Posted on 05/29/2003 3:07:05 AM PDT by Cincinatus' Wife
Edited on 07/12/2004 4:03:25 PM PDT by Jim Robinson. [history]
Are the Chinese serious about human space flight? Most definitely. And they are interested in doing more than simply going to low Earth orbit. They are headed for the moon.
For most of last year, the Commission on the Future of the U.S. Aerospace Industry looked at our nation's position relative to our global competition. Clearly, the Europeans are determined to challenge our preeminence in commercial aviation, and the challenge to our leadership in space is coming from the Pacific Rim.
(Excerpt) Read more at washtimes.com ...
The "human" interest side of space exploraiton is undeniable. But early space pioneers like Werner Von Braun knew that the technology came first and the "monkey" came later.
NASA is the first government organization to successfully implement ISO 9000 quality standards. NASA broadcasts this fact and supporting documents on their quality website. The manpower needed to implement ISO standards is mind boggling for a government entity.
The fixation on bureacracy and bureaucratic procedure needed to successfully implement ISO 9000 quality control standards has pre-empted the NASA mission to put men into space and bring them home again - ALIVE!
( I like to use the term MEN since ts traditional usage is inclusive of women and is not exclusive to one gender)
NASA's primary mission is that of a social experiment - to show how a diversified crew of marginally qualified engineers can do "just as good" as did the older white boys who put American men on the moon.
My point is that NASA is not about space exploration, technology or pioneering efforts, it is about diversity, quality control and bureaucratic political correctness.
A private or military (army, navy, airforce, marines) sponsored/supported enterprise would be head-over-heels more successful than the current bureaucracy.
Maintain equipment, build new equipment, take data, design and re-design experiments, run experiments, and fix any of a thousand unexpected problems, any one of which would kill a robotic probe dead in its tracks.
Add to that the "little tiny" problem with using robotic probes---TIME LAG--imposed by that un-impressive phsical law called "the speed of light". Robotic probes now (and for the foreseeable future) are not sufficiently autonomous to work completely without human intervention--and the further away from earth they are, the worse the problem gets.
As to "sending and ARMADA of probes"---a combined manned/robotic approach would actually be cheaper--to wit--with a permanent manned presence in LEO, you actually build the probes in and launch them from space.
And no, Virginia, I don't suffer from "a lack of inspiration". I think that's YOUR problem.
NASA's budget is less than one half of one percent of the US annual budget. Luddites like you just don't get it.
The program is dead in its tracks, right now, because a group of human "probes" were killed.
The nice thing about robot probes is that they only cost money. Nobody's heart breaks if they fail and collapse. For what we spend providing rides, we could develop lots and lots of probes, most of which would fail. Then we'd need more and more probes. Every one would be better than the last. Probes don't need to breathe, and they don't have to come home.
And astronauts are not exactly perfect. I seem to recall a camera burnt to a crisp moments upon making a moon landing.
Think of the spinoffs, the technology that would be developed.
And, we'd actually get to see and hear Mars, for ourselves, not vicariously.
And that must change.
A private or military (army, navy, airforce, marines) sponsored/supported enterprise would be head-over-heels more successful than the current bureaucracy.
Nothing like competition to spur things along.
Beyond that, if we as a superpower can't finance exploration (which always gives cutting edge technology), as a nation we will falter.
I do not support that largesse either.
NASA's budget is less than one half of one percent of the US annual budget. Luddites like you just don't get it.
A Luddite is a person who worked to destroy technological achievements of private enterprise in order to maintain the status quo of employment opportunities. Why do you think government bureaucrats are superior at determining what should be researched than private individuals, spending money they either earned, or were voluntarily entrusted with? You act is if because I'm against the state squandering money on space research, I'm against space research.
"Socialism, like the ancient ideas from which it springs, confuses the distinction between government and society. As a result of this, every time we object to a thing being done by government, the socialists conclude that we object to its being done at all."
"We disapprove of state education. Then the socialists say that we are opposed to any education. We object to a state religion. Then the socialists say that we want no religion at all. We object to a state-enforced equality. Then they say that we are against equality. And so on, and so on. It is as if the socialists were to accuse us of not wanting persons to eat because we do not want the state to raise grain." -Frederic Bastiat
Because for better or worse, they're all we've got right now. As a conservative, I would much rather see private enterprise take the lead. But it's just not happening. The private sector doesn't operate aircraft carriers either, but I'm happy my tax dollars build and operate them.
Once the effect of gunpowder was established, the Chinese used gunpowder to ward off evil spirits. It was only when it was taken back west in the 15th century that its military uses were recognized, and the musket and cannon were made.
You assert there is no private research of space?! Do you also not see that government expenditure in this area also crowds out private research by forcibly directing limited funds, and by consequence committing a portion of the limited pool of scientists, as the bureaucrats see fit? My question remains, why do you think the bureaucrats know better how to allocate resources than individuals spending their own money, or money voluntarily entrusted to them?
The private sector doesn't operate aircraft carriers either, but I'm happy my tax dollars build and operate them.
Red Herring. An aircraft carrier is purchased with tax dollars to provide for the defense of our nation, from which all benefit, and is, as an exercise of power, an expenditure of funds authorized by the Constitution.
As a goal, it is bogus or dufus. 'Our dufus space program,' has a certain ring. Let the Euros search for life, we have real things to do.
I do. They were exciting adventures. They were also miserable expenditures: it would have been better, faster and cheaper simply to build a whole new telescope every time, and to launch it into orbit via unmanned rocket.
The repairs did capture the public imagination, but I'm not sure they did so more than the arresting images from Hubble itself. And then there are the images and data from the planetary probes, which were obtained for a tiny fraction of what the manned space program costs, and whose scientific value far outweighs anything that has ever come out of the manned space program.
Entertainment and inspiration are valid aims for the space program, but even on that score the unmanned program delivers far more for far less expense.
As you mentioned..other gases are R and D for Plasma drive.
Boeing is working on a deep space Ion drive engine...I am not sure what Gas they are commiting to for it.
I used to operate a Cryogenic Nitrogen Plasma table..for big steel underwater cut..oilfield.
Ion stream requires special containment devices and parameters must stay constant in plumbing..deterioration leads to violent Kaboom.
In the little here and there that I have been able to glean from research..the deep space engine design is not really the hold up to manned flight..but shielding.
From crew compartment..to sheilding from various engine applications..this is the next threshold to overcome.
Magnetic field sheilding.....they will get it mastered eventually : )
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