Posted on 06/16/2003 2:12:52 PM PDT by sinkspur
Roman Catholic bishop John O'Brien was arrested for leaving the scene of a fatal hit-and-run accident, and his car impounded.
Your list undermines your argument. These cases did receive press at the time that the crimes were commited. These stories received press because they were reported to the police and prosecuted. They weren't swept under the rug for years by a church hierarchy. There was no coverup.They weren't dispatched to other areas by the church leaders where they could abuse more children.
The perps were prosecuted.
This is the difference. The Roman Catholic Church believes it is "special" as evidenced by the attitudes of some on this thread. Your specialness or membership in some organization will not save you. Only your faith in Jesus, repentence for your sins (including arrogance) and gratitude for his redeeming act.
Calm down, my friend. You appear very"uptight" and unable sense irony or sarcasm.
I am an ND grad, ex-AF officer (KC-97 tankers) and just jerking the chains of the Catholic haters who jump on any misque of any religion ( but particularly the Catholic religion) other than their own.
How are church members handling all of this? Do they still leave their children with church leaders for church classes/events,etc.?
First of all, there is NO evidence that the Bishop himself had anything to do with the homosexual activities by a handful of priests in the Phoenix diocese, so please don't even go there!
For the record, he was not accused of any crime since the law in Arizona TO THIS DAY states you have no obligation to report child abuse to the authorities unless you have personally observed it. As far as a coverup, his first mistake was to follow the advice of mental health experts at that time who felt that pedophilia/homosexuality could be cured with therapy. Turns out they were wrong and now the Bishop gets reamed for it, decades later.
FYI, we don't leave our chidren with clergy as a rule because lay persons lead catechism classes, so most priests have very little actual involvement with children in their parishes.
Please try to remember that 98.4% of priests are good holy men who would never sexually abuse a child...unfortunately the 1.6% of priests who did are giving the rest a bad name.
For the record, he had just presided over a confirmation ceremony on the other side of town from 6 to 7:30. After the ceremony, he probably attended some sort of reception, as he did at my daughter's confirmation last year. The accident occurred at 8:30 which sounds about right as far as traffic, etc.
But ya know, I wouldn't blame him if he had had a nip or two...if you could see the way the media is treating him and Catholics as a whole here. Absolutely disgusting! They have special music and graphics on TV, calling it "Crisis in Faith," etc.
IMO, if someone leaves the Church over this matter, they were probably looking for a reason to leave. My Church and my faith were built on Jesus, not on any one man. We are all sinners, and even a man of the cloth can succumb.
As he said, he didn't KNOW he had hit anyone. If you knew that street...first of all, the speed limit is 40 to 45. It's three lanes in each direction with like NO shoulder to pull over onto. It's a retail zone in a run-down and older part of town, and if the light is green, forget about it -- he woulda been rear-ended if he slowed down. The fact is the Bishop is about the same height as me -- 5'1 -- and I definitely wouldn't stop my car and get out after sundown around there.
Don't any of you find it curious that a second car was also involved in this terrible accident, and yet a witness was only able to get the license plate number of the Bishop's car? I hope the media is an incensed about the other driver when he is finally located.
I wonder if he went to confession before he 'celebrated' Mass on Sunday.
I wonder if they've located the other driver yet -- you know, of the car that actually drove over the pedestrian and also didn't stop. Hopefully, you guys will have some choice words for that guy too. But somehow I doubt it.
Where? Show us the specific replies.
O'Brien may not have known he'd hit a pedestrian.
The object was so large that the guy's windshield was smashed in. Are you telling me that it's normal procedure to just drive merrily along after impacts?
Such accidents commonly happen in Phoenix, especially at dusk when there are deep shadows and bright exposures.
Remind me not to move there. <
If we had a show of hands, I think the proportion of catholic haters here would be depressingly high.
Why do you say that? Do you think it is "hating" the Catholic church to be disgusted at all the cover-ups that have gone on over the years regarding the sex abuse of young children? If I genuinely hated the Catholic church, I'd want the scandal to go on and on so that the church would be destroyed from within. But I don't. I want to see the Catholic church come clean and expel all those who committed and/or covered up for these crimes as well as cooperate with law enforcement so that they can be put behind bars where they belong. If the church did that, it would regain credibility and become strong again.
For years in this forum, we attacked the Clintons for all their coverups and their lying and prevaricating ways. Yet there are some here who applaud the Catholic church for doing the same things and attack those who have a problem with that as "haters with an anti-Catholic agenda."
PLEASE, get your facts straight before you pontificate to others about it.
SIX priests were indicted. One is dead -- can't hold the Bishop responsible for that. The one in Mexico was removed from the priesthood by the Bishop in 1992 and went to Mexico on his own. Three others have been suspended/removed for months or even years, again by the Bishop. And one returned to Ireland after he was released from jail in January, with the charges being dropped against him. (I have no idea why Romley is reindicting him since he was previously cleared!).
I agree with you about his condition being less than ideal, but he has been under siege lately...he is 67 after all, and it certainly doesn't help matters when people like you spread total falsehoods about him. Shame on you!
The Scripture itself says:
1. Jesus gave the Word to the apostles: In John 17:6-8 we read:
John 17:6 "I manifested Thy name to the men whom Thou gavest Me out of the world; Thine they were, and Thou gavest them to Me, and they have kept Thy word.
John 17:7 "Now they have come to know that everything Thou hast given Me is from Thee; John 17:8 for the words which Thou gavest Me I have given to them; and they received them, and truly understood that I came forth from Thee, and they believed that Thou didst send Me.
2. The Apostles taught and wrote down the Word:
2 Peter 1:13 And I consider it right, as long as I am in this earthly dwelling, to stir you up by way of reminder,
2 Peter 1:14 knowing that the laying aside of my earthly dwelling is imminent, as also our Lord Jesus Christ has made clear to me.
2 Peter 1:15 And I will also be diligent that at any time after my departure you may be able to call these things to mind.
3. And then in 2 Peter 3:1 explains HOW they will be able to recall what he taught them:
2 Peter 3:1 This is now, beloved, the second letter I am writing to you in which I am stirring up your sincere mind by way of reminder,
2 Peter 3:2 that you should remember the words spoken beforehand by the holy prophets and the commandment of the Lord and Savior spoken by your apostles.
And again from the Apostle Paul:
1 Corinthians 14:37 If anyone thinks he is a prophet or spiritual, let him recognize that the things which I write to you are the Lord's commandment.
1 Corinthians 14:38 But if anyone does not recognize this, he is not recognized.
So, we see that the Catholic church is NOT the originator nor the authority for the scripture. And, if more Catholics would open the Bible and actually read what it says, we would have a lot less problems not only with Catholic priests, but Catholics in general and would certainly have less arguing over this very thread.
Since when did telling the truth become Catholic Bashing? If ANY individual or religious organization does what is wrong, it should be pointed out. Clinton thinks we bash him. If he were Catholic, would you defend him? The truth is the truth and applies to EVERY man. I have been physically threatened (as have others) by a Free Republic member here who is Catholic. He has threatened to look me up at Freeper events and "kick my a __ __." The fact that he threatened me means nothing to me at all as he would find out if he were able to make an attempt at following through. That type of anger over pointing out someone's misdeeds is analagous to the Islamic attitude. I disagree with you, therefore I kill you. What type of religion is that?
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