KASPER’S CURIOUS “CODE OF BEHAVIOR”

Tradition in Action ^ | March 9, 2004 | Atila Sinke Guimarães

[Land of the Irish]

First, Kasper ordered the Russian Catholic Bishops to be present in Moscow, and at a meeting at the Cathedral of Mary Immaculate he severely lectured them, instructing them to stop proselytizing.

[Land of the Irish]

Ping

[maestro]

...... meet Alexis II, the schismatic Russian patriarch and ex-KGB agent. According to Vatican sources,.....

What Roman Catholic Eastern Rite is,....'KGB'....?

The Splendor of the KGB....?

'In the Name of God'....?

/sarcasm

[narses]

Ping.

[Antoninus]

I say, if Russians are converting to Catholicism, let the Holy Spirit do His work. No worries, though. Those who try to thwart the Spirit never win in the long run.

[Siobhan]

I agree, Antoninus.

I wonder if some gentlemen weren't sitting around saying, "We have this huge problem with Walter Kasper. Why don't we put him in Ecumenism, where he is really a fish out of water. He will always be out in the public eye so the Muslims, Jews, Protestants and even the SSPX will have an eye on him. His failures will be on a world stage, and will be his alone. And his successes will belong to the Holy Father. Sound like a good plan, gentlemen?" A chorus of muffled approval and then on to the next nightmare. "Now the matter of the Archdiocese of Los Angeles in the USA."

[Land of the Irish]

I say, if Russians are converting to Catholicism, let the Holy Spirit do His work.

I agree.

Damn the ecumenical torpedoes from Rome, full speed ahead.

[Alamo-Girl]

Thanks for the ping!

[dangus]

I agree with you in part, so please read past the initial criticism of the post.

This article is misleading, using the Ukranians as a potential model for the Russians.

Ukranian-rite Catholicism was brutally repressed during Soviet rule. Orthodox churches were allowed, because they did not have allegiance to a non-Soviet authority, but the Ukranians had reunited with Rome several centuries earlier. Under such harsh oppression, most Ukranians began attending schismatic Orthodox mass to receive sacraments in a manner which is canonically valid.

When the Soviet Union fell, an "Orthodox" priest "retook" the Cathedral in Lvov, declaring he had always remained Catholic in his heart. Tens of thousands of worshippers helped keep the church under Roman control. In a remarkably brief period of time, massive numbers of Ukranians left the Soviet-imposed Orthodox church to return to the church of their fathers, the Ukranian-rite Roman Catholic Church.

In contrast, the Russian Orthodox Church has been separate from Rome for a millennium. A return of this Church to the Roman one is probably less likely than a return of Lutherans to the Catholic Church, and certainly less likely than Episcopalians! (If there are Episcopalians and Lutherans reading this saying "We'd never go back!" -- well, that's my point.)

That being written, most Russians are, too my knowledge, quite irreligious. The Russian Orthodox church's stance seems to equate to "better atheist than Catholic"! While I would be hestitant to proselytize church-going Orthodox, I pray for the conversion of the Russians who are godless.

I believe Kasper is wrong. And if he truly represents the Pope in this matter, the Pope is wrong also. (Yes, I DO believe the Pope CAN be dreadfully wrong!) But, there is another side to this:

Russia is still not safely Democratic, and can quickly veer into totalitarianism. The vast majority of Russians are not religious, but do identify with Russian Orthodoxy in a nationalist way. Encroachment of Rome is seen as being conquered by the West. Aggressive prosetylization is therefore very threatening to Russians and the Church apparently is fearful of triggering state suppression of religion. And that fear is very rational. But I trust the episcopy in Russia far more than the modernist Kasper to decide where to draw the line.

[dangus]

>>>>I say, if Russians are converting to Catholicism, let the Holy Spirit do His work.<<<<

>>I agree.<<

>>Damn the ecumenical torpedoes from Rome, full speed ahead.<<

Interesting choice of language, but I certainly agree!

[dangus]

No, it's not the Eastern Rite... it's the schismatic Eastern Church which broke from the Roman Church in the 11th century.

[dangus]

>>I wonder if some gentlemen weren't sitting around saying, "We have this huge problem with Walter Kasper. Why don't we put him in Ecumenism, where he is really a fish out of water. He will always be out in the public eye so the Muslims, Jews, Protestants and even the SSPX will have an eye on him. His failures will be on a world stage, and will be his alone. And his successes will belong to the Holy Father. Sound like a good plan, gentlemen?" A chorus of muffled approval and then on to the next nightmare. "Now the matter of the Archdiocese of Los Angeles in the USA."<<

I don't know if I believe that, but it has crossed my mind that the Holy Spirit may be working even through the visibly evil archdioceses such as Boston and Los Angeles so that the orthodox faith may be revealed when these diocese are compared to more orthodox archdioceses such as Philadelphia, St. Louis, and Denver.

[Siobhan]

Your points are well taken and spot on -- mine was simply musing.

[Askel5]

In Kyiv for the Pope's visit to Ukraine, the enmity was palpable ... not just the protestors at Pechersky Lavra (Alexy's property) but some outright attacks by a couple of women on one of our priests ... who, strangely enough, became his best friend when he pulled out his Eastern rite blessing cross. (He's got some sort of dispensation to say the Eastern Rite Mass here in New Orleans.)

I think your comments are spot on as well. There was no love lost between me and our Moscow guide (who did not like at all my disappearing for two days) and her enthusiasm over the rebuilt Cathedral of Christ the Savior was lost on me somewhere about the time the corporate sponsorship details (as exacted by the state) were brought forth. Between that and what was then the recent injunction Alexy had brought against any public worship but Orthodox ... I ended up opting against covering my head.

It was breathtaking in its way but also truly creepy.

I wish I'd been more mollified by the pro-literature I found tucked away in a corner of the enormous building but we're talking Moscow ... where even the Metro cars have anti-abortion placards ... for what that's worth in a nation where abortions outnumber live births.

I also find it telling that -- among his big PR pitches where the faith was concerned, such as presiding at the canonization of the Romanovs -- Yeltsin didn't break ground at the Cathedral but, instead, fitted the Last Brick in the structure.

You put the last brick in, you can take the last brick out and it'll collapse every bit as easily as the old Soviet Union did once time was ripe for perestroika.

Interesting post, Dangus. No question but what the return of the Kazan icon is terribly premature yet. The ravages of 80 years of militant atheism are palpable.

[dangus]

I actually would be interested in Orthodox feedback to my post... know anyone to ping?

[dangus]

O, and by the way... you're experiences were very interesting; I was wondering who was supporting the pro-life placards in the subway stations. Is it the government afraid of demographics, or a church fighting evil?

[Siobhan]

You put the last brick in, you can take the last brick out and it'll collapse every bit as easily as the old Soviet Union did once time was ripe for perestroika.

Bingo!

[Askel5]

I'm guessing it was the government.

Would have taken a picture but, unfortunately, I noticed it only as the doors were opening (and having played "prairie dog" on the Metro for a while at that point, was reluctant to get lost AGAIN ...).

It was an all-black placard with perhaps three words (perhaps a "just say no" sort of slogan) and an image of a 6-month old infant that was shattered like a piece of glass. Very powerful, I thought. But no religious connotation whatsoever.

Another guide in St. Petersburg spent quite a while discussing with us the incentives the government has put in place to encourage women to have children ... with or without fathers.

None appear to be working.

[Askel5]

Romulus isn't Orthodox but might have good feedback and will probably know who to ping.

[Romulus]

Comments?