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Mayor wants tiered garbage fees
Raleigh (NC) News and Observer ^ | May 21, 2002 | JOANNA KAKISSIS

Posted on 05/21/2002 4:06:21 AM PDT by RippleFire

Mayor wants tiered garbage fees

Charles Meeker says Raleigh's higher-income residents generally buy more, so they produce more trash.

By JOANNA KAKISSIS, Staff Writer

RALEIGH - Mayor Charles Meeker said Monday he wants the City Council to consider adjusting a proposed increase in the garbage collection fee so that it's based on household income -- a move he says will more equitably distribute the charges.

Meeker and other council members say flat fees for such services are regressive, meaning that poor residents pay the same as richer ones. Meeker also says he's operating on the premise that higher-income residents generally buy more goods -- and therefore produce more trash -- than lower-income residents.

"It's an issue of fairness," he said at the council's first workshop on the city budget that will take effect July 1.

City Manager Russell Allen recommended a 2002-03 budget last week that doesn't call for a property tax increase but that would increase the solid waste fee from $15.60 to $60 a year per household. With that increase, the garbage fees would raise about $4.5 million a year.

For the owner of a house valued for taxes at $200,000, that's roughly equivalent to a 2.2-cent increase on the property tax rate of 38.5 cents per $100 in assessed value. But for the owner of a $100,000 home, the higher garbage fee would be equivalent to a 4.4-cent rate increase.

City Councilwoman Janet Cowell said Meeker's idea is good -- "We need to consider a serious pay-as-you-throw policy," she says -- but worries that it is unrealistic to expect the city's budget staff to restructure the fees in the next six weeks.

The council must approve a budget by June 30, the end of the current fiscal year. It plans its next workshop June 10.

Allen said implementing tiered fees would be difficult, especially when the city is facing the bleakest economic forecast in years. Allen said he doesn't know many cities that use tiered garbage fees, so Raleigh may not have a model to follow.

"I think it would be very difficult to accomplish, since we need to get a tremendous amount of data to find out who would be eligible and what income ranges there are," Allen said. "But we will look and see if we can come up with anything."

City Councilman Neal Hunt also said he's concerned about stopping the city's solid waste collection at apartment buildings -- a move that would save more than $2 million but leave property managers footing the garbage bill. The Triangle Apartment Association has already said it would fight such a move, which it says would force property managers to increase rents to recover costs.

Allen said many cities do not offer trash pickup at apartment complexes, which Allen classifies as businesses. "Every other business in the city pays for its own garbage," he said.

A proposed new stormwater fee is already somewhat tiered based on house size: Owners of small homes would pay $2 a month, while owners of large homes would pay $3 a month. The premise is that bigger homes produce more stormwater runoff.

Meanwhile, the discussion of finding the right balance between fees and government costs could get more anxious if the city loses about $20 million in payments collected by the state. Gov. Mike Easley already withheld $8.1 million this year -- leaving the city scrambling to make up the deficit -- to help plug the state's massive budget hole.

Meeker says he hopes the General Assembly will act on the state's budget before June 30 and return the city's money. The council will vote on a budget that assumes receipt of the $20 million.

If the city loses the $20 million, Allen says it will have to cut street and parks projects, dip into reserves and cut human services and arts grants in half.

"It's pretty clear that going to the $20 million contingency plan would be devastating," he said.


TOPICS: Business/Economy; Constitution/Conservatism; Culture/Society; Government; News/Current Events; US: North Carolina
KEYWORDS: progressivetaxes; raleigh; soaktherich
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Choo Choo Charlie Meeker comes up with another wacky one. "It's an issue of fairness".

How long before we hear that rich people bathe more, so they should pay more for water. Er... maybe that one has problems for Chuckles.

1 posted on 05/21/2002 4:06:22 AM PDT by RippleFire
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To: RippleFire
HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HHA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA, HA.

Only in America

2 posted on 05/21/2002 4:18:41 AM PDT by chachacha
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To: RippleFire
I have more garbage because some residents of my small town frequently deposit their cups and trash from McDonald's in front of my house on their way home.

I think I'll charge the city for street sweeping!

3 posted on 05/21/2002 4:20:55 AM PDT by lonestar
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To: RippleFire
How long before we hear that rich people bathe more, so they should pay more for water.

Thanks for the post. Local government can be unreasonable and socialist too (like the feds.) Of course, never would they consider cutting non-essentials. Fund those arts with tax money no matter what! Good grief.

4 posted on 05/21/2002 4:22:24 AM PDT by toddst
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To: RippleFire
Pretty stupid idea. If anything, garbage fees should be based on how many people live in a dwelling unit. A family of 14 generates more trash than an elderly retired couple--regardless of income.

But, of course, they would never do that because it might be considered "discriminatory" to illegal aliens.

5 posted on 05/21/2002 4:23:30 AM PDT by 07055
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To: RippleFire
The biggest piles of garbage I've seen on trash-day are usually in front of smaller low-income homes.
6 posted on 05/21/2002 4:27:04 AM PDT by SpartacusII
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To: RippleFire
Our city had a good idea with two sizes of garbage can and of course different prices. It was great until I guess someone figured out that it rewarded resposibility.
7 posted on 05/21/2002 4:28:39 AM PDT by doodad
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To: RippleFire
How about a sticker system like some areas have for yard waste. Pay per can. If you generate little garbage, you should pay less.
8 posted on 05/21/2002 4:29:48 AM PDT by HiTech RedNeck
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To: HiTech RedNeck
How about a sticker system like some areas have for yard waste. Pay per can. If you generate little garbage, you should pay less.

In the abstract, it makes sense. But, this really sounds like a solution in search of a problem.

Or more accurately, yet another way to "bash the rich."

9 posted on 05/21/2002 4:41:18 AM PDT by 07055
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To: RippleFire
I've got to calm down before responding to this one.
Mobocracy in action.

What a great illustration of the ultimate folly of allowing everyone indiscriminately to vote.
Isn't there an "equal protection" clause in that useless old document...?
Why stop halfway? If a vote is all it takes, this "use tax" (as it's called everywhere else) can be redistributed in purer socialist form: double the rates for the people actually working, and cut the rate for the parasites by half.
Why not?

10 posted on 05/21/2002 4:42:31 AM PDT by Publius6961
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To: RippleFire
I've got an easier solution. Why doesn't the city insist that residents buy specially marked trash bags (say at the local groceries) to put out their trash. Only trass in these marked bags would be collected. You will pay only for what you generate, there's no argument about incomes, and this actually provides an incentive for folks to be more aware of the amounts they're throwing out.
11 posted on 05/21/2002 4:42:39 AM PDT by mewzilla
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To: RippleFire
I like the idea of a tiered system but it should not be based on income, or house size. It should be based on how much (weight and/or volume) one sends to the dump.

I happen to compost yard and kitchen waste and am religious about recyclables. In addition, if something can be used by someone else, it goes to AmVets, Purple Heart, Salvation Army, etc. If my neighbor wants to pay for a few hundred plastic bags every year to send grass clippings and leaves to the landfill, and I recycle mine into the woods, that should be their choice and their expense.

12 posted on 05/21/2002 4:44:27 AM PDT by leadpenny
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To: mewzilla
That's precisely how it was done when we were living in Binghamton, NY - you'd go to the local market and get special yellow garbage bags that were the only ones the city would pick up. It was something silly like $3 for a package of 5 medium bags, IIRC. Pay-as-you-go semed pretty fair to me.

Yes, that's rather expensive, but the principle could translate to Raleigh just as well, if not those prices. I'm also rather bemused by the notion of $60 per year being too expensive for some folks - where I am it's almost three times that much, at $160 per year ;)

13 posted on 05/21/2002 4:53:26 AM PDT by general_re
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To: RippleFire
pay-as-you-throw policy

A proposed new stormwater fee

Was there a mayors conference recently? Houston's mayor, Lee. P. Brown, recently proposed similar items to increase revenues. These mayors conferences must not spend much time on how to better the cities, but rather scheming on ways to extract more money.

14 posted on 05/21/2002 4:55:06 AM PDT by Flyer
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To: leadpenny
Those with money pay considerable amounts of taxes and fees to subsidize services for the poor, paying in much more than they take out.

Should we tax the poor more because they use public health services more? Should the rich get a break because they don't use the public swimming pools?

Should the rich pay less because they don't use public transportation? Should the poor pay more because they do?

This is a slippery slope that we should not venture down.

15 posted on 05/21/2002 5:11:00 AM PDT by Flyer
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To: Publius6961
Why not?

Why not, indeed.

Would you also call for a one-price policy in a given jurisdiction for electricity and water regardless of consumption?

16 posted on 05/21/2002 5:11:01 AM PDT by leadpenny
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To: general_re
I thought it sounded familiar :)

And folks should understand that it's not just about garabge fees. That trash has to go somewhere and landfills are expensive, especially if you have to transport the trash out of the area. Generating less trash is cheaper all the way around. And folks should be reminded of that.

17 posted on 05/21/2002 5:16:57 AM PDT by mewzilla
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To: Flyer
All of those are valid points. I would argue that those things that can be quantified should be. My guess is that a real problem with a pay-as-you-throw (as someone put it) system is that garbage bags will end up in ditches, thrown there by people trying to avoid the fees.
18 posted on 05/21/2002 5:19:57 AM PDT by leadpenny
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To: leadpenny
garbage bags will end up in ditches

I agree. Here in Houston we have a very successful program, heavy trash day, that eliminates a lot of illegal dumping. We can set out about any volume of just about anything and it will be picked up. As a bonus, the day before has become somewhat of a scavenger day and much of it never makes it to the dump. I recently compiled a complete computer system with monitor that I got working and gave to a neighbor.

Oh, and we are not charged by the volume we have picked up.

19 posted on 05/21/2002 5:28:04 AM PDT by Flyer
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Comment #20 Removed by Moderator


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