Hail Mary

....In a shift whose ideological breadth is unusual in the fragmented Protestant world, a long-standing wall around Mary appears to be eroding. It is not that Protestants are converting to Catholicism's dramatic exaltation: the singing of Salve Regina, the Rosary's Marian Mysteries, the entreaty to her in the Hail Mary to "pray for us sinners now and at the hour of our death." Rather, a growing number of Christian thinkers who are neither Catholic nor Eastern Orthodox (another branch of faith to which Mary is central) have concluded that their various traditions have shortchanged her in the very arena in which Protestantism most prides itself: the careful and full reading of Scripture.

Arguments on the Virgin's behalf have appeared in a flurry of scholarly essays and popular articles, on the covers of the usually conservative Christianity Today (headline: The Blessed Evangelical Mary) and the usually liberal Christian Century (St. Mary for protestants). They are being preached, if not yet in many churches then in a denominational cross section—and not just at modest addresses like Maguire's in Xenia but also from mighty pulpits like that at Chicago's Fourth Presbyterian Church, where longtime senior pastor John Buchanan recently delivered a major message on the Virgin ending with the words "Hail Mary ... Blessed are you among us all."

This could probably not have happened at some other time. Robert Jenson, author of the respected text Systematic Theology, chuckles when asked whether the pastor of his Lutheran youth would have approved of his (fairly extreme) position that Protestants, like Catholics, should pray for Mary's intercession. "My pastor would have been horrified," he says, adding, "The pastor was my father." Yet today Catholics and Protestants feel freer to explore each other's beliefs and practices. Feminism has encouraged popular speculations on the lives of female biblical figures and the role of the divine feminine (think The Red Tent and The Da Vinci Code). A growing interest, on both the Protestant right and left, in practices and texts from Christianity's first 1,500 years has led to immersion in the habitual Marianism of the early and medieval church. And the influx of millions of Hispanic immigrants from Catholic cultures into American Protestantism may eventually accelerate progress toward a pro-Marian tipping point—on whose other side may lie changes not just in sermon topic but in liturgy, personal piety and a re-evaluation of the actual messages of the Reformation.

The movement is not yet prevalent in the pews. And it has its critics. While granting that Mary shows up more in the New Testament than some churches recognize, Albert Mohler, president of the Southern Baptist Convention's Southern Seminary, charges that those who use her full record to justify new "theological constructions" around her are guilty of "overreaching," "wishful thinking" and effectively "flirting with Catholic devotion." Yet Lutheran theologian Carl Braaten, co-editor of an essay collection on what might be called Marian upgrade, claims, "We don't have to go back to Catholicism. We can go back to our own roots and sources. It could be done without shocking the congregation. I can't predict how exactly it will happen. Some of it will be good, and some of it may be bad.

The author credits feminism, The Red Tent and the DaVinci code. Hmmmmmm? If there is a realization on the part of Protestants that they have short changed the Blessed Mother of our Lord I doubt these are the reasons. All Protestants have to do is read Martin Luther, he was very devoted to the Blessed Mother. Oh, reading the Bible might help too, but the Protestants who most despise giving any credit to the Blessed Mother usually only read their Bible in a spotty sort of way throwing out the parts that don't agree with their view of what God should be.

"You need to read the passages in the Bible that speak of ALL humanity being totally depraved and in need of the perfect Savior.
No one is perfect...not one...not ever. Only Christ."

So where does the Church teach that Mary didn't need to be saved? Can't a person be saved from something before it even happens? Example: Say there is a big pit with a lion in the bottom of it. If I stop you from falling into the pit, haven't I saved you, although you had not fallen into it yet? That is the same concept with the Immaculate Conception.

Regards

"It is not clear at all that God made Mary sinless. This is preposterous."

The Bible itself alludes to a comparison between the Ark in the OT and the "Ark" in the NT, Mary.

This is most explicit at the end of Revelation 11 into 12. Remember, there were no chapter separation when Revelation was written. You have the Ark at the end of 11, then the Mother of our Lord in 12. Yes, it refers to Israel, in the metaphoric sense, but to Mary in the literal sense - who actually gave birth to Him?
What did the Ark of the OT contain? The manna, Aaron's staff, and the Ten Commandments (according to Hebrews).
What did the Ark of the NT contain? The Bread from Heaven, the High Priest, and the Word (Law) of God Himself. Who else, then, is the true Ark - Mary.

Considering God had fashioned the Ark (directed the Hebrews how it was to be built, etc.), we consider that God would fashion the Ark of the NT that would carry His son in the same manner - pure and uncorrupted (sinless).

The Church Fathers see this quickly, as well as the idea that if Jesus is the New Adam, Mary is the New Eve. Since both Adam and Eve were involved in our fall, the Church reasoned that somehow, Jesus and Mary were involved in our redemption. Only Adam could condemn us, but Eve was not a simple bystander. Only Jesus could save us, but Mary was not a simple bystander. Ireneaus especially details this comparison. And Gen 3:15 say they both will be involved. This leads us to the term co-redemptrix. It doesn't mean that Jesus couldn't save us without Mary; it means He CHOSE to save us WITH her. (when you love, you share with others)

A helpful analogy of co-redemptrix -

A mother and her little daughter set out to make cookies. The mother "allows" the daughter to help prepare the dough and place the dough on the cookie sheet. The mother is really doing the work, but, out of love, she "allows" her daughter to help, even if the smallest manner. Strictly speaking, the mother made the cookies - who needs a 3 year old to make cookies - but out of love for her daughter, she allows the child to help her, to spend time with her daughter, etc. And when the daughter says "Daddy, I helped Mom make the cookies today", does the Mom get up, flabbergasted and disgusted with her daughter's usurping and overplaying her role, yell at her daughter "I MADE THE COOKIES, HOW DARE YOU TAKE AWAY FROM ME WHAT IS MINE!!!"

Same concept with God and the co-redemptrix.

By the way, Scripture has several verses that point to this concept - James 5:20, "Let him know, that he which converteth the sinner from the error of his way shall save a soul from death, and shall hide a multitude of sins." or Colossians 1:24, "Who now rejoice in my sufferings for you, and fill up that which is behind of the afflictions of Christ in my flesh for his body's sake, which is the church"
There are others, but this is sufficient for now.

Regards

The canon wasn't closed until after 400. And, BTW, Catholics and Orthodox use all the books that the Jews use - including the ones that Luther removed.

The Jews don't list the Apocrypha (or Deturocanon) as canon. It is part of tradition, but not canon. Many back then (and today) say that those books were brought in when the LXX was translated. That is why Jerome didn't want to include them in the Vulgate at first, there were not in Hebrew, but in Greek. In most European Lutheran bibles, the Apocrypha is in a separate section in the back or between the OT and NT. In the US, the old German Bibles did have them in them (my grandfathers did) but after WWII the Lutheran Churches no longer used German and shifted to a regularly available KJV/RSV.

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