Kung fu monks fight for trademark (Shaolin)

Washington Times ^ | 28 September 2002 | Ted Anthony, AP

[Moose4]

BEIJING

[lockeliberty]

Ahhh, grasshopper!

[dts32041]

Grass hopper you must learn the skills of a lawyer so you may protect us.

[RippleFire]

BUMP

[MI]

Snatch the copyright from my hand!!!!

[isthisnickcool]

When you can snatch this tradmark from my hand, you may leave the temple.

[fourdeuce82d]

I'm sure these guys could beat the snot out of *me*, but why they hell don't we ever see them winning UFC type competitions?

[IronJack]

Kung Fu (itself a misleading name) does not allow for demonstration or exhibition fighting. By its very nature, every move must be entirely sincere. To strike a blow in a sparring contest is not a demonstration of the art but a form of bragging. And to a true devotee of Chinese internal arts, the opinion of the world is irrelevant. Winning a competition is meaningless.

[Shooter 2.5]

Winning a competition is meaningless.

That's what I keep telling myself.

[fourdeuce82d]

To strike a blow in a sparring contest is not a demonstration of the art but a form of bragging.

Interesting- I'd read some monks took part in an exhibition match against Muay Thai fighters, and had their sincere, humble, asses handed to them.

Must not have been "real" shaolin monks.

[RichInOC]

"Heh...your lawyers are very good...but my lawyers are far superior to yours."

[IronJack]

Is this where we get into the "My martial arts school is better than yours" argument? Then you tell me about some sensei who teaches an obscure form of Dodo-Kan karate or Lithuanian Nose Boxing who once kicked Bruce Lee's butt in a no-holds-barred match behind the Tulsa bus station. Right?

If it is meaningless to win a martial arts contest, how much less meaning would it have to win this argument?

[fourdeuce82d]

My martial arts school is better than yours..

Don't really have a "My" martial arts school- got a yellow belt in five different styles, any one of which I can use to get my ass kicked in five seconds.

I dunno- guess I was being a smart ass with the whole "got their humble asses kicked" bit- my apologies.

I'm just very, very suspicious of the whole "I will never use my art in anything as banal as competition- but if I had to fight, I would fight like a mighty drunken monkey pecked by a crane while scuttling away from a tigerish crouching dragon."

I suspect the most important thing is the person using the art, and his/her determination to prevail.

and just for you information smart guy, MY sensei does not teach anything as archaic and ineffectual as Lithuanian Nose Boxing- WE study Latvian Butt Cheek Boxing. Taunt me at your peril.

[IronJack]

I suspect the most important thing is the person using the art, and his/her determination to prevail.

Without getting into a lot of the zen, the "internal" arts -- which Shaolin Kung Fu is -- go far beyond "determination." There is a certain "rightness" to the universe, and the imbalances created by combat can be restored in certain ways. Achieving that natural harmony is the ultimate goal, not some ephemeral "victory" that only creates more discord. Sometimes the greatest victory is a loss.

I don't presume to understand the Dao Te Ching or the Book of Change, but it's all there. Or so I'm told.

[fourdeuce82d]

There is a certain "rightness" to the universe, and the imbalances created by combat can be restored in certain ways.

Well...some people believe a salamaner showed Joseph Smith some golden tablets, some believe a carpenter was the son of god, others believe the earth sits upon the back of a giant turtle.

These are all religious beliefs, and not really amenable to proof or disproof. I have to say I do not share the belief that the universe keeps score, or that martial arts practitioners benefit from operating under that assumption.

but that's merely *my* belief.

[IronJack]

I do not share the belief that the universe keeps score

Every field of endeavor, from physics to music, notes that there is order in the universe. To what origin you subscribe that order -- if any -- is the province of metaphysics. But that the order exists is axiomatic and provable. That is as far as I'll venture out onto that philosophical limb.

[section9]

I gotcher martial arts school right here....

Or, better yet...

Be Seeing You,

Chris

[fourdeuce82d]

that the order exists is axiomatic and provable.

Fair enough. But that has nothing to do with whether or not said order is "imbalanced" by interpersonal conflict, nor does it prove that people flinging their elbows/fists/feet about, in whatever style, will increase or decrease said order.

If you believe it does, then you're dealing in religion/metaphysics. I wish you good luck, good fun, good life, etc..