Reuters PHOTO: "ROMAN CATHOLIC" John Kerry takes communion at AME Church [Is this kosher?]

REUTERS photo (via the Drudge thread) ^ | April 4, 2004 | RonDog

[RonDog]

Perhaps someone on the RELIGION forum can help us.

On tonight's Drudge thread there is some question as to the propriety of a ROMAN CATHOLIC taking communion in a NON-Catholic church.

See, for instance, my post 321:

To: tgslTakoma

The AP and Reuters stories said that he did take communion. Kerry attended Palm Sunday services, but not at a Catholic Church; he went to the Charles Street AME Church in Boston to take Communion.

(It's been a very long time since my Catholic school religion classes, but I seem to remember that it's a big no-no for a Catholic to take Communion in other than a Catholic church. Maybe that rule has changed...)

From Yahoo! NEWS photos:

Sun Apr 4, 3:16 PM ET

Democratic U.S. presidential candidate Senator John Kerry
(news - web sites) (D-Ma) and his wife Teresa Heinz Kerry (2nd from L)
kneel in prayer with Boston Mayor Tom Menino (3rd from L)
and his wife Angela as they wait to be served communion
during church services at the Charles Street AME Church
in the Dorchester section of Boston April 4, 2004.
REUTERS/Jim Bourg US ELECTION

The AP and Reuters stories said that he did take communion. Kerry attended Palm Sunday services, but not at a Catholic Church; he went to the Charles Street AME Church in Boston to take Communion.

(It's been a very long time since my Catholic school religion classes, but I seem to remember that it's a big no-no for a Catholic to take Communion in other than a Catholic church. Maybe that rule has changed...)

From Yahoo! NEWS photos:

[AnAmericanMother]

John Wesley, the forerunner of the methodists, was an Anglican priest, and he never left the Anglicans to found a separate methodist denomination.

. . . and thereby hangs a tale . . .

When my husband and I got engaged, he was Methodist (and the grandson of a Methodist minister) and I was Episcopalian. I was invited to lunch with his grandfather, not realizing that all the elders or vestry or board of directors (or whatever the Methodists call them!) of the Reverend's church would be there. I withstood a pretty smart examination on my faith - guess they wanted to be sure the eldest son of the house wasn't marrying a heathen - and one sweet little old blue-haired lady asked me, "So, when are you going to join the Methodist Church?" I answered (very respectfully), "Well, Ma'am, since John and Charles Wesley lived and died Episcopalians, I hope I can too." That seemed to set her worries at rest. (It's also funny how all the Methodists show up at Wesley's old church on St. Simons Island GA and are absolutely kerflummoxed to find an Episcopal service in progress . . . )

Of course, now both my DH and I have joined the Catholics. You just never know how things are going to turn out . . .

[SoothingDave]

Actually, it stands for "Episcopal". In this instance, it means that the church has bishops (which is what episcopal means).

I know it's not in communion with the present Anglican Churches, so calling it "Episcopalian" is an error. But I can see how an AP guys might think they were, what with the name being confusing.

And come to think of it, aren't they a "black" version of the Methodists, which were an offshoot of the Episcoplians?

SD

[Lion in Winter]

I am sorry to tell you this... as a non-Eastern Orthodox Christian you are not allowed the Eucharist in the Eastern Orthodox Church... Any of them.... they are all connected, you know.

An error was made if you took the "GIFTS", as he called them. As my nephew, who is Orthodox told me not two days ago.... one must be an actual, recently confessed Orthodox Christian to take the Sacraments.

He said a Priest was suspended for giving the sacraments to those at a wedding who knew were not Church members.

Also, he added that in some Orthodox Churches you MUST have confession on the morning you take the Gifts as he called it. Not to mention, they must refrain from eating meat on Wednesdays and Fridays every week.

There is NO mutual communion between the two Churches... as much as the RC would like to think that there is.... there just is not. That is what brought up the discussion between us. My daughter and son-in-law are RC and we were having this very talk.

My nephew and his new wife are converts to the Greek Orthodox Church and he is considering attending seminary next year. If not to be a priest, he wants to be a youth counselor at the Church.

[AnAmericanMother]

And come to think of it, aren't they a "black" version of the Methodists, which were an offshoot of the Episcoplians?

Absolutely correct. See history link above. Founded in 1816 when a Methodist Church in Philadelphia exiled its black members to the gallery.

[xzins]

Let's face the truth.

Kerry went to the AME because he's trying to bill himself as the second black president. He was pandering to them.

And he was sending a unmistakable communique to his Catholic bishop.

[maica]

That photo of K taking communion in an AME church is valuable in trying to solicit the vote of 'traditional Catholic Democrats,' who avert their gaze and excuse the pro-abortion votes of these dem Senators.
I wonder if they (the Friendly Sons of St Patrick membership, for example) will still overlook and excuse this depiction of Kerry's true faith.

[Travis McGee]

I wonder. It's a complex political/social/religious calculation.

[Qwinn]

"There is NO mutual communion between the two Churches... as much as the RC would like to think that there is.... there just is not."

Well, apparently the RC is very confused then... since the missal of St. Paul's Church in Princeton, NJ specifically states that members of the Eastern Orthodox Church are considered "fully in communion" and freely permitted to have communion there. No special permission required.

The feeling I'm now getting is that Rmoan Catholics permit Orthodox to receive Communion, but Orthodox do not permit Roman Catholics to have Communion.

Qwinn

[AnAmericanMother]

I dunno. This could easily backfire. This is not something he can blame on "the church ought to stay out of politics" - he's doing something clearly forbidden by the church and so far as I know not winked at (like pro-abort Catholic politicians receiving). Maybe he's trying to precipitate an excommunication or a barring from communion. Then he can do the martyr act.

He won't fool any Catholics into thinking that he's receiving in the Catholic church, 'cause that's a female minister distributing.

I think next week is going to be fish or cut bait time. All faithful Catholics are required to go to confession at least once a year (usually around Easter). Although you're required to attend Mass every Sunday (or Saturday night), Easter is a very high festival indeed and most Catholics make it to church even if they don't manage it any other time.

I wonder if this is really some sort of deep-laid plot, or if Kerry is just re-demonstrating his usual tin ear.

[SoothingDave]

Well, apparently the RC is very confused then... since the missal of St. Paul's Church in Princeton, NJ specifically states that members of the Eastern Orthodox Church are considered "fully in communion" and freely permitted to have communion there.

Yes, it is confused. Where do you see this? Is it actually printed in the missal? Cause the missals I've seen don't say anything like that.

Sounds like a renegade priest.

SD

[Modernman]

There is NO mutual communion between the two Churches... as much as the RC would like to think that there is.... there just is not.

The two Churches do recognize each other's weddings, though.

[maica]

I was thinking about passing on this info to our own personal contacts. A public scrutiny of JFKs Easter religious activity would be spun by Kerry supporters as heavyhanded "radical rightwing etc" hounding.

[patent]

>>>>Well, apparently the RC is very confused then... since the missal of St. Paul's Church in Princeton, NJ specifically states that members of the Eastern Orthodox Church are considered "fully in communion" and freely permitted to have communion there. No special permission required.

No, the RC is not confused, whoever wrote and approved that missal is. That isn't the Catholic understanding of the situation.

patent

[patent]

>>>The two Churches do recognize each other's weddings, though.

We recognize all their sacraments, that doesn't mean we are in joint communion. They don't have to join us before we will recognize the good and valid things they do.

patent

[SoothingDave]

The two Churches do recognize each other's weddings, though.

The sacraments are valid in either Church. But that doesn't mean we are in union or intercommunion.

We also recognize as valid Baptisms done by pretty much anyone, and Protestant marriages are considered bindgin on PRotestant faithful.

SD

[SoothingDave]

Unless someone is confusing the Eastern Cathoic Churches and the Eastern Orthodox. Eastern Catholics can certainly commune in a Latin rite Catholic Church and vice versa.

SD

[pax_et_bonum]

ping

[Lion in Winter]

Orthodox Christians are not permitted by their OWN Church to take the sacraments in the Roman Catholic Church. Nor are the Romans invited to partake in the OC Church.

Evidentally, the OC do not follow the RC rules. They have their own rules of course.

The RC say the OC can partake, however.... the OC says their members may not partake of sacramental communion in any other Church... RC or other Churches, as well.

There is a Schism, you know, between the two. Looks like it to me, anyway.

Best that everybody just go to their own Church and follow their own rules.

Which brings me right back to herr kerry.... IF he is a PROFESSED RC, then what IS he doing in another Church which does not share the same belief in the Sacraments that his own Church has.

Well, for kerry... it is all about DIVERSITY/POLITICS and stickin' it to good, confessed and strict adhering members to the RC Church.

I cannot stand him for this and other things too numerous to mention.

[Modernman]

They don't have to join us before we will recognize the good and valid things they do.

And vice versa :-)

I'm Serbian Orthodox but am marrying my Roman Catholic fiance in a Catholic Church. Getting everything squared away from the perspective of both Chucrhes has been an interesting process, to say the least.

[Qwinn]

*nod* It is possible that I mistook "Eastern Catholic" for "Eastern Orthodox"... I will check the missal next time I go and report.

Qwinn