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I found it interesting that Elvis did not cite ONE instance where the point of view of the movie ran against the facts. He accuses them of jingoism, but for Elvis I would imagine anything that would have something positive to say about this country would be jingoistic. What a sorry crud this guy is.
1 posted on 12/29/2001 12:10:29 AM PST by Pharmboy
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To: Pharmboy
You know where this review is going when the author has to mention the *only African-American with lines*....I'll wait for other reviews or see it and decide for myself.
2 posted on 12/29/2001 12:10:36 AM PST by mystery-ak
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To: Pharmboy
Notably absent in the critique is the fact that the movie moguls decided not to portray Clinton as the primary culprit in the Soamlia disaster.
3 posted on 12/29/2001 12:10:37 AM PST by TADSLOS
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To: Pharmboy
The reviewer is a typical leftist with the usual grim fixation on race and all the accompanying moral sophistry that goes with it.
4 posted on 12/29/2001 12:10:45 AM PST by junta
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To: Pharmboy
In "Black Hawk Down," the lack of characterization converts the Somalis into a pack of snarling dark-skinned beasts, gleefully pulling the Americans from their downed aircraft and stripping them. Intended or not, it reeks of glumly staged racism.
But this is what actually happened.

Our dead were stripped and paraded through the streets, bestial behavior at its most pure. What degree of characterization could dignify let alone explain this atrocity?
5 posted on 12/29/2001 12:10:46 AM PST by Asclepius
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To: Pharmboy
Funny how BIASed even the movie reviewers are in the New York Times. Pathetic.
8 posted on 12/29/2001 12:10:54 AM PST by spycatcher
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To: Pharmboy
they're like rowdy guys who were left behind in Movie Star High School.

As I have yet to see the movie, I cannot pass judgment on the "rowdy guys", but I can on the reviewer. He was obviously left behind in Movie Reviewer High School.
I have to think his writing career began as government bureaucrat writing military specifications for Osprey purchase orders.

FReegards,

10 posted on 12/29/2001 12:11:01 AM PST by VMI70
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To: Pharmboy
While I may not see it the fact that this clown doesn't like it is a point in it's favor.
12 posted on 12/29/2001 12:11:12 AM PST by Valin
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To: Pharmboy
What a load of leftist sophomoric TRIPE!

You can tell where the author is going when he throws in "jingoistic" in the FIRST SENTENCE!!! Then he seems fixated on coloring even while he decries the movies real depth and substance.

What exactly do blue hues tell us of the history and geo-political significance of this episode.

Then, of course, he denies the humanity of the blacks he would seek to defend by quickly giving them absolution from their own moral agency, while expressing dissapointment in the lack of character development of the (mostly white) American soldiers.

Typical leftie weenie writing a review for the quickly declining movie section of the nations largest gay-daily.

13 posted on 12/29/2001 12:11:16 AM PST by keithtoo
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To: Pharmboy
here is a review from the best movie preview site on the web (in my opinion).

Coming Attractions

December 16, 2001... An extremely positive review for Ridley Scott's Black Hawk Down has been sent to CA from an indivividual who read Mark Bowden's book. Our reviewer, codenamed "The Grit", says Scott's picture lives up to its promise and is an extremely faithful adaptation from the book.

Their review contains both SPOILER and non-spoiler sections. We have marked off the SPOILERS so you have to swipe the space with your cursor. "My buddy is on the AFI voting board and got me into a screening of Black Hawk Down in Santa Monica last week. We were told they were still finishing some effects and the temp score was from Hans Zimmer.

"First off let me say that after having read Mark Bowden's excellent book, my expectations of this film were primarily of the "I hope it doesn't suck too much" brand. The trailers were okay -- The fact that Bruckheimer was producing scared me. Pearl Harbor was the antithesis of what I hoped this movie would be.

"The fact that Ridley Scott was directing gave me hope. What worried me the most was the probability of the film being 'Hollywood-ized' considering the book jumps from so many characters, locations and actions in a very short amount of time. Also, this is one of the best books I have ever read. I went in hoping for something mediocre...

"Holy crap this movie is good.

"This film is absolutely flawless in its beat-for-beat, word-for-word adaptation of the book. There is not a moment or a line in the film that is not in the book or that didn't, for that matter, actually occur. The directing is top notch with Scott's meticulous detail -- the weapons, vehicles, uniforms, military movements, everything is exact. The performances are excellent primarily because none of the actors are given anything to say or do that is not exactly what was actually said and done. Therefore, everyone's performance has a very cool, kinda understated effect. We're not with anyone too long. No one is set up for us to like especially so when they die we feel bad. Everyone is given equal creedence.

"The Rangers are portrayed as they were -- young, kinda excited at first, and then seriously over their head. I never thought I say this, but Josh Hartnett, in particular was great. As Eversmann, the leader of Chalk four, this kid is actually beleivable, not to mention being a dead ringer for the real Eversmann. Sizemore I could do without in another war movie -- or so I thought -- but as Col. McKnight, he is well cast and not as overbearing as his Saving Private Ryan role. Ewan McGregor plays Specialist Stebbins although I think his name was Grimes in the film. He was cool -- though traces of his accent peek through at times.

"The Delta troopers in particular are portrayed as cool as I've seen special forces portrayed in film. The only visible difference between them and the Rangers is their black helmets. They are a bit distant with very few lines, but they CLEARLY know what they are doing and the Rangers look to them for support once the shit hits the fan -- about fifteen minutes in. William Fichtner and Eric Bana stand out as SERIOUS badasses, but they are never portrayed as a 'check me out how cool am I?' kind of character. Also on Delta is the dude who played Buddy in Three-o-clock High, one of the badguys from The Last Boy Scout (never thought I'd see him in a good movie) and a few other guys.

"The battle is shot incredibly and avoids (thank God) the current trend of shakey-cam Saving Private Ryan style camera work. None of that 'too-fast-to-know-what's-going-on' stuff from the beginning of Gladiator. The effects, apparently temporary were fine -- nothing overtly graphic, nothing looked too CGI. Lots of RPGs and machine gun fire. Very little room to breathe.

"I read that Ridley Scott got military backing on this -- if so -- it shows. He's got everything exact from the book -- the insertion with four Blackhawks and four Little Birds is amazing just to look at -- eight choppers in one shot??? The fast roping down to the street is crazy -- dust flying everywhere -- people yelling -- shots already coming it.

"Honestly this movie blew me away. I would suggest that everyone read this book first -- the fact that the movie adheres so stringently to the non fiction book is what makes this film so good. There are lines in the film that, had they not been actually spoken, might ring as phony, but they are absolutely real. The script by Ken Nolan, Bowden, and Steve Zaillain manages to include just about every interesting moment from the book -- For me the book had parts that were hard to keep track of -- moments when characters seperated by a few stone walls seemed to be a world apart -- the movie clearly shows you where everyone is and why.

'This film does not impose a point of view into the story. No 'what are we doing in Somalia' kinda stuff -- it did not include that dreaded shot of some poor Somalian kid getting shot with a Ranger standing over him where we're all supposed to think about how horrible this all is -- no slow-mo American flag waving -- nope, none of that -- this thing sticks to the facts and comes off as an extremely patriotic movie without trying to because, even though we had the guns -- they had the numbers -- and when the Rangers and Delta get stuck -- man -- all you want is for these poor guys to get the hell out of this god forsaken place as fast and as safely as possible.

"Spoilers -- anyone who has read the book will recognize these scenes, but this stuff for me was particularly awesome to actually see on film:

1. In the beginning, almost in passing, Bana's Delta character goes hunting for boars with a Blackhawk. 2. When Specialist... can't remember his name... when that one Ranger kid gets shot in the leg and the medic has to read up through the wound into his pelvis to try to find his artery to stop the bleeding.

3. When the Ranger driving the Humvee with Col. McKnight (Sizemore) gets blinded by an RPG flash and McKnight has to steer and tells him to simply "keep his foot on the gas".

4. When the two Delta snipers demand that General Garrison (Sam Sheperd) let them go down to attempt to singlehandedly fend of the crowds circling the second crash sight. (The CMH winners). These guys get on the ground and it's like a video game -- like Space Invaders -- the crowd is just surging at them and they have to keep shooting them point blank to keep them away. One shoots while the other is reloading -- one of the most, if not the most intense moments I have ever seen in a war movie.

5. When a Delta operator (Fitchner) has to lead a team of Rangers to the second crash sight.

6. Blackhawks broadcasting over a PA to captured pilot, Mike Durant, that they have not forgotten him and will get him out.

7. When, at the end, the coolest part of the film and book -- the Delta operator played by Eric Bana suits back up, woofs down some food and heads back into the city to keep fighting with the rest of Delta.

"Also, I found it interesting that all the names in the film are accurate from the book except the Delta operators who did not die in the fight -- kinda cool, considering the nature of their confidentiality. This movie WILL, without a doubt be nominated for best picture. Absolutely. I usually like three or four films a year and am a working screenwriter out here and I have got to say, quite honestly, that this is the best film I have seen since American Beauty and Three Kings.

"I thought it would be a cold day in hell before Jerry Bruckheimer won an Oscar, but he just may do it with this. This thing takes hold of you, bends you over and just gives it to you straight and hard for two hours. I've seen the history channel's documentary about the incident and this film could replace it -- it is that accurate and that detailed. If I could personally thank Ridley Scott for making this I would. READ THE BOOK first!!! I know I seem a little freaked about this but I can't react in any other way. I'm pissed no one else as seen this -- I can't get all goo-goo with anyone about how badass it is. Jeez -- and to think I thought Hollywood forgot how to make awesome movies..."

14 posted on 12/29/2001 12:11:17 AM PST by finnman69
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To: Pharmboy
"Top Gun," the gold — or rather gold-filled — standard for incoherent militaristic propaganda...the accomplished but meaningless "Black Hawk Down" is like being trapped in an action film version of "Groundhog Day," condemned to sit through the same carnage over and over.

For someone who hates America, any military action in defense of it is beyond understanding: "pointless" or "meaningless" or "incoherent."

I can see why the Times hired this guy.

16 posted on 12/29/2001 12:11:20 AM PST by denydenydeny
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To: Pharmboy
the lack of characterization converts the Somalis into a pack of snarling dark-skinned beasts, gleefully pulling the Americans from their downed aircraft and stripping them.

Oh. I thought, um, that was pretty much what they were, and what they did. Sorry.

I haven't read the book. But if the NYT rips this film is jingoistic, count me in. I'm going tonight.

18 posted on 12/29/2001 12:11:22 AM PST by Gurn
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To: Pharmboy
I don't read reviews. I just ask a friend if it's worth seeing and then judge for myself.

Has any FReeper seen it yet? Is it worth seeing or a must see type of movie?

21 posted on 12/29/2001 12:11:28 AM PST by Fred Mertz
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To: Pharmboy
The film is only out in NYC and LA. I talked to someone who had seen an advance screening and read the book. He described it as one long battle, just 90 minutes of pure war. Well, that was the book he said. The problem is you really don't get to know about the characters, so sometimes it's hard to really identify with them. The battle scenes are great and well shot, and it tells the story clearly. That's good enough for me.
22 posted on 12/29/2001 12:11:29 AM PST by Mr.Clark
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To: Pharmboy
This must be a great movie and right on if the NY Times is writing this scathing review.
25 posted on 12/29/2001 12:11:30 AM PST by truthandlife
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To: Pharmboy
The NY Slimes sucks, does it not? Talking about jingoism and how the movie does not have enough black actors. Sounds like this movie is a winner, but the NY Slimes would not know good cinema if it were giving them a Lewinsky.
28 posted on 12/29/2001 12:11:31 AM PST by KC_Conspirator
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To: Pharmboy; dighton
Sam Shepard, as Major General Garrison, seems to be smoking a Montecristo No. 2 primarily......... The producer Jerry Bruckheimer seems to have been making Ridley Scott movies......... the picture seems to choose futility arbitrarily........ the most minimal of contexts seems glib

Seems he lost his Thesaurus. Most unseemly.

29 posted on 12/29/2001 12:11:31 AM PST by Orual
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To: Pharmboy
In "Black Hawk Down," the lack of characterization converts the Somalis into a pack of snarling dark-skinned beasts, gleefully pulling the Americans from their downed aircraft and stripping them. Intended or not, it reeks of glumly staged racism.

Hate to say it folks, but this happened, and they were a pack of snarling, dark-skinned beasts.

32 posted on 12/29/2001 12:11:37 AM PST by Double Tap
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To: Pharmboy
This guy would have an aneurism if they ever made a movie about Carlos Hathcock.
34 posted on 12/29/2001 12:11:56 AM PST by RogueIsland
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To: Pharmboy
Black Hawk Down" has such distinctive visual aplomb that its jingoism starts to feel like part of its atmosphere.

Only leftist fools use the term "jingoism" as a negative term for patriotism. I expect nothing more than leftist tripe from the New York Slimes newspaper.

36 posted on 12/29/2001 12:12:07 AM PST by SunStar
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To: Pharmboy
"Top Gun," the gold — or rather gold-filled — standard for incoherent militaristic propaganda.

Nah, they're not biased. No way.

37 posted on 12/29/2001 12:12:08 AM PST by SunStar
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