SCIENTOLOGY: NO RIGHTS, PLEASE

pagesix ^ | 09/04/03 | P6

[Pikamax]

TOM Cruise, John Travolta, Lisa Marie Presley, Kirstie Alley, Juliette Lewis and other Scientologists may have signed away many of the rights that most Americans take for granted. As they move up into the higher levels of the Church of Scientology, members sign documents giving up their right to psychiatric care and to see their families.

[Pan_Yans Wife]

All right there up front, before you make any kind of decision.

You are correct, and most major religions want you to ask questions, as you grow in the faith, and they want you to learn enough yourself, to find the answers that you need. Blind allegiance is not necessary. A thinking member of these faiths is a true asset, not a threat.

[Constantine XIII]

I suppose that if they physically threaten him, he is entitled to exercise his second amendment rights...that or let the authorites know that he is in danger from these cretins.

This would be just like telling a North Korean citizen that everything they had ever been taught is a lie.

IMHO, it is, and they have a right to know.

Other than that, all we can do is pray that they find the way to safety.
We

[Ladysmith]

Other than that, all we can do is pray that they find the way to safety.

That I will continue because, as you say, it's all we can do.

[Buggman]

Incidentally, has anyone seen the old Millennium episode, "Jose Chung's Doomsday Device"? It had possibly the greatest spoof of Scientology (Selfosophy) every written in it.

[callmemrpurpose]

"Actually, the entire discussion was the fairy tale that is the OT III and other upper levels of the CO$. I only brought up the copywrite issue to prove that the Xenu story is, in fact, what is taught in Scientology. You said it wasn't true, I proved it was. And whether or not the "papers" are copywrited, the law still makes provisions for fair use. Copywrite doesn't mean secret."

First of all I never said it "wasn't true" I said "I don't know if it's true, but I respect that they hold it confidential." This would would be a lot easier if you didn't feel the need to misquote me.

For all you know that story has been altered more times than the bible, or maybe it wasn't even written by Hubbard at all. However thats not the point, the point is that it's already been disclosed and hasn't made much of an impact. Which would lead me, and probably others, to believe that there is a little bit more to the church than what you claim meets the eye - since overall the people within it are hardly phased by your righteous propaganda tactics.

But go believing what you want, like I said I dont care. I know it's difficult but to respect the religious beliefs of others is all I ask of you. Live and let live. If it is bogus then people will figure it out for themselves. I wouldn't worry though, there are probably 1000% more success stories in scientology than failures, so they must be doing something right.

[searchandrecovery]

I wouldn't worry though, there are probably 1000% more success stories in scientology than failures...

They don't publish "failure stories" in their fanzines, do they? How would you know? Of course, you could start checking out alt.religion.scientology. If you dare.

Hubbard was a loon. As I said before, the boy defined scientology as "The science of knowing how to know", and yet, there was no science involved at all - he just pulled this sh-t right out of his ass.

[Pan_Yans Wife]

If it is bogus then people will figure it out for themselves.

Then why does the COS threaten ex-members with litigation? They don't want anyone to figure it out for themselves. Have you ever heard of Catholics being sued by the church, because they said they disagree with a Bishop? Why does the COS sue?

[TomB]

First of all I never said it "wasn't true" I said "I don't know if it's true, but I respect that they hold it confidential." This would would be a lot easier if you didn't feel the need to misquote me.

Here is what you said:

"I've been around the church my whole life and the only time I ever heard the word "Xenu" mentioned was on anti site propaganda. I don't know, or even care, where or why these rumors got started. The topic is dead to me and I'm not interested in it. I'm sorry that you believe whatever nonsense is fed to you."

If it is "rumor" and "nonsense", it is "not true".

For all you know that story has been altered more times than the bible, or maybe it wasn't even written by Hubbard at all.

Here it is in Hubby's own handwriting:

And yes, we know it to be legit because the COS lawyers went after someone to take it down and in the process admitted it to be true.

However thats not the point, the point is that it's already been disclosed and hasn't made much of an impact. Which would lead me, and probably others, to believe that there is a little bit more to the church than what you claim meets the eye - since overall the people within it are hardly phased by your righteous propaganda tactics.

And that would lead me, and MANY others to believe that you are brainwashed if you actually believe this story.

But go believing what you want, like I said I dont care. I know it's difficult but to respect the religious beliefs of others is all I ask of you. Live and let live.

I'm sorry, calling yourself a "religion" won't make it so, no matter what the useless IRS says. As mentioned before, any religion in the world will produce their theology and beliefs for you whenever you want. However, as seen by your evasions, Scientology is a closed door, held shut by a gaggle of lawyers. Tell me, where can I find your "church's" epistimology? Where are your sacred texts? If I go to one of your "church" and ask one of your "ministers" what your beliefs are, what will he tell me?

If it is bogus then people will figure it out for themselves

Yes, only AFTER spending years and tens or hundreds of thousands of dollars to find out exactly what it is all about.

I wouldn't worry though, there are probably 1000% more success stories in scientology than failures

How do you know? Because they told you so? How about some proof?

so they must be doing something right.

Just don't ask Lisa McPherson about that.

[RansomOttawa]

You said, on the E-meter:

Um, that's because it IS essentially a prop from a B-movie. Just make sure you take the labels off the tin cans before you hook them up.

As it happens, a friend and I visited the War Museum here in Ottawa a few weeks ago. In the Cold War exhibit, they have a "Mathison Electropsychometer," invented by Volney Mathison for use in psychoanalysis, and used by the government at the height of the Cold War to root out Communists.

The Mathison Electropsychometer is what Dead Ron plagiarized when he invented the E-meter. The bad plastic Art Deco-style case is pure Scientology^TM, however.

[xm177e2]

I'm 22 years old. I've been around the church my whole life and the only time I ever heard the word "Xenu" mentioned was on anti site propaganda.

So then why did the "Church" of Scientology declare that documents related to Xenu were copyrighted trade secrets? Obviously, you are either terribly misled, or you are one of the "Church" of Scientology's propaganda operatives. Either way, get out now, don't give them another dime or another second of your life.

[xm177e2]

all my friends believe in and worship this tyrant from outer-space

No, Xenu is the BAD GUY to Scientologists. You people believe he is in league with the dastardly psyciatrists.

[xm177e2]

You've got a point. But that is just another way of turning attention away from that fact that the church is having illegal things done to it. So what if it is true. That doesn't change a thing, it's still illegal.

Actually, it does change a thing. It makes a lie out of what you said (that the documents were false). Obviously, we won't get anywhere with you (because you're a propaganda operative for the CoS, pretending to be someone else), but we can wipe the floor with you here and let everyone else reading this post see what a jackass you are and just how pathetic your cult is.

[katiebelle]

Why is it wrong for conservatives to have a point of view and express it? It is okay for the rest of the world but when a conservative does it watch out! We are just plain mean.

[stands2reason]

Not supposed to post from The Onion anymore.

[callmemrpurpose]

Me- "I think I'll just remain independent."

You- "You have got to be kidding me.

Do you really expect anyone to believe, that as a result of reading the replies on this thread, that you are no longer a "conservative" but an "independent"?"


Me- I said "remain independent" not "become independent". This this would imply that I haven't chosen a party yet dude.

[callmemrpurpose]

I'm a scientologist and I don't deny the divinity of christ. But of course you must not listen to me because I'm nothing but a liar.

[callmemrpurpose]

Funny because he spent his entire sci-fi fortune on research that took a half of a century of time to compile. Sure he was a greedy man...

I don't understand why you are anti-scientology because you claim it's "unscientific" yet the bible has some pretty unscientific things in it to. Not everything can be explained yet. Scientists don't claim to know the meaning of life do they?

Do does that mean that any person who thinks they know something about life should be shunned because they aren't a well known, learned, nobel peace prize winning, PHD science graduate?

[callmemrpurpose]

I would know because we are relatively small very tight knit group, so of course gossip travels very quickly among us, as you could imagine. I know just about all of the failure stories that happen around here (I live in clearwater) and I can tell you from observation and experience that there are far more successes.

But don't take my word for it.

[Liberal Classic]

Sure he was a greedy man...

Hubbard believed and said to friends that the best way to get rich would be to start a cult.

Do does that mean that any person who thinks they know something about life...

No, it isn't that you think you know something about like, it is what you think you know about life. I am not opposed to Hubbard's cult because it is anti-scientific but because it is anti-free-will and anti-life, it is against the two greatest gifts the Lord gave us.

[callmemrpurpose]

"(because you're a propaganda operative for the CoS, pretending to be someone else)"

BWAAAAAAAAAAHAHAHAHA. Yes I am central intelligence for the COS. You were under surveilance but now that you've caught me, I have to run away. Man you are good. hehe

Ok whatever. I get your point that its a ridiculous story and impossible to believe; as if other religions dont believe in some ridiculous things? If thats all it is then why aren't you against all religions for their belief in god? Is that your only argument?

The way I feel is that what I've done so far in scientology has helped me out quite a bit more than anything else ever has. So, no I don't take it on blind faith, I see it for what it is, not what people tell me it is.