Posted on 12/12/2001 7:21:41 AM PST by Cap'n Crunch
Because of this apparition, the Aztecs converted to Christianity. Whether or not you believe it, Mary's sole purpose is to lead people to Jesus. That's exactly what happened in this case.
I lifted the following from The Word Among Us. Please read it ...
What were the Nina, the Pinta, and the Santa Maria? If you answered that they were the three ships on which Christopher Columbus and his crew sailed to the Americas in 1492, you win ten celestial points! Now, the bonus question: What do the names of the ships mean? The answer is "the girl" (Nina), "paints" (Pinta), "Holy Mary" (Santa Maria). And this is the story of Our Lady of Guadalupe.
In 1519, Hernando Cortes conquered Mexico, ending the Aztecs' empire. A proud and cultured people, the Aztecs resented their Spanish conquerors and were resistant to the Christianity they brought with them. On December 12, 1531, an Indian named Juan Diego told the archbishop of Mexico City that he had seen the Virgin Mary on a hill outside of town. The archbishop asked for a sign, and Juan Diego returned with a cloak full of beautiful roses given him by the mysterious lady--an impossibility in December! On the inside of his cloak was a beautiful image of the lady. The "girl" who appeared to Juan Diego had "painted" herself, and she was "Holy Mary." To this day, the physical properties of this image remain scientifically inexplicable.
As news of this event spread, thousands of Indians came to believe in Jesus and accepted baptism. Likewise, there was a renewal of faith among thousands of the already baptized Spaniards.
The message of the miraculous image in Juan Diego's cloak is that God is alive and cares about each and every one of his people. Just as God used this extraordinary means to reach the people of the Amer-icas, he is equally eager to deliver all of us from sin, to heal our broken hearts, to reconcile the estranged. He is so eager that he is even willing to bend the rules of nature at times to get our attention!
God doesn't just want unbelievers to believe in him; he wants those who do believe to know him more deeply. That's why he keeps sending us his word to remind us that he is with us. Every day he encourages us to keep fighting the fight of faith. He assures us that he loves us with an unchangeable love.
I wrote:
The thing is, no one knows you're a bigot until you open your mouth (or post it on a thread).
And you replied:
The thing is, some people are too quick to slap the "bigot" label on anyone with a differing opinion.
Own Drummer is entitled to his own opinions, and beliefs, as are you. But when he labels mine, and those of every Roman Catholic FReeper, "superstition", he's passed over from opinion to bigotry.
When Columbus sailed to the Americas his ships were (of course) the Nina, the Pinta and the Santa Maria. I understand it means "the girl, Holy Mary, paints herself." And that is exactly what Our Lady did, she left us a painting of herself.
When the Indians were celebrating the miracluous image, one shot an arrow into the sky which killed another. The tilma was placed over the dead man and he was restored to life.
The images in the eyes of Our Lady have been studied for years. When eye doctors look into the eyes they say it is exactly like looking into a human eye. There are images of those people who were present when Juan Diego opened the tilma, including Bishop Zumarraga and Juan Diego, in the eyes on the image.
It is quite something to see.
The name Guadalupe, had a meaning for both the natives and the Spanish. To the natives it meant (Quatzalupe) "she who crushes the head of the serpent." The serpent god Quetzlcoatl. To the Spanish it was the name of a river in Spain, I believe it translates into 'river of light'. But a statue of Our Lady holding an infant Jesus was found buried in the mud of the river. So both cultures had a meaning.
Very interesting when compared to John 17 where Jesus says "That they might know You, the only true God and Jesus Christ whom you have sent".
MOG has always had a mother of the Father sound to it to me and this proves it.
Regardless of how you feel about Our Lady, what do you think of the miraculous tilma? Have you read about it? It is very much like the Shroud of Turin.
Certain groups of people look for any reason to ridicule Catholics.
I've yet to see a Fundamentalist thread disrupted by Catholics, yet you Bible-beaters troll this place, literally jumping offside in your efforts to belittle your fellow Christians.
You may know your bible, but your mama didn't teach you one damn bit of manners or courtesy.
Thanks.
Info about the images in the eyes would be neat :0)
I suspect that you are a little less sensitive to the anti sola scriptura, anti protestant, anti bible, anti everything non-catholic that comes out of catholics all over the FR. But that's what the FR is for and I don't see non-catholics whine about being challenged and mocked. We expect it. We are told to expect it.
You may know your bible, but your mama didn't teach you one damn bit of manners or courtesy.
I'm sure you are the picture of patience and civility on the good ole FR like so many other RC's I've 'encountered' here have been.
By the way, have you ever studied the tilma for yourself?
So, have you read about or seen the tilma for yourself or will you continue to let other people make all your decisions for you? If you haven't studied it for yourself, how can you say it's bogus?
I knew that the Anti-Catholic bigots would spread their lies within ten posts. I was right, of course.
Sancta Maria, mater dei, ora pro nobis peccatoribus, nunc et in hora mortis nostrae, amen.
My problem with all that appearance/disappearance stuff is IT JUST DOES NOT MAKE ANY SENCE!!!!
Why can't Mary or Jesus for that matter appear in the sky, say above New York and talk to the multitude in English, and in the same time, he or she can appear in sky above,say Moscow and talk to the people in Russian, and in the same exact time appears at Peking, and talk in Chinese???
Even in today technology, that appears to be very possible, but certainly it can bring people to appreciate the Lord's presence. I am sure, he knows better ways to show himself in an unenbigous way. But he does not seem to be interested. A couple of thousands years ago, he showed up briefly, and now all these generations got nothing but blind faith in some historical story?
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