Lets face it, these people are not pro-environment, they are ANTI-Capitalist
Posted on 07/03/2003 3:25:26 AM PDT by Jeff F
The emerging "hydrogen economy" took a hit recently when a report by Cal Tech scientists concluded that hydrogen's widespread usage could cause significant damage to the ozone layer. It was a rather surprising finding for a substance touted as an environmentally-friendly replacement for fossil fuels.
According to the study, if hydrogen replaced fossil fuels, it could be assumed that 10% to 20% of the hydrogen would leak from pipelines, storage and cars. Accordingly, more hydrogen molecules would rise into the stratosphere, where they would eventually form water. "This would result in cooling of the lower stratosphere and the disturbance of ozone chemistry," Cal Tech researchers wrote.
But the researchers aren't against the growth of the hydrogen industry. Rather they are issuing their report as a warning. They suggest that the hydrogen infrastructure be especially designed to control leaks. Some hydrogen experts however believe the Cal Tech report may be overestimating the amount of actual leakage. Further, developments such as HydrogenSource's processors, which would make hydrogen on demand at gas stations, could eliminate leakage and problems associated with transportation.
Lets face it, these people are not pro-environment, they are ANTI-Capitalist
Which ones do you mean? The pro-Hydrogen Power people, or the "Hydrogen Power will pollute the ecosystem" people?
Yeah, right.
It could also be assumed that 10% to 20% of the money in my wallet falls out as I walk along.
It could also be assumed that the earth is flat.
Good point.
Any closed loop system that leaks 10%-20% is poorly designed. I've worked with space chambers that can reach 10 to the minus sixth vacuums and were three or four stories tall. Your refrigerator is a closed loop system. How often do you have to recharge the refrigerant?
That happens when I leave mine unattended on the dresser. My wife says she's completely perplexed about it, too.
The hydrogen economy is inevitable. We "will" run out of fossil fuels eventually, and hydrogen is the obvious long-term replacement.
"There is no benefit in it, because hydrogen can't be concentrated enough to provide enough energy to power anything economically."
If you are talking about MOBILE applications AS OF TODAY, then you are correct. Hydrogen's main value will be as a storage and transmission medium allowing unification of disparate energy sources (nuclear, solar, wind, etc.) for FIXED uses. Although I wouldn't rule out the possibility of human ingenuity overcoming even the problems of mobile uses.
...or themselves for that matter. If they would just shut up and go away, the world would be a better place, and they know it. Doom and gloomers, what a life to look forward to.
Now, you did mention nuclear, solar, and wind power. They can actually add to our energy supply. Which could be stored as hydrogen. But, is it not more correct to simply say that nuclear, wind, and solar power are obvious long-term replacements for fossil fuels (not hydrogen)?
And remember: the leftists won't let us use nuclear power. So, our future would seem to depend on wind and solar energy. That ought to send a chill up your spine, since those technologies are so far from being truly viable.
In my opinion, all discussion of hydrogen is a smokescreen designed to minimize domestic oil production, and hamper foreign relations. It's using a sexy technology as luddism, to hurt capitalism.
But, is it not more correct to simply say that nuclear, wind, and solar power are obvious long-term replacements for fossil fuels (not hydrogen)?
Correct for production of electricity, nuclear for baseload energy in a grid-based distribution system, solar or wind for point-of-use and niche applications where reliability and availability may not be of critical importance. I am part of a research group that is looking at nuclear sources for hydrogen production, assuming a reasonably efficient and relibale distribution system is available for transport of the material.
And remember: the leftists won't let us use nuclear power. So, our future would seem to depend on wind and solar energy. That ought to send a chill up your spine, since those technologies are so far from being truly viable.
Perhaps correct, and the solution is to remove and keep those persons from positions of political power, because our national economy and security is at stake. The regulatory system must also be reformed. I hate to say it, but we could take a lesson from the French on this one (going on 80% nuclear sources for grid-based electricity).
In my opinion, all discussion of hydrogen is a smokescreen designed to minimize domestic oil production, and hamper foreign relations. It's using a sexy technology as luddism, to hurt capitalism.
An interesting speculation. I have no idea if it is true. Being trained in the physical sciences I tend to look for at the technical issues. But if it is true that domestic petroleum production is being discouraged, directly or indirectly, we'll be in trouble, since petrochemicals have so many other uses in a technilogically advanced society than simply burning them up. For that reason alone, we need to keep the industry viable.
They would work hard to lower leakage. However, what is the point where preventing leakage costs more than the leakage itself? Maybe it's 10%, maybe it's 1%.
Hydrogen is a difficult substance to work with. Things which are very air tight might not be hydrogen tight because of the small size of the hydrogen molecules.
Actually, hydrogen is a byproduct from the petroleum industry. The same companies that provide gasoline and diesel can, from the same source, provide hydrogen at a cost far below what it would take to make hydrogen from water via electrolysis.
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