Posted on 11/24/2002 10:00:53 AM PST by madfly
Personal Story: Interview with Tom Tancredo Bill O'Reilly
11/21/2002
Fox News: The O'Reilly Factor
O'REILLY: Thanks for staying with us. I'm Bill O'Reilly.
In the "Personal Story" Segment tonight, as you may know, Republican Congressman Tom Tancredo has criticized both Republicans and Democrats for doing very little about the chaos on U.S. borders. Now we learn that top Bush adviser Karl Rove told Mr. Tancredo he is unwelcome at the White House.
The congressman joins us now from Denver.
All right. So tell us about this dustup with Rove.
REP. TOM TANCREDO (R), COLORADO: All right. Well, that happened, actually, quite some time ago.
I think it was probably last April when I did a story -- I mean, I did an interview with "The Washington Times," and my comments in that -- in the paper caused Mr. Rove to give me a call the next day. And I was just leaving my house, you know, with my cell phone, took the call. It says, "White House."
I think, "Wow. This is" -- and it's Karl Rove, and he -- he was very upset, of course, and, during the course of the conversation, he said -- well, I -- he said, first of all, that I was being disloyal to say the kind of things I said because I am, of course, concerned about this immigration issue. It's huge. I lay it at the feet of Republicans, Democrats, the Congress, and the administration. He was very mad about that.
I told him, "I am not disloyal to the president. Disagreeing with the president does not mean you're disloyal. I happen to agree with the president 90 percent of the time, probably 99 percent of the time. In this case, we disagree. And the issue is so big that I'm not going to walk away from it because it happens to be the White House that I'm having a fight with. I don't like this. I didn't want to pick the fight, I assure you."
But he then said -- at some point during the conversation, his comment was, "Well, don't ever darken the doorstep of the White House." That was -- that was his direct quote.
O'REILLY: So no Christmas party for you huh?
TANCREDO: Well, that's it. I was wondering what -- my wife was really upset about that. She likes the Christmas party.
O'REILLY: Yes. Was there a specific comment you made to "The Washington Times" that...
TANCREDO: Yes.
O'REILLY: What was that?
TANCREDO: Yes. I said that, if we have another event like 9/11 and if we have not done any more to protect our borders than we have done, "at that time -- and, by the way, still at this time -- "and if this event was perpetrated by someone who has come across those borders illegally or who is here legally but then overstays the visa and all of the rest of that stuff and we don't catch it, then I'm saying that the people who are killed in that attack -- we are -- the blood of those people is really on our hands in the Congress and in the administration because...
O'REILLY: All right. So he didn't like...
TANCREDO: ... frankly, who else are you going to blame?
O'REILLY: ... that because, as you know, Malvo -- subsequently, John Lee Malvo, another INS botch -- and, apparently, by his own admission, he killed 10 Americans and wounded three others. I guess he is the trigger man now for most of these things.
TANCREDO: Yes.
O'REILLY: Not the -- not only the Bush White House -- and, by the way, we called Karl Rove, and he has no comment on you. But he doesn't like you. But he doesn't like me either, I don't think.
TANCREDO: I get that feeling.
O'REILLY: Yes. I mean, you know...
TANCREDO: The president has -- you know, frankly, Bill...
O'REILLY: What are you going to do? You've got to be honest, and, if you believe what you believe -- and I think you're a sincere man -- I mean, it's your duty to speak out, even if they don't like it.
But here's the rub. Most Americans agree with you, Congressman -- and they agree with me -- that the U.S. military should be moved to the borders to stem the flow of illegal immigration, not to shut the borders down but to plug the holes. Now you just got back from the border today, right, or you were there yesterday?
TANCREDO: Last night. Last night.
O'REILLY: What did -- did you see any improvement at all?
TANCREDO: Nothing. Not only that, it is getting worse. The cartels that have been running drugs across that border for years are now running people across the border. They have taken over the illegal immigration part of this thing because it's become very, very lucrative.
They now -- it's only a thousand or $1,500 for a Mexican, but it is $30,000 for a Middle Eastern or an Asian. So they now run the show down there, and, believe me, they have organized it. They -- it is much more dangerous on the border. It is absolute warfare going on down there.
You cannot -- some of the ranchers on that border -- I do not know how they live there. How would you like to have your 13-, 14-year-old son, grandchildren, having -- if they go one mile from their home, from Grandma's house to Mom and Dad's house, they have to be armed. They have -- they cannot go alone. The harassment -- the threat to the land --
It's just amazing what's going on down there. This is a security risk. People are coming across that border who are OTMs -- that's the way they refer to it, Bill -- other than Mexicans. They are Middle Eastern. They are Asian. They are Chinese. They're coming in huge numbers. They...
O'REILLY: And, mostly, you were in Arizona, right? That's where you were...
TANCREDO: Yes, I was right by Douglas. Right by Douglas, Arizona.
O'REILLY: Right. Now the -- look, we believe you because we heard from everybody down there and nobody says it isn't happening. Everybody says it is. Everybody says...
TANCREDO: Yes.
O'REILLY: ... it's a disaster and it continues to get worse, even after 9/11, and we're sitting here going why won't they move the troops to the border? So you're saying now that the drug cartels have taken over the human smuggling because it's so lucrative...
TANCREDO: That's correct.
O'REILLY: ... and, therefore, they're more dangerous because they're more armed. They've bribed everybody they can in Mexico. They've got no problem over there. And they're coming over, and it -- the stakes are even higher. Now when...
TANCREDO: That's because we now have people...
O'REILLY: ... you present this evidence -- when you present the evidence and all the things that you've accumulated, the Border Patrol backs you up, everybody backs you up, and then you say to your Republican peers, "We need to move the troops to the border," you still don't get any support. What do they say to you?
TANCREDO: Well, what they say is, "Tom, that's an action that" -- you know, here's what the exact
I can give you the quote, as a matter of fact, from the head of the Homeland Defense Agency, Mr. Ridge. He said, when we asked him this, "Why will you not put troops on the border? It is our only hope to defend that border, and we can do it with technology and resources," and he said, "Congressman" -- he said, "There are political and culture reasons why we can't do that." Political and cultural reasons.
Now I want -- you know, somebody else is going to have to go and explain to people who are harmed as a result of people coming across this border that there are political and cultural reasons why we can't protect them. I'm not going to do it.
I'm going to do everything I can, no matter how obstreperous I become -- and I know this is going to get ugly. I know this that we may...
O'REILLY: It's already gotten ugly.
(CROSSTALK)
TANCREDO: ... in this.
O'REILLY: It's...
TANCREDO: It's already gotten ugly.
O'REILLY: But at least Ridge is honest.
TANCREDO: The only thing...
O'REILLY: At least Ridge is honest. He's telling you, "We want Hispanic votes."
TANCREDO: Yes. Straight on.
O'REILLY: Right. "We want Hispanic votes in the Republican Party."
TANCREDO: It's political and cultural reasons.
O'REILLY: And, culturally, we don't have a tradition in this country -- although Teddy Roosevelt did move troops to the border. He was the last...
TANCREDO: Sure.
O'REILLY: ... American president -- of course, if you read the Constitution, one of the mandates of the military is to protect and secure the borders of the United States. So there's no problem...
TANCREDO: Isn't that ironic? Isn't that ironic that Mexico uses troops on their border -- all the time on their side of the border?
O'REILLY: Yes. And they're getting paid by the cartel. Their troops. They're getting paid to bring the stuff in here, and we can't...
TANCREDO: On the northern border, yes, you're right.
O'REILLY: All right. Now, look...
TANCREDO: But they -- they will use their troops on the southern border to stop immigration from Guatemala. They will round up...
O'REILLY: Congressman, what I'm going to do is...
TANCREDO: ... Guatemalans.
O'REILLY: What I'm going to do is, on our Web site, billoreilly.com, we're going to have a link to Governor Ridge where people can give their opinion and a link to you. We're going to set that up tomorrow.
TANCREDO: Great.
O'REILLY: And we're going to have Americans who are interested get to give their opinion directly to Governor Ridge and directly to you. So then you can use that in any kind of legislation you may have proposed. And, Congressman, we appreciate it. We think you're right on on this issue, as you know, and we are going to continue on this story.
Thanks very much.
TANCREDO: Thank you.
O'REILLY: And I'm you can't go to the White House Christmas party, but I won't be going either. So maybe I'll come down there...
TANCREDO: Maybe we'll still get invited. Who knows?
O'REILLY: Yes. We'll have our own party.
Upcoming, as THE FACTOR moves along, it's all over. The bachelor has proposed on ABC TV, But some Americans think this is just atrocious. We'll be right back with that opinion in a moment.
Not at all. I'm saying that if the Republicans don't play it right, they will be thrown out of office and the Dems will go right back to bringing in even more immigrants. Clinton illegally rushed through naturalization for hundreds of thousands of known felons in order to improve his numbers in the 1996 election.
If you can accomplish a real good by sacrificing your career, fine. But if you play it wrong, lose your career, and make the situation worse than it was, how does that help?
Sacrificing your life so your fellow-soldiers can win the battle is heroic, but sacrificing the whole company and losing the battle is stupid.
That kinda speaks for itself. Bush has shunned Tancredo who represents those who have elected him on the issues he ran on. Therefore Bush has shunned those republicans. Bush who is also supposedly a conservative and a republican who has a constitutional obligation to protect our borders.
I too have reservations about a full military deployment on our borders. However, I do believe that the military should be utilized to boost our border patrol. They can stand guard and act as a deterrent to border crossers. Small, specialized units, should be used to extract Federales, Mexican police, druglords, "Coyotes", who take pot shots at our underarmed border agents and civillian population.
Our border patrol is understaffed and we are being overrun by illegal immigration. Surely, this is a national emergency. The president has a responsibility to protect the nation against all enemies, both foreign and domestic. Bush, trying to make nice with Senor Fox, should remember his Constitutional responsibility.
That does not respond except to display alot of arrogance on your part. And illegal immigration includes more than one issue.
Please cite specifics as to how Bush is failing to meet those please...
You just asked me how is Bush not protecting the border. That is silly. We have a completely unchecked flow of illegals coming across to water stations aired on the news with maps and beacon towers so they can find them easily. Along with this comes a multi-billion dollar drug trafficking and the trafficking of illegal aliens from countries such as china and the middle east, WHICH easily displays the threat of terrorism.
You remember 9/11 right? You remember the sniper shootings just recently right?
Hope that helps.
So what they cant do anything. The INS wont allow that and the President hasnt done anything to change that.
And one of those snipers was an American citizen if I remember correctly...
Muhummad was a smuggler of illegal aliens and was connected to a fake-documents operation. He was caught trying to bring in two women and then released by the INS.
Thanks, Governor Ridge for letting us know that Homeland Defense is just another bureaucratic government BS agency that doesn't really intend to protect us. It gives more powers to the executive office, reduced our freedoms but won't protect our borders from terrorists crossing over in the wake of warnings that the next attack is imminent and it will be spectacular. This refusal to protect our borders is the most illogical thing I've heard, yet.
Now what your statement says to me - if President Bush does what needs to be done on the immigration problem, he will be toast. Now, you have to understand I personally believe America as we know it is at stake. NOt just the question of the illegal Mexicans and their harm. I am talking of potentional terrorists getting through. Now anyone with two cells working knows they will try to get through from Mexico and with our present set up most assuredly are getting through.
So we do nothing substantive to stop this and Republicans stay in power, so the dreaded democrats don't get the US. It will take something substantive to get the job done, it is a very large problem. As most problems get that are ignored. At the same time, we have turned it over to terrorists and illegal aliens. Those are your only two options. Now when the illegals are given the right to vote, the democrats will be in anyway - so why not do what is right and save the country.
Your premise that the Republicans would loose if PRes. Bush does the right thing is just a premise. I suggest he will get even more votes from Americans who are tired of this. He most likely will get more black votes; he most likely will get more of the Americans of Mexican decent (they are also sick of it), and I am betting he will get more of the white vote. Now if the illegals are gone or are barred from voting until they can be 'gone' - their vote will be moot.
So my question still stands, President Bush does nothing that has teeth, we have a country given away to illegal aliens and a country that has out a welcome sign for terrorist. Now does it matter if that country has a Republican or Democrat majority. It is lost. Do you see what I mean?
[If you can accomplish a real good by sacrificing your career, fine. But if you play it wrong, lose your career, and make the situation worse than it was, how does that help?]
And now the premise that he will sacrifice his career is debatable, I don't think that is a foregone conclusion.
No one has a crystal ball. We don't ever know if what we do will accompish what we want. Most people seem to be willing to sacrifice American military and we don't know what the outcome of the Iraqi or any war will be. In a war, I assume, we feel we can risk American lives because to do nothing or do less than is necessary is unthinkable. I believe we are at that point in this country. This is war, pure and simple and either you do what needs to be done or you don't. But don't pretend saving your career is for the American good - it doesn't fit. [Sacrificing your life so your fellow-soldiers can win the battle is heroic, but sacrificing the whole company and losing the battle is stupid.]
As I said I am not sure his political career is at stake - but what is the alternative. Piecemeal appeasement will make it worse. He has two years to do this and he can make great strides. He could have already had the lion's share accomplished had he done what he needed and could have done right after 9/11.
Now my stance is it has nothing whatsoever to do with votes. He is smart enough and so are many Americans to know these people are not going to vote Republican. I just don't see how. They are going to vote for the one who gives them the most goodies. Now in that vein, are we supposed to continue to give them goodies just to keep them in the Rpublican camp. We will have given them the country, what else? You see we end up with something that doesn't even resemble America, or a party that doesn't even resemble a Republican party. If he does nothing drastic, we have lost , either way.
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