U.S. CUTS FOE DOWN TO SIZE

New York Post ^ | 3/29/03 | NILES LATHEM

[kattracks]

March 29, 2003 -- WASHINGTON - U.S. air and ground forces have systematically wiped out more than a third of Saddam Hussein's fearsome Medina Division guarding a critical approach to Baghdad, officials said yesterday.

In one dramatic raid last night, the 101st Airborne Division - in their first action of the war - blasted the Medina, an elite Republican Guard unit near Karbala, about 50 miles south of Baghdad.

[TheLion]

"It is widely believed that Gen. Tommy Franks won't order the tanks and 15,000 troops of V Corps to surge forward until 50 percent of the Medina Division has been degraded".

Why stop at 50%?

[MEG33]

I'm as wary of gung ho reports as I am of gloom and doom.

[TheLion]

Especially when they report destroying 4 tanks! There are 100's of them in these divisions!

[wretchard]

Two downed AH-64s in exchange for 25 odd vehicles is not a good exchange. This is a tough target.

[fightinJAG]

I'm thinking that the more time they have to consolidate in Baghdad, the worse it will be. A 50% degradation of the Medina division probably is a good break-even point. We can punch through safely and swiftly at that point, plus deny them additional time to go into houses in Baghdad.

[KeyWest]

65% degraded is 35 out of 100. So you have two looks at the action, one that is limited to what the reported sees in a battle and one the General sees from the overall picture. Both have to be taken in context. We seem to be leaping to conclusions quickly with every pro or con report from the field. Like a roller coaster.

[TheLooseThread]

"Two downed AH-64s in exchange for 25 odd vehicles is not a good exchange. This is a tough target."

I had heard that one crashed during takeoff and the other during landing. I suppose the landing could be battle related, but the takeoff?

[Nayt2]

from fox news:
http://www.foxnews.com/story/0,2933,82479,00.html

The Associated Press reported that two Apache helicopter gunships crashed on their return, but all crew members escaped injury -- however, senior Defense officials told Fox News that all of the Apaches that were dispatched returned to base. One came back experiencing mechanical problems, and its touchdown was rough -- a hard landing -- but all the Apaches came home safe.

good news! i trust fox far more than the associated press.

[eno_]

...fiber optics communications tower...

Now we know why Worldcom and Global Crossing went bust: they buried their fiber.

[defeat_the_dem_igods]

Are you looking for a way to lend your support for our courageous troops?

The USO is in need of monetary donations. I'm told that 'Care' package shipment has been temporarily suspended by order of the Department of Defense.

Our North Carolina affiliate is :

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Judy Pitchford, Executive Director

with their web-site :

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or, you can find a location nearest to you at :

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[wretchard]

The crews were safe. I think one pilot broke his leg. The aircraft are back. Good news.

[txzman]

Geraldo showed that the fine dust at the landing site - like talcum powder - makes visibility on takeoff and landing zero, and extremely hazardous.

Apparently the pilots are without any visual guides whatsoever when landing or lifting off.

[Wonder Warthog]

I'm thinking that the more time they have to consolidate in Baghdad, the worse it will be. A 50% degradation of the Medina division probably is a good break-even point. We can punch through safely and swiftly at that point, plus deny them additional time to go into houses in Baghdad."

I think what is going on is to PREVENT exactly that. By keeping the Republican Guard troops OUT of Baghdad as long as possible, and whittling their numbers down severely, there will be fewer of them to GO BACK into Baghdad and cause trouble.

In fact, from some news blurbs, I recall that a lot of the air power is being used to actively prevent the RG from getting back into Baghdad.

[fightinJAG]

Yeah. That's what I meant. Someone asked why degrade the Medina division only 50%? My point was the same as yours: because the objective is to keep most of the RG from retreating into Baghdad.

We need to degrade the Medina division some in order to get between it and Baghdad and keep the RG from retreating. If we spend too much time pounding Medina, we won't accomplish (as well) the objective of blocking the RG retreat.

So we're balancing.

[gonzo]

"...U.S. military officials said the Medina, which has 10,000 troops and hundreds of tanks and artillery pieces, has been "degraded" to about 65 percent of its capacity after a week of relentless attacks from coalition bombers, helicopters and artillery.

Once a division had been degraded to 50%, it is ineffective as a fighting force. Those old Russian tanks are just target-practice now...........FRegards

[Timm]

Whatever the truth to the recent reports of a six-day "pause", a delay to allow air units to pick off various components of the Medina and Nebukaneezer divisions is a good idea. Though Iraq has learned from its defeat in 1991, the placement of these units outside of Baghdad is a repeat of the mistakes of the last war. Those units are out in the open, vulnerable to American air, without any prospect of air defense or successful counterattack on the ground. In such a situation, time is on our side. The longer they sit out there, the more of them will be killed, and the more equipment destroyed. So as long as the RG is just holding position outside the city, there isn't much point in rushing in, whatever other reasons for waiting there might or might not be because of the need for reinforcements for ground troops or the need to "protect our supply lines".

Of course, Iraq's forces don't have to sit there, but they don't have any really good alternatives. Iraq's situation has always been desperate, and perhaps this pause will cause the news media to notice this fact at long last. The RG could retreat into Baghdad, but this is to surrender the "ring" around the city, and therefore the ability to lay seige to Baghdad, to the coalition without a fight. They could attack, but they would be annihilated-- and fact learned from the last war seems to be the one that has impressed the Iraqis the most.

Retreat of at least much of their force is probably their best option; it has some chance of drawing us into a fight now, before their forces are completely shattered. It also leaves the units intact for urban battling. But notice what this fact says about Iraq's situation. The retreat would concede that Iraq's only plausible strategy has been to surrender all of the country but downtown Baghdad without an organized fight, and then hope that American forces lose their nerve before Saddam falls. That is as desperate a strategy as you ever see in organized conflict.

[harpo11]

USA Troops are rockin' rackin' 'em up and rollin' into Baghdad.

I just hope they crush that demonic city into one big sandy dung heap.

[HoustonCurmudgeon]

About the 50% number, at one time the Iraqi RG Divisions used the same tactics as the Russians, THOUGH I DO NOT KNOW IF THIS IS STILL TRUE. At 50% loss a Russian Division would "go to ground" and stay in place. IF the RG did this we could wipe them out where they stand.

[irish guard]

>>>>"Two downed AH-64s in exchange for 25 odd vehicles is not a good exchange. This is a tough target."

I had heard that one crashed during takeoff and the other during landing. I suppose the landing could be battle related, but the takeoff?<<<<<<<<<<

I heard the same just before, that they were tough landings that damaged the craft...apparently, when the dust kicks up, the pilot cannot see the LZ at the base and sometimes they hit pretty darn hard....These were not combat related damages, unless you count the landing back at home combat!

Well sometimes Mrs. irish guard gives me a bit of a rough landing at home!!! But that is another story.