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Genetic Survey Reveals Hidden Celts Of England
The Sunday Times (UK) ^ | 12-02-2001 | John Elliott/Tom Robbins

Posted on 12/06/2001 6:35:33 AM PST by blam

click here to read article


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To: Charge Carrier
And, another article.
201 posted on 12/09/2001 2:20:30 PM PST by blam
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To: blam
So, do you have any insight or even speculation about who were/are the mummies out in the Tarim Basin near Lulan/Urumchi in east China? They are Celtic, 6-7,000 years old.

I believe this is the area where the flood of Genesis took place, therefore I believe these folks are the pregenitors to the victims of the flood of Genesis.

202 posted on 12/09/2001 3:19:13 PM PST by Citizen of the Savage Nation
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To: blam; FairOpinion; Ernest_at_the_Beach; SunkenCiv; 24Karet; 2Jedismom; 4ConservativeJustices; ...
A blast from the past.
Please FREEPMAIL me if you want on, off, or alter the "Gods, Graves, Glyphs" PING list --
Archaeology/Anthropology/Ancient Cultures/Artifacts/Antiquities, etc.
The GGG Digest
-- Gods, Graves, Glyphs (alpha order)

203 posted on 09/10/2004 10:25:52 PM PDT by SunkenCiv (Unlike some people, I have a profile. Okay, maybe it's a little large...)
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To: rightofrush

http://members.tripod.com/~Halfmoon/

Perhaps the greatest mystery of Scottish or even European history is the people who once inhabited the lands north of Hadrian's Wall and as far north as the Shetlands. Who were these fiercely independent people? Where did the come from? Which language did they speak? What did they call themselves?

We first hear of them in the third century from a Roman writer, who describes their fierceness and battle skills. The writer Eumenius, writes about them 200 years after Rome has been in Britain, and the name associated with the Pict is forever coined.
To this day, we do not know if this is truly as in "pictus" (the Latin for "painted") or a Latin form of a native name. Because of the isolation of northern Scotland, history yields little, and the Roman Empire's expeditions into the north ended in little gains.


"We, the most distant dwellers upon the earth, the last of the free, have been shielded...by our remoteness and by the obscurity which has shrouded our name...Beyond us lies no nation, nothing but waves and rocks"

The above words by the Pictish chief Calgacus are recorded by the Roman enemy in the words of Tacitus and are a perfect example of the obscurity and legendary status held by the Picts almost 2,000 years ago.

Early Scotland

The earliest recorded evidence of man in Scotland is dated to 8,500 B.C. It is thus that a few thousand years before the birth of Christ, Neolithic men from Spain and France, makers of fire and herders of sheep and cattle had already made their way to Scotland.
Some archeologists suggest that these people may have built and used the great chambered cairns which dot the Scottish countryside.
It has also been suggested that their descendants eventually merged with the Beaker people (who probably came from northern Europe), and this ethnic union made up the pre-Celtic stock of the northern lands.

The link of these early inhabitants to their Iberian ancestors can be found in the many spiral pattern grooves cut into the rocks and boulders of this northern land and which can also be found in Spain, France and Ireland.
The design of burial chambers located in the Orkney islands also provide an important link to the Iberian origin of their builders.
Farming arrived in these islands around 4,000 BC (3-4,000 years after it started in Asia Minor) and as it replaced the nomadic way of life, the Orkneys became an island fortress with its many stone settlements.
By the time Rome became a world empire, the Orcadians were recognized by Rome as a sea power.
From recent excavations, it seems that these Orcadian people were a slim, swarthy Caucasian race, with long, narrow heads.

The great stone circles such as Sunhoney were probably being built around 3,300 BC, quite possibly around the same time as the arrival of the Beaker people from Northern and Central Europe.
These newcomers were of a different ethnic group from the Iberian stock in northern Britain, as their skulls were much broader and round.
Evidence of contact between these new people and their continental ancestors have been discovered in several excavations, and seem to indicate a flourishing trade between ancient Scotland and Europe.
It is thought by many scholars that the union of these two peoples resulted in the creation of the pre- Celtic stock eventually loosely called Pict by the Roman and Cruithne by the Celts.


204 posted on 09/10/2004 11:09:49 PM PDT by Drammach (Freedom; not just a job, it's an adventure..)
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To: Interesting Times

That's my impression to. All this means is most of the Brits had offspring from their neighbors... not uncommon given the numbers that cross the borders these day.

Give me a trace of their family names on the father's side, if they're all Bakers and Winstons, this will only tell me that they got married to the Celts.


205 posted on 09/11/2004 4:53:26 AM PDT by MacDorcha
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To: blam
So, I may not be a WASP after all.

I'm a Cornish WCM.
206 posted on 09/11/2004 4:58:42 AM PDT by aruanan
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To: Lumberjack

Truer words were never spoken.


207 posted on 09/11/2004 5:04:24 AM PDT by hershey
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To: aruanan
"I'm a Cornish WCM."

What's a WCM?

208 posted on 09/11/2004 8:31:47 AM PDT by blam
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To: Lumberjack
if a similar test were performed in the United States, that most individuals would show a Sioux, Iriqouis, or any other Indian Nation, trace in their DNA?

Interesting argument, but highly doubtful. The time period is too short in the Americas, and if you study genealogy as I do, you will realize that ancestry back to the 1500s is very well documented. Of the old American families, there are people searching for Indians in their family tress, but overall its just a few. Not nearly as many as your argument would suggest.

209 posted on 09/11/2004 9:26:13 AM PDT by ElkGroveDan (Santorum 2008)
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To: blam

"So, I may not be a WASP after all."

LOL

There are a few males from history that it would be interesting to uncover and do a DNA study upon....


210 posted on 09/11/2004 9:31:27 AM PDT by Just mythoughts
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To: blam

Now we need to investigate what happened to the Pre-Celts.


211 posted on 09/11/2004 9:41:14 AM PDT by Natural Law
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To: Natural Law; Just mythoughts
"Now we need to investigate what happened to the Pre-Celts."

They're still there. This guy lives one-half mile from where his 9,000 year old relative's skeleton was found: Cheddar Man

212 posted on 09/11/2004 9:48:01 AM PDT by blam
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To: blam
"They're still there. This guy lives one-half mile from where his 9,000 year old relative's skeleton was found: Cheddar Man."


and no DNA study done???? Maybe there has been and the answer is not PC.

I was speaking to more recent males, just a curiosity and specifically Jacob.
213 posted on 09/11/2004 9:54:28 AM PDT by Just mythoughts
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To: blam
Very interesting thread. Thank you for taking the time to post the article. Now, on to further the discussion.

I don't know any thing about the beaker people.

I see others have followed up, so I will only contribute new information.

Rare image of a beaker taken
from a British website. Note
the flaming red hair.

In all seriousness, these DNA studies will add a great deal to our understanding of the history of peoples. For a technogeek like myself, my own fascination with the subject stems from one of the few humanities courses I actually enjoyed in college, A History of the English Language.

214 posted on 09/11/2004 11:23:36 AM PDT by LTCJ (God Save the Constitution.)
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To: blam
The evidence is quite strong that there is a substantial indigenous component remaining in England

Here they are now:


215 posted on 09/11/2004 11:33:36 AM PDT by Jim Noble (Hillary becomes the RAT candidate on October 9. You saw it here first.)
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To: blam
What's a WCM?

White Celtic Methodist (since Methodists aren't Protestant).
216 posted on 09/11/2004 6:09:37 PM PDT by aruanan
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To: blam

i don't think basque is an indo-eurpean language at all -- it's 'supposed' to be related to chechen


217 posted on 09/14/2004 12:48:05 AM PDT by Cronos (W2K4)
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To: WilliamWallace1999; Interesting Times; blam
Perhaps as the Anglo-Saxons invaded they had their wives impregnated by the Celtic men before they cut their heads off? (sarcasm /off)

ANd can you imagine the scene?

"'Ere Brunhilde, go orn and 'ave it 'orf with the nice-looking Welsh mann there before I skewer 'im. I wants my kids to be able to read and wroight"
218 posted on 09/14/2004 12:50:19 AM PDT by Cronos (W2K4)
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To: LN2Campy
It's already been conclusively proved that the Norse were in N.A. 500 years before Columbus. We will probably eventually learn that there was a great deal more contact between the "Old" and "New" Worlds than we ever imagined.

Well yes, but it is suppposed to be a short-lived colony in Newfoundland that was abandoned when the weather got colder or somefing loike that.
219 posted on 09/14/2004 12:51:43 AM PDT by Cronos (W2K4)
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To: blam; LN2Campy
There is a plaque here at the mouth of Mobile Bay commerating the visit of a Welsh prince in 1170AD

hate to burst your bubble, but that's a myth, propagated by the BRits when they came to NA AFTER the Spaniards, Dutch and French, to try and show that the Brits had 'rights' to the land
220 posted on 09/14/2004 12:54:15 AM PDT by Cronos (W2K4)
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