‘The Real Deal’ on women in Saudi

MSNBC ^ | 6-19-03 | Joe Scarborough

[JustPiper]

Held in Saudi Arabia against their will

COMMENTARY by Joe Scarborough

June 19 — American women and children continue to be held in Saudi Arabia against their will. The cream puffs at the State Department can call it what they want… but if it were our children trapped in a foreign land, we’d call it kidnapping.

WOMEN HAVE FEW rights in Saudi Arabia. Like the Taliban, our so-called Saudi allies prohibit women from leaving the country without their father and husband’s approval. Thirteen years ago, an American woman actually got kicked out of the U.S. embassy for having the nerve to escape there with her children. It seems the children’s father regularly beat the woman and children. Reports of other American women and children trapped in Saudi Arabia continue surfacing at an alarming rate — despite Prince Bandar’s September promise that no American women and children would be held in his kingdom against their will.

Well, today’s news made the Prince out to be a liar.

Watch Joe Scarborough on “Scarborough Country,” 10 p.m. ET, weeknights on MSNBC TV.

23-year-old Sarah Saga and her two children escaped to the U.S. embassy to get away from another abusive Saudi relationship. Miss Saga’s story is typically tragic: Her Saudi father kidnapped Ms. Saga when she was 6 years old and refused to return her to her American mother. Saga grew up and was forced to marry a Saudi man; she had two children, and then found herself trapped in an abusive relationship. Last month she tried to take her children home to America, but once again, the Saudis refused and offered Ms. Saga a Sophie’s Choice: your freedom or your children. Already facing death threats, Ms. Saga chose to escape Saudi soil and finally come home to American soil.

But the question remains. Why does our administration and Congress continue allowing the Saudis to kidnap our women and imprison our children? If Iran were to do such a thing, we would quickly declare war. It begs the question, is the pursuit of cheap oil really worth selling our nation’s soul? I think not.

And that, my friend, is the ‘Real Deal.’

[prisoner6]

We could start a campaign here at FR for you with emailing the State Dept. etc...

DITTO'S! I'm sure we can do more, but I've been REAL itchy for a good FReep!

prisoner6

[dark_lord]

Suggestion -- since you say your daughter was born here in the US (so she is a US citizen), and so are you -- just fly back here and fade away. Your mistake was in voluntarily getting involved with the US bureaucracy. Any bureaucracy will screw you over. But if you come back, fade away (move to a different state than where you used to live) and just go low profile, you will have no problems. The state department lawyers may claim that they will fight you if you talk with them, but if you live here they are not going to spend much money attempting to track you down.

Listen carefully. Millions of illegal immigrants successfully "disappear" into life here ever year. As a legal citizen you can do so even more easily. Come back, move to a state you did not live in before, get a job, and fade away (as in, DO NOT talk with anyone in the government).

[Graymatter]

Rutabega, you trusted the law and your fellow man. You fought fair.
Now you must trust no one and fight another way. Things get worse if they don't get better.

[Steve Eisenberg]

Why does our administration and Congress continue allowing the Saudis to kidnap our women and imprison our children? If Iran were to do such a thing, we would quickly declare war.

This was the one false note in Scarborough's article. (See full article, I think this is not in the exerpt.) There is no way we would quickly declare war if Iran, or any other country, did it. We are not the kind of country which declares war just because our women are kidnapped and children imprisoned. Unfortunately, I think.

[Paul Ross]

You are absolutely correct. This is what they should have done with Elian Gonzalez. Just faded away, and Reno would have been stymied.

[Steve Eisenberg]

Every word you write rings true. God bless you for putting your daughter first.

[Steve Eisenberg]

Millions of illegal immigrants successfully "disappear" into life here ever year. As a legal citizen you can do so even more easily. Come back, move to a state you did not live in before, get a job, and fade away (as in, DO NOT talk with anyone in the government).

While I wouldn't condemn Rutabega for doing what dark_lord suggests, not only would she be living a shadow life, so would her daughter. Also, I think that in future years INS will be getting more and more sucessful at catching illegals, so, five years from now, Rutabega and daughter could easily be caught in a type of dragnet that doesn't exist today. Rutabega's plan to stay in Sweden until her daughter is old enough to decide is a higher moral choice.

[AlexW]

"WOMEN HAVE FEW rights in Saudi Arabia. Like the Taliban, our so-called Saudi allies prohibit women from leaving the country without their father and husband’s approval."

OK, I admit, I do not know all the details of this story, but did the woman NOT know Saudi laws and customs before she decided to marry this raghead?(raceism not intended) Why is she in Saudi Arabia to begin with?
Maybe someone can link me to a story that can explain why I should really feel so sorry for her.
Was she taken to Saudi Arabia aginst her will? Did she not marry this creep? Was it also aginst her will? Is he not the father of the kids?

I have been out of the country for past 6 weeks, and maybe I missed something.

Thanks

[Steve Eisenberg]

OK, I admit, I do not know all the details of this story, but did the woman NOT know Saudi laws and customs before she decided to marry this raghead?(raceism not intended) Why is she in Saudi Arabia to begin with?

It's all explained here:

Marriage to Saudis, a minor classic by an anonymous diplomat determined to tell it straight

[AlexW]

"But knowledge of Saudi Arabia and its particular interpretation of Islam should be an American woman's first step in determining whether the compromises required are worth the proposed relationship."

Well, that pretty well sums it up for me.

Thanks

[A_perfect_lady]

What if you came back to the US again, with your daughter, and gave your ex no way of finding you?

[A_perfect_lady]

I'm with dark, come back and vanish. If you work jobs that don't require intensive education and cv, you can even come up with a different name, I'm sure. Your parents can be "references." I would think that your daughter will survive just fine without having a relationship with a father like this. Just my opinion.

[Andy from Beaverton]

It's time for a Ross Perot type hostage rescue.

[dark_lord]

While I wouldn't condemn Rutabega for doing what dark_lord suggests, not only would she be living a shadow life, so would her daughter. Also, I think that in future years INS will be getting more and more sucessful at catching illegals, so, five years from now, Rutabega and daughter could easily be caught in a type of dragnet that doesn't exist today. Rutabega's plan to stay in Sweden until her daughter is old enough to decide is a higher moral choice.

I disagree. Note that both she and her daughter are US citizens. Did you miss that? So I don't think the INS would ever be involved.

[A_perfect_lady]

She was married to him against her will when she was very young.

[KC Burke]

Thanks for the first hand description of how difficult this can become.

[Mamzelle]

I am so sorry to hear this--custody and divorce are such hells even when both parents are Americans. I don't know that the State Department, though, could be expected to cope with such a complicated business.

I know some college kids who are infatuated with foreign-born students--the whiff of exoticism and those charming accents. Will forward your predicament to them, as warning. Buy American, marry American.

All you fellows who think buying an overseas bride is such a bargain, take heed.

[A_perfect_lady]

I know some college kids who are infatuated with foreign-born students--the whiff of exoticism and those charming accents. Will forward your predicament to them, as warning. Buy American, marry American.

100% BUMP. My advice to an American woman messing about with men from the Middle East, in particular, is don't!!!! Don't, don't, don't, ever, ever, ever! I don't care how charming he is. I don't care how secular he seems. Once you are in his power, Dr. Jekyll becomes Mr. Hyde, Henry VIII, and Bluebeard all rolled into one. I've had several friends who've dated Arabs and, to quote the narcoleptic Argentinian of MOULIN ROUGE... "It always ends BAD!"

[etcetera]

"Whoever is at fault will not get these women and children back! This is up to us as 'compassionate' Americans and there are no better activists nor fighters than here at FR!"

I've emailed Pres. Bush to ask him why he acts as if his friendship with the Saudis outweighs his duty to protect Americans.

All Americans should ask him the same question. Email him here and ask him yourself.

[etcetera]

" Our embassy will not feed her.....she must pay for their food. Last Wednesday they went to bed without eating."

Is there some way we can get money to her or pay someone to provide? I'm willing to contribute...