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1 posted on 12/29/2002 8:59:44 AM PST by scripter
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To: scripter; sinkspur
Hey Sink...Let's hear from you on this thread. I'd be most interested in hearing your view point with this information.

Don't be shy...we're amongst friends here!!

SR

95 posted on 12/31/2002 2:11:25 PM PST by sit-rep
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To: scripter
BUMP for Scott Lively who stayed in our home in Fresno one night. A true American hero. And is he smart!!! His kids are pro life activists, too. For victory & freedom!!!
121 posted on 01/01/2003 5:01:09 AM PST by Saundra Duffy
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To: scripter
Gay advocates of "domestic partnerships" are in effect saying to other homosexuals, that it is only acceptable to be "gay" as long as other homosexuals conform to their hypocritical standard of monogamy. The general public discussion about marriage, homosexuality and "domestic partners," does not address the central issue - - monogamy is a sectarian establishment of religion in the law and violates the First Amendment’s prohibition "regarding an establishment of religion, or prohibiting the free exercise thereof..."

Various homosexual pressure groups that claim to support "equality" never address bisexuality and the idea that a bisexual is not allowed to benefit from relationships with persons of both sexes. Nor are they, the Left Wing Media, and Left Wing Educational Establishment willing to discuss polygyny or polyandry, which are, or have been traditions for Muslims, Mormons, Hebrews, Hindus, Buddhists and Africans, as well as other Pagan cultures. The two sides currently represented in the same-sex marriage debate both want special rights for monogamists. However, the proponents of heterosexual only marriages are willing to concede that a homosexual has just as much a right to marry a person of the opposite sex as any heterosexual does. [Incidentally, the desire to have children is a heterosexual desire.]

Nowhere in the religious texts of the above mentioned cultures is there a prohibition of polygamy and I challenge any scholar of theology, literature or history to refute it with proof from the Judeo-Christian Bible, Holy Qur’an, Mahabharata, Rig Veda, or Dhammapada. The ignorance of these historical and cultural facts is evidence of the failed public education system and the fig leaf covering the personal bias of certain staff members in the Left Wing Press and Left Wing Educational Establishment concerning facts, reporting them and/or teaching them.

To allow an institution of homosexual marriage in a monogamous form requires some sort of moralistic meandering to justify it and prohibit any form of polygamy. Upon what basis, if we are to assume it is discrimminatory to not allow homosexuals to "marry," can there be a prohibition of the varying forms of polygamy? Especially, since the First Amendment is specific in forbidding an establishment of religion in the law and is supposed to protect the people's right to assemble peaceably? The entire issue of "same-sex" marriage hinges upon the assumption that monogamy is the only form of marriage. I contend that it is based upon human biological reproduction and is outside of the government's authority to regulate in regard to the First Amendment...

To bolster some of my assertions:

-

"What gay ideologues, inflated like pink balloons with poststructuralist hot air, can't admit, of course, is that heterosexuality is nature's norm, enforced by powerful hormonal cues at puberty. In the past decade, one shoddy book after another, rapturously applauded by p.c. reviewers, has exaggerated the incidence of homosexuality in the animal world and, without due regard for reproductive adaptations caused by environmental changes, toxins or population pressure, reductively interpreted bonding or hierarchical behavior as gay in the human sense."

About the writer: Camille Paglia is professor of humanities and media studies at the University of the Arts in Philadelphia.

-

The issue of polygamy is an Achille's heel for both popular sides of the same-sex marriage issue. The religious cannot find a prohibition of it in their sacred texts. The advocates have to resort to a litany of moralistic meandering based upon the creationist philosophy they claim to oppose to justify it. Both want special rights for preferred groups and are not interested in the individual freedoms of free association. They both want an establishment of religion in the law no matter how much they will deny that.

Unless you like conforming to the religionist dictates, I suggest you and others re-examine the B.S. the guardians of political correctness on the Religious Left have been feeding you.

The First Amendment is very unambiguous. The creationist cultural patent of monogamy is an establishment of religion in the law. The idea that some people get a preferred status based upon their personal relationships goes against the idea of individual rights and the idea of equal protection before the law. What of the people's right peaceably to assemble? It does not take an advanced legal education to comprehend the very clear language of the First Amendment. I say the federal and state governments have no Constitutional authority to be in the marriage business at all, except where each individual has a biological responsibility for any offspring they produce. With "reproductive rights," there must be reproductive responsibilities.

In addition, prohibition of polygyny, polyandry and various forms of polygamy (which includes bisexuals) is not consistent with Roe v. Wade - - society has no right to intervene in private reproductive choices. The recent case of a polygynist being prosecuted in Utah is a great example. Do the women associated with the man who fathered those children have a "right to choose" who they want to mate and produce offspring with? Does the man have a right to choose concerning the production of his progeny? Roe v. Wade says societal intervention in private reproductive choices is a violation of individual liberties. What implication does this also have concerning welfare and public funding of abortions? The issue of polygamy tears down a lot of the sacred cows...

BEFORE YOU BLINDLY REACT, THINK ABOUT WHY I SAY THIS...

The so-called empowerment of women and rights of women have been appropriated by a few to mean rights of the few and no longer means an individual woman’s right to equal treatment. Some would emphasize the "inalienable right" of women to decide whether or not to bear a child. This has the effect of defining women as reproductive units rather than as human beings. Real women’s rights would emphasize greater opportunities for education and employment instead of emphasizing a cult of fertility which leads to economic dependency on men and the rest of society, including homosexual men and women who do not reproduce.

The inaccuracies concerning the political economy of sex as portrayed by pro-"choice" advocates deserve a thorough review: Reproductive "choice" is made when two heterosexual people decide to engage in adult relations, not after the fact. The desire to have children is a heterosexual desire. Provided it is a consenting relationship, no woman is forced to become pregnant. Modern science and capitalism (see: Ayn Rand’s Capitalism: The Unknown Ideal and Camille Paglia’s Sexual Personae) have provided methods to give women pre-emptive power over the forces of nature. No woman has control over her body; only nature does. It is modern Western Civilization that gives women power over nature, not Roe v. Wade. [Incidentally, Roe v. Wade, if strictly interpreted, would prohibit public funding for abortion since public funding for abortion is a form of societal intervention in reproduction - - the very thing prohibited by Roe v. Wade.] One may reply Roe v. Wade is part of a larger good called "women’s rights," but this is really a disguise, consigning other women (those who don’t reproduce or those who oppose abortion) to second class citizenship.

This topic is applicable to homosexuality, both the male and female variety, as well as to sexual crimes. The choice to engage in any type of sexual activity is an individual’s, provided of course, he or she is not victim of a sexual assault. It is absurd to claim the rapist has no control over his actions and it is equally ridiculous to say a homosexual does not have a choice not to involve him or herself with another. The same is true for heterosexual females - - being a woman is not an excuse for making poor choices. The idea that "the choice to have an abortion should be left up to a woman" does not take into account the lack of a choice to pay for such services rendered: The general public is forced to pay massive subsidies for other people sex lives. Emotive claims that the decision to have an abortion is a private one is refuted by the demands of those same people who want public funding for their private choices and/or mistakes.

An adult male or female can be sent to the penitentiary for engaging in carnal pleasures with a minor. One female schoolteacher had become the focus of national attention because she produced a child with her juvenile student. She went to prison while pregnant the second time from the very same child student. Courts allowing a minor female to have an abortion without parental consent or notification can destroy evidence of a felony (such as molestation, rape or incest). Those courts and judges therein have become complicit in the destruction of evidence and are possible accessories in the commission of a felony.

Another source of amazement is the concept of those who hold candlelight vigils for heinous murderers about to be executed, a large number of whom think it is acceptable to murder an unborn child without the benefit of a trial. Is the "right to life" of one responsible for much murder and mayhem more important than that of a truly innocent unborn child? Perhaps we should call capital punishment "post-natal abortion" and identify abortion as a "pre-natal death sentence" or "pre-natal summary execution." Your "reproductive freedom" is my economic and environmental tyranny.

The societal practice of abortion is ritual mass murder upon the altars dedicated to idolatrous vanities, a collective human sacrifice to pagan idols... LIKEWISE, societal practice of the Gay Religion of homosexuality is an idolatrous vanity of pagan practice based not on any biological foundation of human reproductive science, but based upon inductive arguments, informal fallacies, invalid argument forms in both categorical and propositional logic...

122 posted on 01/01/2003 5:38:52 AM PST by Sir Francis Dashwood
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To: scripter
Well, I've read everything posted so far. Very informative. So at the risk of being kicked in the head by both sides here, I'd like to comment.

Why don't everyone just give up all activities designed to culminate with orgasm for the next 20 years?

Think of the benefits:

1 - All sexual diseases would be eradicated from the face of the earth.
2 - Honesty in all relationships would flourish because sexual pre-motivation would not be the driving force.
3 - Wars around the world would end because there would be no next generation to fight them. You can bet the old men are not going to return to the battlefield.
4 - After 20 years without babies, how the world would again treasure the infants.

I'm outta here!

133 posted on 01/01/2003 9:30:34 AM PST by Eastbound
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To: scripter
From "Homosexual Priests: A Time for Truth":

"... The homosexual movement has a history of trying to claw its way into places its agenda doesn’t belong, not for the betterment of mankind, but simply to legitimize and normalize perverse behavior. This is apparent in the all-too-common need of homosexuals to declare their sexuality rather than simply do the job they sign on to do.

This is extremely detrimental—first, it creates conflict with others as most believe homosexuality to be wrong, and it shows that the full efforts of the employed homosexual are not going towards performing the task at hand but largely to declaring their lifestyle. When it comes to serious concerns such as the Church, schools, and the Boy Scouts that involve our children, we can’t take the risk of giving them this power to destroy the values we as parents try to instill, nor can we put our country’s welfare at stake by turning these pivotal foundational institutions and our military into homosexual social experiments.

The homosexual movement is marked by two major tendencies: the tendency to continually infiltrate all good aspects of society; and once they have achieved that, the tendency to destroy this good. Public education, the Boy Scouts, the military, and now the Catholic Church have been targeted, and all have been hurt by the effects of homosexuality. The media and the Church must break its silence towards this enemy. If they do not, the people themselves must rise up and expose it..."


139 posted on 01/01/2003 11:29:41 AM PST by EdReform
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To: scripter; Clint N. Suhks; Remedy; William Terrell; Bryan; John O
Normality or Disorder: Answering the Question

Archives of General Psychiatry Article Asks, Could Homosexuality be a "Developmental Error"?

New Study Confirms Higher Level of Psychiatric Disorders Among Men and Women Engaging in Same-Sex Behavior

(Same-Sex Sexual Behavior and Psychiatric Disorders)

145 posted on 01/01/2003 5:11:24 PM PST by EdReform
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To: scripter
Thanks for posting this.

He who defines the terms controls the debate -- and by extension, public opinion.

Amen brother. Bump for further reading.

153 posted on 01/02/2003 5:38:09 AM PST by Aquinasfan
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To: scripter
Homosexual activists publicly associate this label with violent "gay bashers" and hateful fanatics. When they use the term they want people to think about the killers of Matthew Shepard, but in conventional practice they include every man, woman and child who believes homosexuality is abnormal or wrong

That would make the homosexual torturers and murderers of Jesse Dirkhising hetero-bashers.

NEVER let the name 'matthew shepard' be used without remembering the vile murder of Jesse Dirkhising by a supposedly monogamous homosexual couple.

God Save America (Please)

154 posted on 01/02/2003 6:15:46 AM PST by John O
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To: ArGee; Khepera; *SASU
For your reading pleasure.

GSA(P)

157 posted on 01/02/2003 7:18:32 AM PST by John O
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To: scripter
Instead, even when engaging in homosexual acts, a person remains inherently and immutably heterosexual by nature. Sexual orientation is just a theoretical model that lets you pretend that sexuality is a subjective state-of-mind and not an objective physical reality.

Huh? If a homosexual is inherently and immutably heterosexaul by nature, then why does he desire to sleep with members of the same sex in the first place? All of this guy's arguments are weak and easily challenged.

198 posted on 01/02/2003 12:37:57 PM PST by The Green Goblin
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To: scripter
If only it were a matter of logic. But logic has nothing to do with it. Depending on who you are talking to, it is a matter of feelings or of primal urges.

Acceptance of homosexuality is one of the final steps in the Abolition of Man. We are simply animals who can not think or control ourselves, but must do what our urges tell us to do.

Shalom.
199 posted on 01/02/2003 12:44:04 PM PST by ArGee
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To: scripter
A big Scott Lively BUMPEROO! For victory & freedom!!!
355 posted on 01/16/2003 11:31:15 PM PST by Saundra Duffy
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