[malakhi]

Is not God's endowment of man with a truly free will an act of His divine sovereignty?

[HarleyD]

Did John the Baptist "repent" of his sins while in the womb? Of course not. Was the "lack" of free will as to what John would become unfair? I don't think so.

As Job discovered God does things for His purpose no matter how unfair it may seem to us.

BTW-God never told Job WHY He allowed the afflictions.

[rwfromkansas]

Yes.

But unfortunately, though it provides a nice Arminian talking point, there is NEVER EVER EVER a Scripture used to support the contention that God has excercised his will by giving us a free will and removing the consequences of the fall.

No. In fact, the NT makes it clear that before salvation, we still are "slaves to sin." We still are at 'enmity' with God. We still don't have the spirit and thus are called "natural man"....we can't even understand the things of God (anything....including the gospel)...because they are "spiritually discerned." It is only when God decides to give us the Spirit (which shows that God did not change all people to remove the effects of the fall so we would come and have life in Christ.....only some, his elect have the Spirit come and rescue them from the death that the Fall created) that we come and receive Christ.

Arminians claim that Calvinism makes God a respecter of persons. On the contrary, it makes him simply a savior of people needing saving. He only chooses us out of his grace, not because he sees anything in us.

It is free will theology that creates separate classes of people. It creates a group of people too stupid to see the good of choosing Christ, and a group of people who happened to have something in them better than the other group....they are not on equal footing with the other group...they see good in salvation and choose God because they are "smarter." Isn't this just appalling?????!!!! According to Arminian theology, those who get in heaven are lucky.

According to Calvinism, those who get in heaven are recipients of God's grace.

[Gamecock]

It is interesting that some will value free will on the same level, perhaps even higher, as God's sovereignty or the gift of salvation.

"I don't want salvation if I don't have a say in it!"

They seem to want it all.....