'Honey, You Repel Me': Advice For Couples in a Sexless Marriage

Wall Street Journal ^ | Thursday, May 15, 2003 | SUE SHELLENBARGER

[WaveThatFlag]

A few times in my 12 years writing this column, I've stumbled on a topic so unsettling to readers that it demanded a follow-up. Last month was one of those times, when my story on the problems of dual-income, no-sex marriages drew a torrent of e-mail that read as if I'd jabbed an open wound.

[wardaddy]

I thought it was. NP might disagree ...lol.

I have been startled by so much unhappiness. Some of the women have replied like sex is a chore. Others have replied that sex is better if a man does his chores.

And those few wonderful creatures have said that sex between a man and his wife is to be treasured, enjoyed, and not qualified or bandied about as reward. All I can say is G-d bless those gals.

The men have mostly bitched about uninterested wives, cajonebusters, and weight gain and wives being tired with babies ....which is understandable unless it becomes chronic.

The most revealing things to me have been that some men and women are on excatly the same wavelengths and some are on diverging paths in this arena.

The Peter Pan man thing has popped up too a bit.

I think the most refreshing thing really to me has been to hear more than just a few ladies who have very healthy and complimentary attitudes towards this aspect of "wifely duties" and intimacy.

It's a fluff thread about a damned serious subject really and I sure enjoyed it...not too much teeth gnashing and some eye opening exchanges.

[wardaddy]

Good Luck outnumbering the idiots.....i like that.

[wardaddy]

Beautiful family btw.

[Mo1]

Thank you

[SauronOfMordor]

Some men go too far in the pestering though. I use to chat in a chatroom for pregnant ladies and women who had just had babies a lot when I was pregnant. I honestly heard way too many women asking how to fend off their hubby's during the 6wks after childbirth. First of all, I can't believe a man would want to even "go there" that soon after, and second, some of them sounded truly desperate for ideas because their hubbies just wouldn't leave it alone.

There are a number of ways to keep hubby sexually happy that do not involve "going there", if the wife has an interest in doing so. The bottom line is: if each party decides to make the effort to keep the other happy, then anything can be worked out.

If either party has lost interest in keeping the other happy, the solution is to either re-develop interest, or move on.

[SauronOfMordor]

Women do not realize how important their approval is to men. Some women think that because men have big muscles and body hair that they don't have feelings as well.

The typical woman tends to be attracted to the most capable man she can get. Men tend to evaluate other men by the quality of the woman (or women) who attach to him. A man's self-image can be enhanced or cut down by how the woman in his life responds to him sexually and emotionally.

When his woman can't get enough of him, that communicates to him that she thinks he is attractive and worthy. When she does not have interest in him, that communicates that she thinks he is unworthy. That promotes resentment, insecurity, and a desire to re-validate his self-image by seeing if any OTHER woman has a different opinion

[SauronOfMordor]

One of the best things a wife can do for her husband involves an occasional 'quickie.' If a couple can reach this level in their relationship, I'm convinced they can withstand anything that life may throw their way.

It's her gift to him, and the mutual understanding is that he is able to accept her gift guilt-free. He can enjoy it for exactly what it is -- a loving gift from his partner. He doesn't feel compelled to "finish the job," as men like to say, or spend a lot of time getting all touchy-feely.

Exactly. There's all the difference in the world between a grudging, resentful "gift" done with the air of self-sacrifice, versus doing something for your spouse purely because you want to make him happy.

I bring home flowers, chocolate and presents from time to time, not because I'm particularly into what I bring home, but because it puts the wife into a good mood. Her taking some time to making a conscious effort to making me happy puts me into a good mood. Having both sides in a good mood is good for the marriage. It communicates that you feel the other is worthy of the effort

[Missus]

I also have miserable pregnancies too and not much sex drive

That's probably it, then... I've got a great lot of "peasant" genes, and besides the constant vomiting, I have great pregancies, and labors so far have been 8 and 5 hours (back labor, though... not fun), which even wimps like me can hack without an epidural--it's only the length of a decent miniseries, after all! LOL

I've a friend who talks of low hormone levels, and my constant response is: Go Talk To Your Doctor. I can't see ignoring an entire aspect (and FUN aspect) of life, just because my body doesn't kick out enough chemicals.

I love my kids--and my husband is the one who provides them, so I do everything I can to express my love and appreciation for him, to him in ways that he "gets." For him, that's cooking meals he likes, lots of physical affection, and sex, plus "the words". He responds by signally his love and affection in way that I "get": building stuff, thank yous for the meals, lots of physcial affection, and sex, plus "the words." Even during The Long Dark Days post child-birth, we find ways to express affection physically... he was REALLY relieved to find out I didn't plan to ignore him for a month and half after our daughter was born, as he'd had guy friends telling him their horror stories, just the way we girls share rotten labor stories! LOL

Speaking of the offspring... they're clamoring to be fed.

Regards

[wardaddy]

Naturally, you are correct Sauron.

I cannot for the life of me fathom why any man...even a young hormone-addled one would insist on pressuring his wife about "down there" while she's still healing. I've watched 4 babies being born real up close and personal, 2 were C-sections and 2 were "regular route". It's painful and does some damage that takes time for recovery.

[Scothia]

But if he was a boy-brat, you wouldn't. And you don't think women should have sex with their husbands if they don't behave right. So sex is a means to control behavior.

In the first place, I don't recall making you, or anyone else here, privy to the details of our sex life, so where do you get off making statements like this? I didn't even bring it up except to say that because my husband is such an incredible man, sex is joyful. Your remark is completely moot and senseless, since I would never have had sex in the first place with my husband, nor married him, if he were a boy-brat. My standards are higher and I chose a better caliber of mate.

Some women use sex, or the lack of it, to manipulate and/or punish. Some men do too. No one should. We are fallen humans and we do wrong to each other.

Stop telling me what I think, especially when you're so pitifully off the mark.

[Scothia]

Exactly. There's all the difference in the world between a grudging, resentful "gift" done with the air of self-sacrifice, versus doing something for your spouse purely because you want to make him happy.

This is one of the best posts in the almost 800 that have been spawned by this highly-charged discussion, and I wholeheartedly agree. If only more women understood this.

My husband has let me know that my giving myself unreservedly to him when he was really unhappy about something, even when I was unhappy and not exactly "in the mood" myself, made all the difference in how he felt and was able to face the situation afterwards. Instead of turning away from each other, we turn towards each other. Must be one of the reasons we just celebrated our 28th on Apr. 5, and having faced all kinds of dreadful things (layoffs, financial woes, serious illness, death of a child, etc.) together.

I've heard Dr. Laura counsel women to give sex to their husbands even when they (the wives) are tired and cranky, and to do it without the acting like martyrs. She always reminds them that after a couple of minutes the hormones and seratonins kick in and they'll be into it, with the end result of two very happy people a few minutes later. I've found that to be absolutely the case. If I could tell young women one thing as the secret to a happy sex life, it's this.

[muggs]

I've heard Dr. Laura counsel women to give sex to their husbands even when they (the wives) are tired and cranky, and to do it without the acting like martyrs. She always reminds them that after a couple of minutes the hormones and seratonins kick in and they'll be into it, with the end result of two very happy people a few minutes later. I've found that to be absolutely the case. If I could tell young women one thing as the secret to a happy sex life, it's this.

Good advice. I haven't read all of the thread or even the article but I do agree with this.

My husband and I will be celabrating our 29th wedding anniversary tomorrow and hope we have at least 29 more years together. :)

[watchin]

I seen that from the other direction as well - women who do not respond to the efforts of their husbands. They rather like the setup and see no reason to change.

Like a sponge, they absorb all efforts at renewing the relationship, and actually respond only by setting their standards higher.

Selfishness incarnate.

[watchin]

LOL I've noticed that nearly all of the books out there have great advice for men to change. They are the problem, after all.

I have an old book by Gary Smalley (well known Christian marriage counselor) "For Better or for Best - Understanding Your Husband". I found it when I was on a search for some material to help women fix their marriages. It sounded promising, until I looked at the table of contents:

Table of Contents
Contents
Part I
THE FOUNDATION FOR BUILDING A BETTER MARRIAGE
1. Lasting Relationships Don't Just Happen
2. Eight Ways Husbands Hurt Their Wives
3. The Hidden Reasons Men Act the Way They Do
4. Helping Your Husband Become More Sensitive
5. Motivating Your Husband to Listen to You
6. Motivating Your Husband to Change
Part II
BUILDING A BETTER MARRIAGE
7. How to Increase Your Husband's Desire to Spend Quality Time With You
8. How to Gain Your Husband's Undivided Attention on a Consistent Basis
9. How to Increase Your Husband's Sensitivity to Your Emotional Needs and Desires
10. How to Gain Your Husband's Comfort and Understanding Instead of Lectures and Criticism
11. How to Motivate Your Husband to Receive Your Correction Without Defensiveness
12. How to Gain Your Husband's Appreciation and Praise
13. How to Help Your Husband Share Responsibility for Your Children and the Household Needs
14. How to Motivate Your Husband to Meet Your Material Needs
15. How to Increase and Deepen Your Husband's Affection for You
16. How to Become Your Husband's Best Friend
Resources

Incredible. There's almost nothing out there advising women on how to fix themselves, rather than there husbands.

[watchin]

A lot of bitterness, but a lot of truth, as well. Unfortunately, our culture shapes this attitude.

"If a woman truly expects to have meaningful communication with her husband, she must activate the right side of his brain. And if a man truly wants to communicate with his wife, he must enter her world of emotions." - Gary Smalley

Male lust and desperation reinforces it.

A good relationship requires that a woman reject the notion that she is a princess, and a man that he is a pauper.

[watchin]

Perfectly fair. Part of the problem on this thread is that there are men who are morons, and women who are selfish manipulators. When you focus on the morons, and I focus on the manipulators, we seem to disagree. In reality, this thread is about people married to selfish, uncaring spouses.

[wardaddy]

And it all started with:

"Men Who Hate Women, And The Women Who Love Them"...

growwwl...oh how I loathe that book....

[Nita Nupress]

I hope that when I find a man that I want to marry, we both base our relationship first on our love for God, then our love for each other.

I wish you the very best, and don't ever compromise and "settle." If he doesn't put God before you, you don't want him anyway. :-) Having experienced a contract relationship in the first marriage and a covenant relationship in the present one, I assure you there is no comparison whatsoever.

[watchin]

A great book. I've actually tested the book by asking a marriage workshop group to list the 5 things men and women are looking for in marriage.

The men worked together to come up with both lists, while the women did the same. I was fascinated to see that both groups nailed both of the lists - exactly!!

Most of us know what our spouses need, but spend most of our time getting instead of giving. The focus of this thread seems to be that some just won't give, no matter what their spouse does. They're relationship sponges. Sad.

[Lorianne]

If she wants to have sex with him "willingly and lovingly" for, as you say, a "gift" to him thats not the same thing as having sex out of obligation.

My question was why would a man want to have sex with a woman who isn't willing and doesn't want sex? What is the point? It seems to me having sex with someone who WANTS to have sex with you (for whatever reason) would be the ideal.

Further, it would seem to me that sex with an someone not sexually aroused, wouldn't be that enjoyable for either persone, adn would would create even more reticence about sex in the future by the non-aroused one.