AMY & VINCE - TOOGOOD!

Jesus himself chose to hang out with what some christians would call trash and scum. Drunks and prostitutes. Killers and drop outs. All the while standing in the faces of the religious for their intolerance.

What an incredible pile of fresh, steaming self-righteousness.

Jesus accepts the repentence of sinners, not their sin.

If you have to repent of the same sin ten times in a week, then you haven't left the sin or that life behind and started a new life. You are still in it.

All of those Jesus accepted had accepted Jesus as their Lord and put off their sin. The religious world at the time was at fault because they rejected that repentence, not because they rejected the sin.

The "women should not speak in church" rule was only delivered to the church at Corinth and at Ephesus. In the Greek world at that time women were kept in seclusion and only a shameless woman would speak in public. Therefore Paul instructed the women to keep quiet in accordance with their cultural norms. Also, these scriptures are within a discussion of prophecy and order while delivering it. The commentaries I've read lead me to believe that the problem at Corinth was that the woman were out of control delivering prophecys. This same warning was not given to other churches. And yet more, The delivery of a prophecy in the official congregation (in that day at least) put the woman into a teaching or authoritative position over men, Paul didn't permit women to teach as they were to be subject to their husbands. (from a quick review of the commentaries supplied with the online bible, a most excellent study tool)

Wrong..............again!

Amy Grant clearly has not repented. and is a world class hypocrite for continuting to make money off her "Christian music." If she had any true humility or class, she would stop hawking herself as a Christian musician.

Pardon me......what label does Amy record with?

Hint:It's secular

And what exactly IS the difference between secular and christian? Was it hipocracy for Martin Luther to take bar songs and write christian lyrics to them? I'm sure the bunch that hangs out here (FR) would have had him drawn and quartered. When God made trees....did He write "Made By God" on the trunks? Is a sinner singing songs about the christian experience worse than a christian singing secular music? King David didn't repent publicly for his incident with Bathsheba, yet God call David "a man after my own heart".

Was it an abomination for Jesus to heal on the sabbath? The law said he couldn't.

You are choking at gnats and swallowing camels.

My point in the start of this rediculous conversation was that 1, it is no ones business how Amy and Vince resolved their indiscretion.

2,You haven't a clue as to how forgiveness works.

3,None of us..........not one is worthy. All of us have sinned and will sin again. Not one of us will see heaven without the mercy and blood of Jesus to cover us. If you, John O, Card Carrying, et al. are perfect then go find yourselves some followers, buy some airtime and go compete with the Jan and Paul Crouch crowd. Make sure you wear your Rolex and big hair. Couch potato christians just eat that stuff up.

I miss Keith Green too.

"All of those Jesus accepted had accepted Jesus as their Lord and put off their sin."

And they never sinned again or struggled......right?

Do you think when Jesus told the woman caught in adultery to "go and sin no more" that she stopped sinning?

Do you believe in that old saying that "God will never give us more than we can handle".

Let me tell you something, if we could "sin no more" and handle everything that came our way.......why would we need Jesus?

Are you one of those, Once saved always saved types?

Man - I had no idea this thread went so long. Guess some folks have strong feelings about the subject. I did not notice any mention of the intereview Grant & vince gill gave 20/20 downtown last Thursday. They both denied being intimate before their divorces. They both said their marriages were over when they met BUT that they did not run to each other as lovers, but only as friends, and that the romance developed after they were divorced.

The person that I feel bad for, in addition to Gill's first wife, is Gary Chapman. He cleaned up his act, had a solo music career going on, and that primetime country gig, which i think is now over. he opened up for Amy in 1994 when I saw her perform in Pittsburgh, and he sang this song, which I was impressed by both his performance of and the message in:

Sweet Glow Of Mercy

by Gary Chapman

I've seen the darkness
And it saw me
But here in the light
Where the dark can't see
There is a sweet glow of mercy that covers me
Now I am found 
But once was lost
And there in the gutter
Where the wheels came off
There was a sweet glow of mercy that covered me

It picked me up
And set me right
Brought me day
And killed my night
Mercy's there at every turn
Mercy gives what I can't earn
Gonna let that sweet glow of mercy
Yeah, that sweet glow of mercy
Gonna let that sweet glow of mercy cover me

I've been known to run
But I can't hide
I can't get away 
From the light inside
There is a sweet glow of mercy that covers me
I have fun
I got fast
But when the pull
Of this life has passed
There will be a sweet glow of mercy that covers me

It'll pick me up
And set me right
Bring me day
And kill my night
Mercy's there at every turn
Mercy gives what I can't earn
Gonna let that sweet glow of mercy
Yeah, that sweet glow of mercy
Gonna let that sweet glow of mercy cover me

I'm talking 'bout that sweet glow of mercy
See the sweet glow of mercy
Gonna let that sweet glow of mercy cover me

And if I die before I wake
There's no doubt what soul he'll take
There would be a sweet glow of mercy
Yeah, the sweet glow of mercy
There'll be a sweet glow of mercy that covers me

There will be a sweet glow of mercy
Yeah, a sweet glow of mercy
There'll be a sweet glow of mercy that covers me
I'm living in the sweet glow of mercy
I'm loving that sweet glow of mercy
I'm happy in the sweet glow of mercy that covers me

I'm laughing in the sweet glow of mercy
I'm dancing in the sweet glow of mercy
I'm loving this sweet glow of mercy that covers me

There's such a sweet glow
Such a sweet glow
There is a sweet glow of mercy that covers me

Do you think when Jesus told the woman caught in adultery to "go and sin no more" that she stopped sinning?

Yes, as far as the sin of adultery is concerned.

All the forgiveness in the world is available to Amy and Vince, provided they own up to their sin. Until they acknowledge and repudiate their sin, they carry its guilt and all the consequences of that guilt.

Amy Grant may very well have been right to divorce Gary Chapman (adultery?). But I have never seen anything that legitimizes Vince Gill divorcing his wife.

You seem to think people are rejecting Amy and Vince because they hate Amy and Vince. Exactly the opposite is true. I would love to know that there is some legitimate reason for what they did, and barring that I would love to hear of their repentence.

Love does not rubber stamp sin with a big "OK" just because it is more pleasant for everyone involved. Sometimes love necessitates unpleasantness.

me->The "women should not speak in church" rule

you->Wrong..............again!

As I stated earlier, this is what John Gill and Matthew Henry state in their commentaries. Both have done more bible study than you or I. Since this interpretation is internally consistent with the rest of the word I have to agree with it.

Now, why do you feel the need to revisit an off-topic part of the thread rather than address the points I make on 1 Cor 5? Please show how 1Cor5 can be interpreted differently than I have and still be internally consistent.

GSA(P)

I am curious as to how all of you who are so quick to judge Grant and Gill are so positive there actually was an adulterous affair.

They were both married to other people. They abandoned those people and started cohabitating with each other (they may have been legally married at this point, it's immaterial) while living together they obviously had sex as they have a daughter in common.

In God's eyes they commited adultery the first time they had sex as they are married to other people. God recognizes divorce for adultery (and a case can be made for abandonment and abuse). Since neither Amy or her lover filed for divorce due to their spouses' adultery we have to assume that no adultery on their spouses' part took place. Amy and Gill are living in adultery.

So yes I am sure there was an adulterous relationship there.

GSA(P)

King David didn't repent publicly for his incident with Bathsheba, yet God call David "a man after my own heart".

2 Sam 12:1-14. God sends Nathan to David. David was the king . Where would someone go to him? In private or in the throne room. I'd guess in the throne room otherwise David would have had people traipsing through his bedroom constantly. So when David repented in vs 13 it was public.

My point in the start of this rediculous conversation was that 1, it is no ones business how Amy and Vince resolved their indiscretion.

And my point is that since they sinned against all Christians publicly they need to repent publicly. (Again see 2 Sam 12:14 "by this deed thou hast given great occasion to the enemies of the LORD to blaspheme" (partial quote). There will be a cost to them for their sin)

2,You haven't a clue as to how forgiveness works.

Sure we do. God told us, in brief it goes like this. I repent, God forgives. Pretty simple really.

3,None of us..........not one is worthy. All of us have sinned and will sin again. Not one of us will see heaven without the mercy and blood of Jesus to cover us.

Correct so far. Now how do we get the Blood of Jesus to cover our sins? We repent of them.

If you, John O, Card Carrying, et al. are perfect then go find yourselves some followers,

No one claimed to be perfect, why do you insist on attacking us?

GSA(P)

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