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To: Lilllabettt
But the Lord is saying :verily, verily you'd better do this. I suppose, if my Protestant father tells Jesus, "There was a misunderstanding, I did what I thought you always wanted" then that will be good enough. But clearly, its rather important that we know what it is He wants us to do.

Being in a Catholic box as you are, you have been trained to only look at the "eat my flesh and drink my blood" part of John 6, but being non-denominational, I kept reading and I noticed that many of the disciples left at that point.

V-60 Many therefore of his disciples, when they had heard this, said, This is an hard saying; who can hear it?

They were kosher eating Jews, who were not permitted to eat human flesh, or drink blood of any kind, and they lacked faith in Jesus that he would show them a way.

The remaining disciples didn’t understand it either, but they had faith he wouldn’t require them to do anything that was cannibalistic, or against the Law of Moses.

By Jesus telling all the disciples that they would have no life in them unless they ate his flesh and drank his blood, he thinned out his followers to just those who had complete faith in him.

Something similar to this had happened back in Genesis 22:2, when God commanded Abraham to murder his only son, and Abraham knew this would be a sin, but he also trusted God more then his fear of disobeying Him, so God had to step in and provide Abraham with another sacrifice, a ram.

For the disciples who remained, this was a test of their faith, would they have actually eaten his flesh, and drank his blood had he offered it to them literally?

Would Abraham have actually killed his son?

We’ll never know, because in both cases when God asked man to obey Him by sinning, He also provided them with a way out.

Jesus explained it to the disciples in verse 63.

Jn 6:63-64 It is the spirit that quickeneth; the flesh profiteth nothing: the words that I speak unto you, they are spirit, and they are life. But there are some of you that believe not. For Jesus knew from the beginning who they were that believed not, and who should betray him.

Notice Jesus now finished explaining to the disciples how this would be possible. He said, “ the words I speak to you they are spirit, and they are life.”

What words?
Eat my flesh and drink my blood.
What did he say these words were?
Spirit. (not literal)

What do his words do?
They give life. (His words, not his flesh)

Is this spirit that gives life mentioned anywhere else?

Romans 8:11 But if the Spirit of him that raised up Jesus from the dead dwell in you, he that raised up Christ from the dead shall also quicken your mortal bodies by his Spirit that dwelleth in you.

When the day finally came, and Jesus broke the bread and drank from the cup, did he have to prepare the disciples for what they were about to do, eat his flesh, and drink his blood? No, this never entered their minds, because they understood that it was the spirit of the symbol, not the flesh of the act.

When Paul dealt with the Corinthians on the matter of The Lords Supper, he said nothing to prepare them for literally eating Christ flesh and blood.

A lot of the Pagan Gentiles drank blood before they became believers, and were condemned for it by the apostles, and in Acts 15, James told them….That ye abstain from meats offered to idols, and from blood,

Now wouldn’t that have been nice if Paul had then said, forget what we told you about drinking blood, because to keep the Lords Supper it’s commanded you eat human flesh and drink human blood. :)

JH :)

176 posted on 11/22/2004 4:13:02 PM PST by JHavard
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To: JHavard
You have a very good strategy, but I do not wish to debate the Real Presence.

The vibe I am getting here is that if any idiot would just read the whole Bible, in context, without wearing blinders or ideological glasses, then that person would reject the Eucharist.

Now, apparently my irreligious, but vaguely Catholic background disqualifies me and traps me in 'the Catholic box.' But I really have to insist that some people, who, with a clean slate, read the whole Bible, in context, do in fact accept the Eucharist.

Two equally intelligent people can read the whole Bible ( in context!) without bringing any theological baggage with them, and pray and meditate, and still come to different conclusions about this central issue. So why is one private interpretation better than the other?
183 posted on 11/23/2004 8:52:25 AM PST by Lilllabettt
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