How do I contact the designer/producer of the poster with the 10 Commandments, Declaration etc? I'd like to buy a few copies!
Please let me know.
Posted on 01/24/2002 4:46:09 PM PST by DNA Rules
Virginia Bill Would Bring National Motto into the Classroom (CNSNews.com) - The Virginia House of Delegates is expected to take a final vote Thursday on a bill requiring every Virginia public school to post a sign bearing the national motto, "In God We Trust." The bill received preliminary approval on Wednesday. Del. Robert Marshall (R-Prince William), the bill's sponsor, says it is particularly important after the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks to post the motto invoking God in Virginia schools. But on the opposite side of the argument, people who consider the motto "religious graffiti" don't even want it on U.S. currency, never mind in public schools. The current bill, unlike one that died last year, would allow schools to accept private contributions to defray the cost of the "In God We Trust" posters. The motto was placed on U.S. currency, beginning with a two-cent coin in 1864, largely because of increased religious sentiment during the Civil War. In 1865, Congress passed a bill allowing the motto to appear on all gold and silver coins; and it appeared on all U.S. coins starting in 1938.
Ten Commandments legislation rewritten
By MICHAEL NEIBAUER
Journal staff writerDel. L. Scott Lingamfelter, R-Woodbridge, has rewritten his Ten Commandments legislation into what he believes is a constitutionally defensible and value-driven, rather than a religious document.
In the original bill, Lingamfelter proposed that local school divisions be given the option to place the Ten Commandments in their schools. After a debate two weeks ago before the Courts of Justice Committee that ended without a vote, Lingamfelter said he realized his legislation might not stand up to a First Amendment litmus test.
So he went back to the drawing board, read related court decisions and came up with the ``transcendent values in historical texts" bill, an amendment in the form of a substitute.
The rewrite authorizes the creation of a single poster which includes the Ten Commandments, the first sentence of the second paragraph of the Declaration of Independence, two clauses from the Constitution of Virginia and the First Amendment to the U.S. Constitution.
The state Board of Education, in consultation with the attorney general's office, would develop guidelines as to exactly how the poster is designed and where it is displayed in public schools.
``What I'm really trying to do is give local school boards the option to put before kids the values that kind of knit the system of law and freedom," said Lingamfelter, whose altered bill is scheduled for debate Monday in the Courts of Justice Commttee.
The combination of the four texts, he said, demonstrates a ``rich, rich history of linked values" and the evolution of law in America.
Besides the Ten Commandments, the three remaining texts define the basic American ideals of equality, freedom from state established religion and freedom of religious expression.
``I've scanned [the substitute bill] and I think it's a much better approach than the first bill in terms of overcoming some of the constitutional objections people had at that first hearing," said Del. Robert F. McDonnell, R-Virginia Beach, a Courts of Justice Committee member.
McDonnell said it was once common in law schools to use the Ten Commandments, in conjunction with other historical documents, to trace the modern legal system back to its Judeo-Christian beginnings. But that educational technique, he said, has been forgotten over time as schools grow more secular.
``All [Lingamfelter is] trying to do is say, `Look, if you're going to use religious materials in your schools for a secular purpose, then it's OK to do that,'" McDonnell said. ``You can't proselytize, but at the same time you don't want to discourage any facet of religion."
Lingamfelter said he expects the posters would be placed in history and government classrooms where the texts would be applicable to the learning taking place. But those decisions are up to the Board of Education and the attorney general, who would be responsible for defending the law if the state or a local school district is taken to court.
``Where I expect the opponents to fall short, where I hope they fall short, is the recognition that we have historical linkage here," Lingamfelter said. ``I just feel like it's time to stand up and be counted and not be ashamed of the values that underline our nation."
How do I contact the designer/producer of the poster with the 10 Commandments, Declaration etc? I'd like to buy a few copies!
Please let me know.
How's your day going?
Thank you both!
I would have answered a resounding "NO"
Yesterday afternoon a publik skool student saw my daughter coloring a map including Alaska. The straight-A student asked my daughter what Alaska was doing so far north. She indicated that it was supposed to be in the Pacific Ocean off the coast of Washington State. This is a 9th grader!
So, I don't trust in the skools. I homeschool.
Shalom.
Lawmakers bless earthly 'God bills'
Daniel F. Drummond
THE WASHINGTON TIMES Published 2/7/2002
RICHMOND — Virginia lawmakers have traditionally been receptive to legislation blurring the separation between church and state, and this year, measures with religious overtones — including a proposal to allow school boards to post the Ten Commandments in public schools — are sailing through the House of Delegates.
"We have strayed away from the values that this country was founded on," said Delegate L. Scott Lingamfelter, Prince William Republican. "There is just this sense that we have gone too far."
Mr. Lingamfelter is sponsoring the Ten Commandments proposal, just one of several religion-themed pieces of legislation that have come to be known as the "God bills."
Under his proposal, school boards would be allowed to post the Bible's Ten Commandments along with quotes from other historical texts like the Declaration of Independence and the U.S. Constitution in public schools.
"This is not about religion," he said of his bill. "It's about values."
The bill comes up for debate on the floor of the House today. But if the overwhelming passage of several bills that call for the posting of "In God We Trust" in government buildings, courts and public schools is any indication, Mr. Lingamfelter's bill has a good chance of passing in the Republican-controlled House.
"There is a resurgence in displays of patriotism and faith," said Delegate Robert F. McDonnell, Virginia Beach Republican. "These bills reflect what's going on in the culture at large."
But several Democrats and civil libertarians say they believe conservative Republicans are using the tragedy of September 11 to ram through legislation that tears down the wall of separation of church and state even further.
"You can be patriotic without being unconstitutional," said Delegate L. Karen Darner, Arlington Democrat.
Miss Darner said the Ten Commandments proposal probably will not past constitutional muster because the Supreme Court ruled in 1980 that the biblical writings could not be posted in schools.
Although Mr. Lingamfelter said he believes his version of the law — written with help from the Attorney General's Office — will not be overturned in court.
Kent Willis, executive director of the Virginia chapter of the American Civil Liberties Union, said legislators — Democrats and centrist Republicans — are afraid to vote against the religion-themed bills because they fear being branded as unpatriotic.
"At one time, church-state bills, bills that promoted religion, had very few sponsors and were seen as being in the margins and quietly put aside in committee," Mr. Willis said.
This year, though, there has been little discussion and debate on the measures, compared with the discussions two years ago when the General Assembly approved a law requiring students to "meditate, pray or engage in any other silent activity" for one minute in their classroom.
The Supreme Court let that law stand last November.
Delegate Robert G. Marshall, Prince William Republican, is the author of the "In God We Trust" bills. He thinks they will have a better chance now in the Senate, where they were killed last year.
"Maybe they will believe that we should [let] these things get out and get tested in court," Mr. Marshall said.
Mr. Marshall also introduced a bill, which passed overwhelmingly in the House, that would have the state offering "God Bless America" license plates.
And Delegate James K. "Jay" O'Brien Jr., Fairfax Republican, saw his bill that would require teachers to instruct public-school children about patriotic songs, including "God Bless America," sail through the House Education Committee yesterday 22-0.
Gov. Mark R. Warner, a Democrat who ran as a fiscal conservative candidate during last fall's gubernatorial race, has not indicated whether he would sign or veto the "God bills."
House Majority Leader H. Morgan Griffith, Salem Republican, said Mr. Warner's true political colors will show when the "God bills" and other sensitive social-issue measures come across his desk.
"If these bills get to his desk and he vetoes them, it does say something about his political bent as being more liberal than he ran as," Mr. Griffith said.
Washington Times
===============
House backs posting of 'In God We Trust'The House of Delegates yesterday overwhelmingly endorsed letting localities post the national motto, "In God We Trust," in municipal buildings.
The House voted 91-7 in support of the bill sponsored by Del. Robert G. Marshall, R-Prince William. The bill now heads to the Senate.
This was one of three such bills backed by Marshall this year. The others, which earlier passed the House, would require the display in public schools and courtrooms.
Feb 08, 2002
House approves commandments bill
BY PAMELA STALLSMITH
TIMES-DISPATCH STAFF WRITER
Despite objections from some lawmakers over constitutionality and propriety, the House of Delegates gave initial approval to a bill that would let public schools post the Ten Commandments.
The House voted 53-44 in support of the measure that would permit display of the commandments. That followed an intense, 40-minute debate laced with legal and religious references.
Also yesterday, the House granted preliminary support to an anti-domestic violence bill backed by Attorney General Jerry W. Kilgore.
The bill would remove from marital rape cases the requirements that spouses be living apart or that the person charged must have caused bodily injury by the use of force for a spouse to be convicted. Final action on both proposals is likely today.
Del. L. Scott Lingamfelter, R-Prince William, said his Ten Commandments proposal is about values, not religion.
His measure would allow local school boards to decide whether they want to post "The Transcendental Values of a Lawful Society," which would include the Ten Commandments and parts of the Declaration of Independence and the U.S. and Virginia constitutions.
"The display of these documents in no way compels a religious practice any more than if someone were to view this body praying before the beginning of each session," he said on the House floor.
Lingamfelter, a retired Army colonel, originally proposed the display of only the Ten Commandments. But he revised his bill amid concerns it wasn't constitutional. If it becomes law, the state Board of Education and the attorney general's office would have to come up with guidelines for the posting.
Opponents charged the measure violates the separation of church and state. They cited a 1980 U.S. Supreme Court decision that struck down as unconstitutional a Kentucky law that required the posting of the commandments in public schools.
Del. Dwight Clinton Jones, D-Richmond, and a Baptist minister, said the bill is religious because the Ten Commandments is Scripture.
"To me the word of God is holy, and I don't want the attorney general editing it," he said. "I don't want a committee taking it out of context."
Del. Albert C. Pollard Jr., D-Lancaster, said the bill runs contrary to the spirit of the Statute of Religious Freedom.
"Here we are taking a sacred document and we're putting it next to worthy but secular documents and, in my mind, trivializing it," he said. "In my mind, they are not worthy of being placed next to the word of God. . . . As a Christian I find this offensive."
Del. Brian J. Moran, D-Alexandria, said the high court made its ruling "without equivocation."
"Just 30 days ago we swore to uphold the constitutions of the U.S. and Virginia," he said. "This case has clearly been decided by the U.S. Supreme Court. I'd ask you to follow the U.S. Constitution and defeat this legislation."
Gov. Mark R. Warner has not taken a position on the bill, though his lawyer is reviewing the proposal because of constitutional concerns, said spokeswoman Ellen Qualls.
Lingamfelter read a letter from Francis S. Ferguson, a deputy attorney general, that said the proposed statute would be constitutional because of the provision for guidelines.
Del. Robert G. Marshall, R-Prince William, said the commandments hold universal values.
"These are rules that govern human behavior for our benefit," he said. "So it's very surprising to me that we should shield children from statements like 'Thou shalt not commit adultery.'"
Five Democrats and the assembly's two independents joined 46 Republicans in supporting the bill. Fifteen Republicans and 29 Democrats voted against it. Three delegates didn't vote.
The House also held an emotional debate over the anti-domestic violence bill, sponsored by Del. Terrie L. Suit, R-Virginia Beach, which toughens state laws.
Among its provisions, the legislation establishes a state coordinator for programs for victims of domestic violence and calls for the establishment of training standards for law-enforcement personnel on handling such cases.
The marital rape provision generated opposition from several lawmakers, who said changing the law could invite false rape claims by women who are trying to gain an advantage in a divorce situation. The House rejected an amendment to keep the current marital rape provision.
"A charge of rape could intimidate a male to make agreements for divorce or child support," Marshall said, with the threat of felony prosecution and public humiliation.
Supporters of the bill dismissed that argument, explaining rape charges aren't prosecuted lightly. They said such cases are based on evidence, not one person's word against another's.
Suit said the bill was a matter of fairness. Married women should be afforded the same protections under state law as unmarried women, she said.
I thought the national motto was "e plurbus unum"?
McDonnell said it was once common in law schools to use the Ten Commandments, in conjunction with other historical documents, to trace the modern legal system back to its Judeo-Christian beginnings. But that educational technique, he said, has been forgotten over time as schools grow more secular.Our legal system is not based on 'Judeo-Christian' beginnings. It is based on Roman law. I can hardly imagine what the legal system would be like if it actually were based on Christ's teachings. 'Turn the other cheek' is certainly not one of the principles of modern law.
Yes and no.
On July 30, 1956 a law was passed stating that "the national motto of the United States is hereby declared to be 'In God we trust'." (70 Stat. 732. 36 U.S. Code 186). The House Judiciary Committee recognized that the phrase E Pluribus Unum had also received wide usage in the United States, and the joint resolution did not repeal or prohibit its use as a national motto. In 1963 the Department of State took the following position: "'In God we trust'" is the motto of the United States. It seems to the Department, nevertheless, that there is ample basis both in history and I law for calling 'E Pluribus Unum' a motto of the United States." The Congress has used both.
Ya know, thats how it works most of the time but first you have to be exposed to the ideas. Nobody ever forced anyone to become a Christian that I know of but many have tried to block the ideas from being presented. It's does not always occur when you think it should but God does things in his own time and not yours. Now I know that the liberals support free speech and flow of information because they keep telling us that in the news papers.
1)Do you have children?
2)Where/how do you school them?
It's about time that people better start accepting the fact that this nation was established as a Christian nation and that many of the stateS did have accepted practices under the Constitution that would maintain the Christian beliefs. The Constitution only applied to the federal level until the 14th Amendment and case after case can be presented to show that to be true. How else could the stateS have official churches that represented the majority of their populations?
If the state of Virginia wants to put up a motto of 'In God we trust' I don't see a problem with it and for that matter if it's even an issue now, see that state officials are finally starting to realize the exact intent of the Constitution, a federal level document ONLY.
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