I can trace the history of my church from Pope John Paul II all the way back to St. Peter, the one Christ gave the keys to the kingdom of heaven to.
You mean you can trace names back to Peter with a little imagination, but you can’t trace the church, the Ekklesia, because it ceased to be when your people went against the command of God and turned it into a political organization. See Matthew 21:25-26
God hears our individual prayers from all over the world, and He sees us who truly believe as His church. Remember what He said, He no longer dwells in temple’s made by hands as he did once a year with Israel.
There is no more one single Church organization that represents God since He dwells within us. We as individuals may attend services in a building, but that doesn’t make the building the Church, it’s still simply a building made by human hands.
Gods church can not have a name, because that would allow anyone whom attends it to call himself by that name, which would not tell you a thing about their relationship with God. Even if you named a Church, “The Church of Gods Believers,” it would still tell you nothing about those who attended.
Gods church is made up of His believers, so everyone in it has to be of God, unless your going to say that everyone who calls themselves Catholic, are saved, and of God. If just one of them are not of God, then it cannot be called Gods true church, for only He knows those who are His.
The church does not take priority over the Bible - it never has. I submit that it is the mis-interpretations of solo scriptura folks that have such conclusions.
If the Bible condemns something, and you ignore and circumvent it by calling it a rich tradition, then you are giving tradition priority over Gods written command.
In my previous post to you, I stated that seven of the early church fathers from 100 to 450ad, believed in Sola Scriptura, and you responded to it by posting the life of Augustine.
I don’t get it? I didn’t question his sincerity, but I would like you to respond to the fact they believed the Bible was sole authority.
JH :)
You mean you can trace names back to Peter with a little imagination, but you can’t trace the church, the Ekklesia, because it ceased to be when your people went against the command of God and turned it into a political organization. See Matthew 21:25-26 Not so, we can trace the Pope, Christ's visible head on earth, all the way back to St. Peter the Rock - upon whom Christ built His Church, of which the gates of hell will not prevail against and will remain till the end of time - either that or Christ never made such a statement.
I don’t get it? I didn’t question his sincerity, but I would like you to respond to the fact they believed the Bible was sole authority.
They did not believe that the Bible was "sole" authority, thats why they became models and authorities in the RCC.
Here is what Saint Augustine says regarding your claim that they believed the Bible was the sole authority, using Mat. 4:6, He says: "Heretics quote Scriptures as the devil does here, in a wrong and forced sense. The Church cites them, like Jesus Christ, in their true sense and to confute their falsehood."
It is on this account, that the Catholic Church wishes persons to come to the study of the most mysterious and difficult book ever published, should bring with them some preparations of mind and heart, convinced that the abuse of the strongest and best food may be converted into deadly poison."
Using Luke 4:10, The Church says: We have the devil here again citing scripture, which shows how very dangerous a thing it is to put the Scripture, in the first instance, indiscriminately into every, even the most illiterate person's hands, without any previous disposition of the mind and heart, by study and prayer. How much more satisfactory must it be to be guided by the church of God, which Christ has promised to secure against all error, and which He comands all to obey.