Don't back gays, bishop tells priests -- [Holy Bishop Olmsted alert]

For the Current NLS List go to: List of the signers of the No Longer Silent Declaration

On this list in addition to the 3/31/2004 names is a NEW name: Rev. Nils F. Thompson, OFM, Phoenix

Names that have been removed from the March 31, 2004 List:
L#19--Rev. Scott Brubaker, pastor, St. Bridget, Mesa.
L#25--Rev. Chris Carpenter, pastor, Christ the King, Mesa.
L#87--Rev. Ray Ritari, pastor, St. Matthew, Phoenix.

Names still on the List as of May 6, 2004 @ 4PM:
L#15--Rev. Andre Boulanger, retired.
L#31--Rev. John Cunningham, pastor, St. Mary Magdalene, Gilbert.
L#48--Rev. Hugo Gonzalez, pastor, St. Charles Borromeo, Peoria.
L#63--Rev. Matthew Mampara, associate, St. Mary Magdalene.
L#70--Rev. Vernon Meyer, Sunday associate, St. Patrick, Scottsdale.
L#110-Rev. Nils F. Thompson, OFM, Phoenix [Not yet mentioned in the Press***]
L#113-Rev. Ken Van de Ven, pastor, St. James, Glendale.
L#120-Brother Doug Zlatis of St. Matthew.

Here and following is some info about these names.

Church views don't lean left or right

The Arizona Republic -- Opinions online print edition
May. 3, 2004 12:00 AM -- Link to the Opinion Article

Regarding the Wednesday article "Don't back gays, bishop tells priests": There are several points that require clarification.

First, the original draft of the document "Always Our Children" was not "watered down by the Vatican," as stated in the article. The original draft of that document contained inaccurate representations of Catholic teaching. Thus, the Vatican restored (not watered down) the document so it could be useful and instructive.

Second, you reference church "liberals" and "conservatives." These descriptors suggest that there are different philosophies or viewpoints, as with, say, a political party. However, in the Roman Catholic Church, they do not exist; there is only orthodoxy and heterodoxy.

Third, your article says Father Vernon Meyer argues "the document was ambiguous enough that it did not conflict with Catholic teaching." For 2000 years, the church has labored against ambiguity, and strove to make her teachings clear and unambiguous. Ambiguity can lead the faithful astray, and no Catholic, let alone a priest, should ever endorse anything that is not a clear reflection of the magisterial of the church.

Bishop Thomas J. Olmsted understands this principle and is working diligently to clarify matters such as these.

Finally, the phrase "in obedience to him" contained in his confidential letter to the priests might suggest to some that power and ego are involved.

Nothing could be further from the truth. Allowing members of the clergy to persist in error would be a failure of leadership on the bishop's part. And isn't it just this sort of episcopal failure in other recent issues that is something that all Catholics seem eager to remedy? -
Michael J. Malone, Phoenix

Jesus taught mercy, compassion

The Arizona Republic -- Opinions online print edition
May. 4, 2004 12:00 AM -- Link to the Opinion Article

Church teaching is very clear in its condemnation of any discrimination, violence or prejudice against anyone regardless of their race, gender or orientation.

This condemnation is based on the teaching that all people are made in God's image and likeness. This means that whether conservatives and fundamentalist like it or not, gays, lesbians, bisexual and transgendered human beings are made in God's image and likeness!

Secondly, church teaching is also clear that those who have been divorced and remarried, those who practice birth control, those who support the death penalty and those who support the war in Iraq also stand in conflict with the church. If we are going to condemn some for immoral behavior, let us also be consistent in condemning everyone's immorality.

But let us also remember that Jesus taught us to love our enemies and taught us not to judge, lest we be judged. Anyone's rush to orthodoxy must not at the same time negate the teachings of Jesus about compassion and mercy to be shown to everyone regardless of their orientation. -
The Rev. Vernon Meyer, Scottsdale

Note: Underlines added. Meyer seems to believe orthodox Catholics are "fundamentalists". There was a letter to the editor of the Catholic Sun some years ago in which Meyer blasted the "fundamentalists". Orthodoxy seems to be a source of irritation to him.

As of this moment Meyer has not yet removed his name from the Current NLS List.

FYI: An article from 2002 involving Meyer follows this post.

Sex scandal meeting angers some Catholics

Lindsey Collom
The Arizona Republic -- Jun. 23, 2002 12:00 PM [Old article about Meyer]
Link to complete Article

A meeting touted as a forum for Catholics struggling with sexual scandals in the church caused a handful of parishioners to storm out of St. Patrick's Church in Scottsdale early Saturday.

About 80 Catholics from across the Valley attended the meeting led by the Rev. Vernon Meyer to air concerns about sexual misconduct by priests against minors and the crimes' subsequent handling by the church.

"There's a lot of people who have been voicing their opinions about this that I'm not so sure are competent," Meyer said, urging the congregation to know canon law and wait for solutions to emerge from Catholic leaders and Scripture.

Retiree Louise Kern of Scottsdale walked out after being rebuffed by the priest and several onlookers. She made a statement about the church allowing the Rev. Harold Graf of St. Joan of Arc Church in Phoenix to remain in service despite improper conduct with a minor 24 years ago.

"This place is a joke. That's why we came out here, because we thought this was a discussion of what's going on. He doesn't want to do that," Kern said. "We would never sit there and listen to what they've done with the Catholic Church or that hypocrite of a bishop [O'Brien]."

Kern said it was as if she were being lectured on the "do's" and "don'ts" of expressing opinion instead of being allowed to speak freely. But Joe Santa Cruz, 31, of Phoenix, said he felt the opposite.
. . . [snip, Excerpted article]

The discussion came a day after Bishop Thomas O'Brien of the Phoenix Diocese announced he would reprimand all priests found guilty of committing sexual acts with minors. He began by removing Graf, and the Revs. Joseph Lessard and Joseph Brecino from active ministry, a move he should have made earlier, Santa Cruz said.

"He did what he had to do, but he's a little late," he said. "I think the bishop should allow more discussion from the laity, more of a dialogue, listen to people's needs."

Kern said she and her husband, Neil, are longtime Catholics who are tired of the corruption being ignored.

"The people that Neil and I have respected most of anyone in our long life is Catholic priests, and these people do not deserve respect for what they've done to the church," Kern added. "They say we need to uphold the hand of the priest. I don't want to hold his hand. I want to give him the back of my hand."

Meyer said he's "just as ticked off" about the sexual scandal as anyone else, but he was more concerned about setting an amicable tone in the first meeting. He will facilitate follow-up forums from 7:30 to 9 p.m. Monday and Wednesday at the Scottsdale parish.

It is truly about time that a Man with courage and a moral Compass reset the the path these priests and others are on.
There is no place in the clergy for "Homosexually Oriented Priests" since their thinking is already clouded.

Someone posted the following:
"Church teaching is very clear in its condemnation of any discrimination, violence or prejudice against anyone regardless of their race, gender or orientation."
"This condemnation is based on the teaching that all people are made in God's image and likeness. This means that whether conservatives and fundamentalist like it or not, gays, lesbians, bisexual and transgendered human beings are made in God's image and likeness!"

Isn't the Singling out of conservatives and fundamentalists
just another form of prejudice which the writer states is against the Teaching of the Church.

If it's my job to care for my children then I do not want the teaching of the Homosexual Lifestyle treated as normal in the public schools much less the Catholic Church and the Clergy.
Maybe the writer hasn't heard of the Homosexual Priest Sexual Abuse crises in the Catholic Church over the last 5 or 6 Decades.

Meyer's letter is extremely sloppy. Catholics are at liberty to support the war in Iraq, because Catholics are not obliged to agree with the Pope or any of the bishops with respect to the justice of that war. Catholics are required to oppose the death penalty as a general rule, but they are at liberty to vote for those who do--because a non-Catholic politician who supports the death penalty is not necessarily a wicked, violent, unjust person, because there is a long Biblical and Christian tradition of support for the death penalty. And the Church does not condemn the death penalty absolutely. Catholics are not at liberty to vote for politicians who support abortion because such politicians are WICKED PEOPLE with no sense of justice, and because the Church has always condemned abortion absolutely.

Note that nowhere in his very misleading letter does Meyer ever refer to the fact that, while opposing unjust discrimination against homosexual persons, the Church absolutely condemns sodomy.

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