The Pink Elephant in the Church

The Remnant ^ | 3/8/2005 | Fr. Charles Dahlby

[SkyPilot]

Sir,

May I say I admire you, and your choice to serve God.

What you wrote is very inspiring, and I pray it is as so.

Be true to the Word of God. Do as Christ would do in all circumstances, and you will always be in the satisfaction of God in heaven.

I don't know the current status of leadership, nor their character. I do know something about their character of the last few years, and it is abysmal. But don't take my observations as an indictment against what you are charged to do, by God Himself. Spread the Good News that Christ died for us sinners, and without that gift, we all deserve Hell.

Be strong in the face of the homosexuals in the clergy, for there are many in the church. Some are good men despite their sin---they help others and try. We are all sinners after all. But some are evil, and their lusts control them and their every action to the point of mania, and you will never find a more addicted group of human beings on the planet. Don't hold church leadership as your final authority----hold up Christ, the Lord. If you do that, you will not fail.

[vox_freedom]

The worst sins in the Catholic homosexual abuse scandal were not the sins of priests against the innocents -- as absolutely horrible, indeed diabolically evil as those were -- but the enabling bishops and others who knew these abuses were going on, but instead they chose to tolerate, hide, cover up, and ignore the acts of perpetrators. Unfortunately the trail leads all the way to Rome, where many victims, and supportive family and friends, appealed to urge intervention, recognition, and remedies. For the most part these appeals were met with silence or referral directly back to those who were doing the enabling.
Thanks for the Michael Davies position statement on obedience. He stated this important clarification on many occasions so that people would realize that the saving of souls is our most important role and we have an overiding responsibility to protect and promulgate the faith, and the Truth of God's law, even if it diverts from those who direct us to stand for Communion or those who neglect fasting during Lent, or other transgressions great and small.

[sockmonkey]

Now the priesthood has come to be considered the primary “gay profession.” We are the butt of jokes and presented as a pathetic caricature in the media.

Last night Jay Leno did a joke:
What did the Priest say to Michael Jackson?
I saw him first.

[SausageDog]

"Some are quite unwilling to admit, even to themselves, that an occasion could ever arise when a Catholic should justifiably refuse obedience to the Sovereign Pontiff. However sincere such people may be, they display a lamentable ignorance of Church history and Catholic theology."

Translation: "We schismatics are in the right!"

[narses]

That says so much. If I didn't know your posting history, I'd be angry at the anti-Catholic slur. As I do, I am angry at the freaking queers who have so harmed our Holy Mother the Church as to make your post understandable.

[ultima ratio]

We traditionalists are in the right, but we are not schizmatics. Your problem is you can't tell the difference since you don't know what Catholicism is in the first place.

[TAdams8591]

"So the real issue is – HOMOSEXUALS IN THE PRIESTHOOD! The solution is – GET THEM OUT!"

Agreed.

[grame]

universities, news rooms, ballet classes, floral shops..... don't forget gov't.

[grame]

AMEN

[SkyPilot]

"So the real issue is – HOMOSEXUALS IN THE PRIESTHOOD! The solution is – GET THEM OUT!" Agreed.

This will never happen. During the scandal's media zenith in 2002-03, hundreds of homosexual priests held meetings in Chicago, Boston, and Dublin. They were terribly afraid they would be defrocked, and cut off from the church. The truth of homosexuality in the ranks had finally been exposed to the light of day. If Rome was going to take action, 2002-03 would have been the years it would have done so.

The main pretext against defrocking homosexuals in the priesthood is a circuitous argument of the innate problem:

-there are too many of them in the ranks

countered with....

- there are so many homosexuals in the ranks that the Catholic Church cannot survive if she ousts them

The church must decide if the scripture in Leviticus and Romans is the Word of God concerning homosexuality. Further, it must decide if the dictum in Timothy concerning leaders is valid (and it is valid). Only then will it solve this crisis.

[Piers-the-Ploughman]

excellent post, Michael Davies was not a loose cannon or baiter, his writings are great for the forum

[Piers-the-Ploughman]

Greek Orthodox are schismatics, recognizing not the pope.
There are traditionalists who recognize the Pope but can not cooperate with heretical blasphemous bishops he has appointed. It's at least a little bit different, if not significantly so, than the Greek Orthodox, who completely reject the pope in theory and practice. If non-traditional orthodox Catholics can say so many nice things about Lutheran religion, Buddhism, etc, so many of whose adherents are probably going to Heaven also, according to Walter Kasper, then how much more should they have some charity for traditional Catholics who are in about 99.8% agreement with them on doctrinal issues

[sockmonkey]

That says so much. If I didn't know your posting history, I'd be angry at the anti-Catholic slur. As I do, I am angry at the freaking queers who have so harmed our Holy Mother the Church as to make your post understandable.

When I heard Leno tell the joke, I was shocked, then I realized there is a reason that people make jokes like that- because sadly, there is some truth in there.

[Aliska]

and homosexuals have flocked into the Church.

Most of them seem to have been cradle catholics. Nobody has addressed this issue headon because they would rather dance around the matter. "Flocking" into the church implies converts. I don't know of one abusing priest who was exposed who was a convert but rather was born into the church. There are no doubt some converts who are homosexual who become priests, but as of now, they seem to be an insignificant number compared to cradle catholic homosexuals who are attracted/recruited into the priesthood.

Why do so many catholics, supposedly the One True Church, become homosexual in the first place (apart from the ones seduced into that lifestyle by errant priests, etc.)?

This author is SSPX? What is the percentage of SSPX homosexuals compared to NO homosexuals? Or do SSPX make sure theirs stay in the closet?

It does seem that homosexual predators in the prieshood have brought this down on all of us. I know I'm asking some hard questions that demand some hard answers. Maybe there aren't any answers.

Is it possible that it has been this way for centuries and is only now coming to light because the catholic hierarchy is no longer able to cover up because of the modern media and the way news gets around the globe now?

I do admire that Father Doyle, and it seems that he has been punished for taking the stand he did. I also do not hate homosexuals, but my preference is not to be ministered to by a sexually active homosexual priest, of which I have little way of knowing or choice in the matter. Other than that, I tend to feel some empathy for their condition and try to be tolerant of them in society. I don't care for the activist ones pushing their agenda down our throats and who are intolerant of anyone who gets in their way.

The other agonizing question is what if I found out that some of the priests who have been helpful and kind to me turn out to have been homosexuals? Some (I suspect) heterosexual priests can be pretty rough on you in ways totally uncalled for and can treat you in a very un-Christianlike manner.

I wouldn't bring any of this up, but I have privately agonized over this very thing for years and it isn't anything you can talk to ANYONE about in my real world.

[Tantumergo]

"The worst sins in the Catholic homosexual abuse scandal were not the sins of priests against the innocents -- as absolutely horrible, indeed diabolically evil as those were -- but the enabling bishops and others who knew these abuses were going on, but instead they chose to tolerate, hide, cover up, and ignore the acts of perpetrators."

I agree with you that very often the bishops have been more culpable than the sick individuals under their charge. However, the connivance in this sin hasn't just been in the hierarchy - the whole Church, including the laity, have been giving these perverts a pass for far too long.

How many parents have also attempted to cover up the sins of priests when they found out their sons had been abused? There has been a case in our diocese where the bishop wanted the parents to go to the police and press charges - to have the priest tried and sentenced - but they refused. They just wanted it hushed up, they didn't want to create a fuss or a scandal. They didn't want other people in their parish to think badly of them for accusing their priest of these crimes. They didn't give a damn whether the priest might be transferred elsewhere so that he could prey on other boys.

We have a culture of placing our priests on such pedestals that many people will stick by them and excuse their crimes simply because they are priests. This "Father can do no wrong" syndrome is what has given the homosexuals and their supportive bishops so much cover to hide in.

It is an idolatry of the clergy which many Catholics extend in more extreme forms to the Pope - hear no evil, see no evil, speak no evil. The only good thing I can see coming out of these scandals is if more Catholics learn that we must "Obey God and not men". Fidelity to God's law and the Faith must always come before obedience to corrupt shepherds.

Ideally there should be no distinction between the two, but increasingly we will have to make that choice for the sake of our own salvation and that of our children.

[Tantumergo]

"As a young man applying for acceptance in the local seminary, I have to say that the seminarians I have encountered have been nothing if not orthodox and devout."

May God bless you with wisdom and discernment. I hope you also do a lot of research into the seminary staff and the diocesan vocations people.

I pray to God that its a seminary which turns out priests and not psychologists!

[Grey Ghost II]

This author is SSPX? What is the percentage of SSPX homosexuals compared to NO homosexuals? Or do SSPX make sure theirs stay in the closet?

No, Fr. Charles Dahlby is not SSPX.

[Aliska]

Thanks. It looks like he is a priest at St. Rita Catholic Church and St. Mary Church in central Illinois, also published by rcf.org and catholiccitizens.org.

Here is another good article by him:

The Church and the Press: Shooting the Messenger