The Rapture Theory: It's Surprising Origin

askelm.com ^ | March 30, 2003 | Ernest L. Martin

[P-Marlowe]

You know one of the main reasons why no one ever thought that the church would be raptured was that Israel had ceased to exist before the New Testament Cannon had been completed. So most theologians thought, incorrectly, that the Church had replaced Israel and that the prophecies in Revelation had somehow symbolically taken place in 70 AD.

But Israel, as promised by God, has been restored. The time of the Gentiles is almost complete. The rapture is therefore imminent. The Rapture idea is clearly stated in Thessalonians. The Church is clearly taken out of the picture in Revelation Chapter 3 and does not appear again until his Golorious Appearing. God will deal with Israel during the period in between.

The bottom line is that you don't have to believe in the rapture for it to happen. And its going to happen. You will believe it when it happens. It probably won't go down like Tim LaHaye thinks it will. But it will go down. Or up, actually.

[Destro]

Criticism of the rapture are usually based on the idea that it is a relatively new theory in the history of Christian belief, and also on the principle that anyone left behind who had knowledge of the theory but didn't believe in Christ would essentially have full proof to be convinced of the necessity of believing and thus everyone left behind would essentially be forced to believe (this would prevent any type of Anti Christ from having any credibility).

Self defeating then ain't it?

[ladyinred]

I don't believe in the rapture, I am not a Catholic or a reformed anything, but I get my belief about this topic from scriptures. It seems to me that sadly, too many arguments that are unnecessary happen around here. We all believe in the same God, Jesus, and Holy Spirit and I wonder how our Saviour feels about this? God Bless all of you and I consider each of you my brothers and sisters in Christ.

[Destro]

I love apocalyptic fiction: I really wanted to like the "Left Behind" books but when I read a Romanian would rise up and rule the world as the anti-Christ I rolled my eyes in disgust. What the Russians fell out of favor as the home of the anti-Christ? I gues sto the author the Romanians sound Draculaish and also Eastern and Slavic like (they are not Slavs) and thus creepy enough. It never occurs to Rapturists that the anti-Christ will fool people and that maybe he is a popular American hero more so than a creepy foreigner? Now that would be a compelling work of fiction!

I moved on.

[SpookBrat]

Interesting and I'll have to finish reading later. Thanks.

[Destro]

By the way, why do Rapturists ignore Islam as stand in for the anti-Christ?

[P-Marlowe]

By the way, why do Rapturists ignore Islam as stand in for the anti-Christ?

Do you have some theory on Islam and Anti-Christ?

[HarleyD]

"IMHO, The Rapture is false doctrine. An error that arises from the fallacy of sola scriptura - i.e. anyone can read into Biblical passages anything they like."

Well, indugents and purgatory aren't mentioned in the Bible either yet you accept those because the RCC tell you to. Are they still charging to get people out of purgatory?

I'm not sure if you want to talk about the Rapture or sola scriptura.

[ladyinred]

I think Islam has a great part in the endtimes as well. I know people like to say that Rome is where some anti Christ is supposed to come from, but I wonder how they can look at events in the world, and read scripture and not notice who is against all Christendom?

[Tantumergo]

"How about Solar Scriptura? Scripture that warms you up?"

Careful! Meteorology may still be taboo!

;)

[Tantumergo]

"Well, indugents and purgatory aren't mentioned in the Bible either yet you accept those because the RCC tell you to."

FYI - I think you will find that Destro is an Eastern Orthodox - not a Catholic!

"Are they still charging to get people out of purgatory?"

Sure! Give me a million bucks and I'll make sure you go straight to heaven when you die and/or arrange a pre-trib rapture for you as well. While we're at it, you might be interested in buying a bridge on the East coast that we own as well! (sarcasm off)

[oceanperch]

The baby of the Baldwin bros as some of you know has turned his life over to Christ and right now on TBN they are playing un updated movie that he is starring in called 'Six".

It is the world in chaos as people are forced totake the chip or go to prison with death by having their heads chopped off.

Great modern Christian movie with allot of Biblical scripture in every scene to relate to the situation with modern times.

We saw it offered on DVD months ago but like other Christian movies TBN ends up showing the movies after they have offered them on DVD we may have to purchase this one. Time changers was another good one.

So if Billy (brother of Alec) Baldwin can change his heart and life their is hope for anyone.

I know the movie is low budget but the modern times of Revelation unfolding is cool.

Allot of actors are doing these type of movies. A kid can't think of his name has a show weekly on evangelism and he was on a tv series sit com from the 80's.

I love having a Christian channel the family can enjoy.

[ladyinred]

I read all of the Left Behind series, and I am not a believer in that theology. Some of them were really very good, others, including the last one, were a disappointment. I just like to read good Christian type novels!

[redgolum]

I would hesitate to lay the Rapture at the feet of the idea of Sola Scriptora. An honest reading of the scripture gives NO basis for a pre tribulation rapture. It does say that we will be taken up with Him when He comes, which is the closest you can get to a Left Behind type of thing.

[kosta50]

BTW I can defend the trinity from scripture, and I believe that is where the church fathers found it

Er, you are more than welcome to try to define it, solely based on Scriptures, as it was defined by 341 AD. I really want to see that work!

Trinity was defined before the Bible was fully assembled. Individual Gospels and wiritngs were known to a few people, but most of the teaching was done by oral tradition.

There were almost one thousand bishops around at the time Tirnity was defined and redefined within the first half of the 4th century. Surely, you don't think they all had copies of the yet unpublished Bible in order to forumate the concept of Trinity.

The full concept of Trinity was completed and defined by the Synod of Bishops (first two Ecumenical Councils), as we know it today (without the Latin Filioque) some 50 years before the Bible was canonized by the Church.

I think there is a distinct difference when the Church as a hole agrees to a doctrine as opposed to some offshoot of an offshoot.

[american colleen]

I just like to read good Christian type novels!

You might like a couple of Michael O'Brien's novels... sandyeggo and I loved "Fr. Elijah" and I am almost done with the children of the last days trilogy 1. Strangers and Sojourners 2. Plague Journal 3. Eclipse of the Sun. You could probably skip the first two and read the third independantly - the third is the best one, imo. Anyhow, all of them are apocolyptic in nature, very well written and suspenseful.

[kosta50]

There are hints but no clear forumlation of Trinity in the Scriptures.

There is no relationship of hypostases clearly defined. There is nothing in the Scriptures resembling the Symbol of Faith (Creed) as defined by the Second Ecumenical Council which is valid to this day.

[kosta50]

FYI - I think you will find that Destro is an Eastern Orthodox - not a Catholic!

What he is trying to say is that Eastern Orthodox do not have indulgencies and do not believe in purgatory (where sinners are flamed to God's "satisfaction" -- what a horrible concept!).

[RnMomof7]

So you believe that the trinity is made up of whole cloth , just a lie of Rome?

What the church canonized as scripture means nothing to me.

The " assembling" of the books means nothing to me. It is the information with in the gospels and the letters that interest me .

All authority in heaven and on earth has been given to me. Therefore go and make disciples of all nations, baptizing them in the name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit [Matthew 28:19].

May the grace of the Lord Jesus Christ, and the love of God, and the fellowship of the Holy Spirit be with you all [2 Corinthians 13:14].

To God’s elect. . .who have been chosen according to the foreknowledge of God the Father, through the sanctifying work of the Spirit, for obedience to Jesus Christ and sprinkling by his blood [1 Peter 1:1-2].

Now there are varieties of gifts, but the same Spirit. 5And there are varieties of ministries, and the same Lord. 6And there are varieties of effects, but the same God who works all things in all persons.1 Cor. 12:4-6

There is one body and one Spirit, just as also you were called in one hope of your calling; 5one Lord, one faith, one baptism, 6one God and Father of all who is over all and through all and in all. 7But to each one of us grace was given according to the measure of Christ’s gift.Eph. 4:4-7,

"But you, beloved, building yourselves up on your most holy faith; praying in the Holy Spirit; 21keep yourselves in the love of God, waiting anxiously for the mercy of our Lord Jesus Christ to eternal life.Jude 20-21,

The word Godhead is used three times in the KJV Acts 17:29, Romans 1:20, Colossians 2:9..

   The Bible says there is only one God. Yet, it says Jesus is God (Is. 9:6-7;) (John 1:1,14) (Heb 1:8); it says the Father is God ( Romans 1:17& 20) (Phil. 1:2); and it says the Holy Spirit is God (Acts 5:3-4). Since the Son speaks to the Father, they are separate persons. Since the Holy Spirit speaks also (Acts 13:2), He is a separate person. There is one God who exists in three persons