considered all men guilty of Adam's sin and punished them by death, that is by cutting them away from Himself"

By extension, such view leads to a distorted conclusion that, ironically, our "salvation" means being "saved from the hands of God!"

[HarleyD]

Psa 51:5 "Behold, I was brought forth in iniquity, And in sin my mother conceived me."

[P-Marlowe]

Interesting perspective. Is that the "Orthodox" position of the Orthodox Church?

[thePilgrim]

Though, I normally like the stuff from CARM, the guy misses the boat a bit on this one. Some Calvinists are pure Federalists. And some are not. Federal Headship is not the only valid explaination of how the Original sin corrupted the Adamic race.

Here is a theological problem for you Colin. Nearly all Arminians deny the Federal Headship view of the Fall. They believe that it is not right for the First Adam to be the Federal, or legal, representative of the whole human race into sin. Unfortunately, if Federalism is wrong for the Fall, then Federalism is also wrong for the redemption of man. That means that it is not right for the Last Adam to be the Federal, or legal, representative of the whole human race out of sin.

IOW, it mocks the Atonement of Christ. Most Arminians simply reduce the Atonement to a view that Christ suffered for us and was not punished for us. This is called the Governmental view of the Atonement. Pastors who teach this view might be heard to say that "Christ's sacrifice enabled man to believe in God."

In the service of the Lord,
Christian.

[nickcarraway]

Because of Adam's sin, we have lost our inheritance.

[Liberal Bob]

The answer is No. God clearly stated that if they eat the fruit they will "surely die." Once they ate, they tarnished their pristine nature and decayed. It is not God who punishes us, but Eve who believed the Serpent, and Adam who believed Eve rather than God. Thus, they both separated themselves from God, not the other way around, and brought sin to all their generations, and with sin death. The disease is passed from generation to generation. If God tells you not to touch live wires because you "will surely die" and you touch them and die, it is not His punishment, but the consequence of your disobedience. If death were God's punishment, then God would be the author of sin. As Alexander Kalomiros says ("Rivers of Fire") Western theologies predominantly believe that "God considered all men guilty of Adam's sin and punished them by death, that is by cutting them away from Himself" By extension, such view leads to a distorted conclusion that, ironically, our "salvation" means being "saved from the hands of God!"

Rom 5:9

Much more then, being now justified by his blood, we shall be saved from wrath through him.

Rom 5:10

For if, when we were enemies, we were reconciled to God by the death of his Son, much more, being reconciled, we shall be saved by his life.

Rom 5:11

And not only [so], but we also joy in God through our Lord Jesus Christ, by whom we have now received the atonement.

Rom 5:12

Wherefore, as by one man sin entered into the world, and death by sin;and so death passed upon all men, for that all have sinned:

Rom 5:13

(For until the law sin was in the world: but sin is not imputed when there is no law.

Rom 5:14

Nevertheless death reigned from Adam to Moses, even over them that had not sinned after the similitude of Adam's transgression, who is the figure of him that was to come.

Rom 5:15

But not as the offence, so also [is] the free gift. For if through the offence of one many be dead, much more the grace of God, and the gift by grace, [which is] by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.

For if through the offence of one many be dead

For if through the offence of one many be dead

For if through the offence of one many be dead

by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.

by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.

by one man, Jesus Christ, hath abounded unto many.

You get it?

[P-Marlowe]

Unfortunately, if Federalism is wrong for the Fall, then Federalism is also wrong for the redemption of man. That means that it is not right for the Last Adam to be the Federal, or legal, representative of the whole human race out of sin.

Good point.

However, if you take a federalistic approach to the issue, then man could not be punished even for his own sins after Christ's sacrifice. Since Christ's blood was intended to cover all the sins of all to whom it applies, then all who inherited Adam's sin would be forgiven of all their own sins as well. IOW since the stain of adam's sin damned all men, the stain of christ's blood would redeem all men.

So the federalist approach would likewise argue for unlimited atonement at the least and universal redemption at most.

[thePilgrim]

If that was the Federal Headship view, then you might have an argument. It is not.

Federalism teaches that the First Adam represented the entire human race.
Federalism also teaches that the Last Adam represented all whom the Father gave the Son ultimately. I use that word or a reason which is way beyond this 100 word explaination. The reason can be found in 1 John 2.

In plain language, the High Priest entered the holiest with 12 names upon His chest. It is for those that he makes intercession with the Father.

Christian.

[RnMomof7]

I hold both the federal view and the seminal view .I believe they are both consistent with scripture.

The principle of imputation is taught throughout scripture.

We see in scripture that Levi paid tithes to Melchizedek through Abraham generations before Levi was even born. Just as we are taught Levi was in the body of his ancestor Abraham before Levi was born, so all men were in the body of Adam before the birth of one single baby"

Hbr 7:5 And verily they that are of the sons of Levi, who receive the office of the priesthood, have a commandment to take tithes of the people according to the law, that is, of their brethren, though they come out of the loins of Abraham:



Hbr 7:9 And as I may so say, Levi also, who receiveth tithes, payed tithes in Abraham.


Hbr 7:10 For he was yet in the loins of his father, when Melchisedec met him.


Hbr 7:11 If therefore perfection were by the Levitical priesthood, (for under it the people received the law,) what further need [was there] that another priest should rise after the order of Melchisedec, and not be called after the order of Aaron?

The act of imputation places each of us in the garden reaching for that fruit. We are born with the imputed sin of Adam and born again having the imputed righteousness of the second Adam , Christ.

[suzyjaruki]

It is for those that he makes intercession with the Father.

Are you saying that it is probable that the atonement was particular because the intercession is particular? In other words, why would Jesus die for all the sins of everyone and then not intercede for everyone?

[P-Marlowe]

The Arminians are saying that Adam didn't hurt us at all.

I don't think they are saying that. And you won't find any Arminian denying the need for Christ's death.

Welcome to Free Republic.

[newberger]

Interesting perspective. Is that the "Orthodox" position of the Orthodox Church?

Yes, Adam's sin affects us. We are born fallen but, we are not born guilty.

Rom 6:23 "The wages of sin is death" does not mean that God kills us for sinning. It means that SIN KILLS!

Thus, although we admit that guilt and forgiveness are a big issue in our relationship with God, we view the Cross more in terms of a "military rescue mission", the defeat of death and hell, rather than in forensic / punishment terms.

[PetroniusMaximus]

*** It is not God who punishes us***

The buck stops with God. There is no getting around it.

God set up the test. God established the punishment. God executed the sentence. God is NEVER the passive one in any Biblical story.




*** If death were God's punishment, then God would be the author of sin.***

Holiness strikes out at sin by nature. It is only the covering of Christ that turns away wrath. Study the wrath of God in the OT.





***By extension, such view leads to a distorted conclusion that, ironically, our "salvation" means being "saved from the hands of God!"***

Problem with that is that this is Biblical truth. We are saved by Christ's death from hell. Hell is the eternal expression of God's anger with sin.

When Paul wrote the the Thessalonians...

"how you turned to God from idols to serve the living and true God, and to wait for his Son from heaven, whom he raised from the dead, Jesus who delivers us from the wrath to come."

...who's "wrath" is he referring to?

God's wrath. Jesus delivers us from God's wrath.

Jesus saves us from what is ultimately the most dangerous thing in the universe - the holy anger of the living God.

Your thoughts?

[PetroniusMaximus]

***The wages of sin is death" does not mean that God kills us for sinning. It means that SIN KILLS***

Isn't that a bit like saying "guns kill"?

[newberger]

Isn't that a bit like saying "guns kill"?

No. It's more like saying smoking kills or alcohol abuse kills.

It means that death is the natural result of sin. After all, God tells us what to do because his commands are in accord with our created nature. Doing the opposite is contrary to our nature and leads to death.

[Arioch7]

The only thought that I have is your post is very cool.

Kudos!

Arioch7 out.

[TeenagedConservative]

I don't think they are saying that. And you won't find any Arminian denying the need for Christ's death.

Trust me, I've debated literally dozens of Arminians. I have forced several to admit that they are teaching works religion, one had no problem conceding that he was a Pelegian.