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Germans dismayed that Poles could command their troops
The Times (U.K.) ^ | 05/08/03 | Roger Boyes

Posted on 05/07/2003 4:04:57 PM PDT by Pokey78

GERMANY has responded angrily to a proposal that its troops be deployed in northern Iraq under the command of Poland, one of the newest members of Nato.

The United States recommended that Poland take over the military administration of northern Iraq, in charge of peacekeeping duties. The force under its command would number about 7,000, including contingents from Nato members such as Romania, Bulgaria and possibly Germany.

Peter Struck, the German Defence Minister, said he would “look into” the proposal, but was clearly opposed.

Poland, which contributed 200 men to coalition forces in Iraq, had promised 10,000 men for a peacekeeping force. This has shrunk to 1,500, with troops from other countries added. The US will be responsible for central Iraq and Britain for the south.

Neither Germany nor France had expected to take a leading military role in postwar Iraq, but the idea that Poland could take charge has stirred a hornets’ nest. President Kwasniewski of Poland will try to resolve the matter when he meets German and French leaders tomorrow, but there is no mistaking the dismay in “old Europe” as Poland flexes its muscles.

“We would like to have German troops,” Jerzy Szmajdzinski, the Polish Defence Minister, said after talks with Donald Rumsfeld, the US Defence Secretary. “I’m sure the United States would be interested in that.”

The comment was intended to be practical rather than polemical. Poland recognises that it has no experience in leading a multinational force. But there is a Polish-German-Danish brigade based in Szczecin in northwest Poland that could be deployed in Iraq.

The German press has been particularly dismissive. Perhaps Gerhard Schröder, the Chancellor, should use the summit to “remind President Kwasniewski who exactly has been the strongest champion of Polish entry into the EU and Nato,” the Süddeutsche Zeitung sniffed.

The Poles have responded in kind. “Germans and French, leave the Poles in peace!” was the headline in Superexpress. “We were right about the war, you do not have to teach us what to do in Iraq.”

France and Germany do not find it easy to accept the Nato and EU newcomers as equals. This was clear when President Chirac chided Poland and other members of the former Soviet bloc for signing a letter of support for the US ahead of the Iraq war. “They had lost,” he said at the time, “a good opportunity to stay silent.”

The Germans also suspect that the US is again trying to drive a wedge between “old” and “new” Europe.

Poland was surprised by the German response. Where Germans see conspiracy, Poland sees a chance to bring them into the loop. “I’m afraid there is some misunderstanding,” Wlodzimierz Cimoszewicz, the Foreign Minister, said. “We would like as many European partners as possible.”

Deep down, most German politicians are unwilling to accept the concept. From the days of Bismarck until 1945, the Poles were seen as a subject people by Prussians and by Germans. The notion that a Polish captain can give orders to a German soldier will take some getting used to.


TOPICS: Extended News; Foreign Affairs; Germany; News/Current Events
KEYWORDS: peacekeepers; postwariraq
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To: SAJ
I disagree that having the Russians or Germans command eachother has been done. From recent Polish history, they fought bravely in WWII on horseback in a lost cause against how they had already been was sliced up by Hitler and Stalin, this is a MOST delicious historical Irony.

About the article; “remind President Kwasniewski who exactly has been the strongest champion of Polish entry into the EU” is anyone else getting tired of how Old Europe's only card, which they play over and OVER again, is the club they invented rather than any military success. Pathetic.

Welcome to the club of respectable military powers Poland. Let me just dust off this chair for you that says Fatherland and push the chair in for you.

You bet Rumsfeld did this to further divide! Absolutely BRILLIANT move Rummy.

21 posted on 05/07/2003 4:29:01 PM PDT by PeoplesRep_of_LA (Press Secret; Of 2 million Shiite pilgrims, only 3000 chanted anti Americanisms--source-Islamonline!)
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To: Pokey78
If the Germans don't like it they can just pull their men right out of the NATO forces.
I'm sure they will be happy to serve under Poles in the new EU armed forces.
22 posted on 05/07/2003 4:29:31 PM PDT by RS (nc)
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To: joesnuffy
Let the Germans suck eggs with the French.
23 posted on 05/07/2003 4:32:41 PM PDT by Longlines (Lurker Par Excellance watches Fox America's News Network)
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To: Pokey78
Germans dismayed that Poles could command their troops

Germany didn't have a problem with commanding Poland in 1939.

The headline doesn't even say "will command", just "COULD command".

24 posted on 05/07/2003 4:36:04 PM PDT by jrushing
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To: Pokey78
The Poles EARNED their right to command a sector. They stood beside us and they EARNED it.
25 posted on 05/07/2003 4:40:46 PM PDT by McGavin999
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To: Pokey78
Poland recognises that it has no experience in leading a multinational force.

No time better than the present to start getting that experience. I'm proud of our Polish friends.

26 posted on 05/07/2003 4:52:36 PM PDT by AmericaUnited
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To: AmericaUnited
Nod it was a brve move by poland to not only voice support but offer troops as well.
27 posted on 05/07/2003 4:56:57 PM PDT by may18
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To: Pokey78
The Germans also suspect that the US is again trying to drive a wedge between “old” and “new” Europe.

Hardly. It was "old" Europe that created the division.

28 posted on 05/07/2003 4:59:04 PM PDT by Eala (irrelevant (î-rèl´e-vent) 1:The UN 2:France 3:CNN 4:Tim Robbins 5:Chretien 6:Doonesbury)
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To: Pokey78
hey germany, go choke on a polish sausage.
29 posted on 05/07/2003 4:59:39 PM PDT by isom35
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To: Pokey78
Poland earned it, they stood up for Freedom. Socialist Worker's parties sure don't like taking orders from free men. Understandable.
30 posted on 05/07/2003 5:00:20 PM PDT by Arkinsaw
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To: Pokey78
GERMANY has responded angrily to a proposal that its troops be deployed in northern Iraq under the command of Poland,...

Revenge is a dish best served cold.

31 posted on 05/07/2003 5:08:20 PM PDT by Mike Darancette (Soddom has left the bunker.)
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To: Pokey78
Sounds like the Germans still have a few Master Race hang-ups to work out. Springtime for Kwasnieski and Poland. Winter for Schroder and France.
32 posted on 05/07/2003 5:08:24 PM PDT by speedy
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To: Pokey78
Perhaps we should insert an intermediary in the chain of command between the Polish leaders and the subordinate Germans. Might I suggest the Singaporeans.
33 posted on 05/07/2003 5:17:01 PM PDT by Faraday
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Comment #34 Removed by Moderator

To: Pokey78
Let's see DU tackle this one. Let's also see photos of Poles in service at Iraq theatre. Any acknowledgement is missing thusfar in mainstream American press.
35 posted on 05/07/2003 5:26:53 PM PDT by nettlsome
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To: Pokey78
A most delicious development! I think my smile will last at least through the morning tomorrow.
36 posted on 05/07/2003 5:32:05 PM PDT by Petronski (I'm not always cranky.)
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To: Pokey78
GERMANY has responded angrily to a proposal that its troops be deployed in northern Iraq under the command of Poland, one of the newest members of Nato.

Eff off, Fritz. I don't think anybody invited you anyway.

37 posted on 05/07/2003 5:32:08 PM PDT by Cachelot (~ In waters near you ~)
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To: PeoplesRep_of_LA
I don't recall Russians serving under Germans or the other way around. May have occurred, may not have. That wasn't the point at all.

Since you fancy irony, imagine the absolutely marvelous irony of EITHER of these situations occurring with 2 nations who have loathed each other for centuries (the very brief Hitler-Stalin rapproachment notwithstanding, of course).

38 posted on 05/07/2003 5:33:51 PM PDT by SAJ
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To: Billthedrill
Right you are, I do believe that that is what M. Chiraq (proper spelling, now and forever) intends.

Where DO these megalomaniacs come from, anyway? Sheesh.

39 posted on 05/07/2003 5:36:19 PM PDT by SAJ
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To: Pokey78
LOL...Old Europe being snobbish and elitist AGAIN!
40 posted on 05/07/2003 5:36:29 PM PDT by cake_crumb (UN Resolutions=Very Expensive, Very SCRATCHY Toilet Paper)
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