Why Europe Hates Israel

FREEMAN E-MAIL LIST ^ | November 29, 2001 | By Bret Stephens, an editorial page writer for The Wall Street Journal Europe.

[tonycavanagh]

Yes I think I remember that incident.

I cant remember the exact date I think it was Autumn 1984 but I went parachuting with a number of your guys in Peterborough. It would be funny if you were one of those guys.

Cheers Tony

[AGAviator]

Sooooo you are anti-Israel AND anti-America too. Interesting

America stands for "All men are created equal and endowed by their Creator with certain inalienable rights."

Israel stands for "We are God's chosen, and can do with the land and the people in it what we please."

The two couldn't be more diametrically opposed.

America has a God that treats everyone the same. Israel has a god only for the Jews.

Whatever it is that's in this country that's supporting Israel, it's not America.

[Cachelot]

Israel stands for "We are God's chosen, and can do with the land and the people in it what we please."

That's rather a farfetched fantasy, don't you think? Where did you come by it?

[AGAviator]

By what they say, and what they do.

[Cachelot]

By what they say, and what they do.

How.. informative. Anything specific?

[AGAviator]

Anything specific?

Hmmmm. Do you think they read their own scriptures?

[Cachelot]

Hmmmm. Do you think they read their own scriptures?

Yes, I'd think so. Do you read them?

[Patria One]

Ah yes.. Typical of Zionism to blame the Saudis. The Saudis have IGNORED you all for 60 years.

You all sure are getting desperate to have begun attacking, Bush, Powell and Zinni.

I expect that rhetoric will escalate. Poor plan, but go ahead.

[Patria One]

The "fantasy" here is the overblown sense of importance Israel has to think Europe cares enough to "hate" them.

[wildconservatism]

The "Republic not an Empire" crowd on Free Republic are a bunch of frauds, cowards, and the majority of them (if not all) are anti-Semites. In the meantime we're witnessing, in the last 24 hours the kind of carnage which these half-wits implicitly and explicitly support.

It's easy to throw around names like "frauds" and "cowards." Why does the paleoconservative part of the movement upset you so? I sense a lot of passion in your post. I've read "Republic not an Empire," and thought it an excellent case for putting America first. I await PJB's "Death of the West" with eagerness. So you know what side I'm on...but why all the invective and hysteria from you? What's at stake for you? What are you afraid of losing if PJB had become president...as remote a possibility that may be? I'm interested in the source of your passion about the issue, and would enjoy the dialogue, so if you respond, try to take a deep breath and keep it civilized. I'll do the same.

[Cachelot]

Israel has to think Europe cares enough to "hate" them

Oh, EU sure has cared enough in the past, wouldn't you say, Patria? Regular carebears, both ol' Adolph (the failed wussy painter :) and his modern descendants. Seems ol' Adolph also had friends in Arabia, hmmm?

[colorado tanker]

This article is right on the money. The fact is the Euros have a lot of colonial oppression and screwups to feel guilty about. Especially in the Middle East. Britain used the Arabs to defeat the Turks in WWI, promising them an Arab state. Then, the Brits and French double crossed the Arabs and divided all the "good" territory among themselves for colonies, leaving the Arabs with the Arabian peninsula, which they thought worthless. When the Euro's granted their colonies independence after WWII, they carved the Middle East into countries with no historical cohesiveness or independent traditions, ruled by monarchs installed by the Euros. The situation was tailor made for instablillty, revolution and war.

No wonder the Euros are only too happy to transfer the guilt for this mess to the Israelis. And besides, the Euro economies now depend on the oil their former colonies produce. They gussie up a policy of ruthless self-interest with a bunch of socialist, progressive-sounding, slogans.

[veronica]

You live in a fantasy world. Nobody is attacking Bush. And disagreeing Powell or Zinni is not 'attacking.'

The Saudis have shown their true colors in this war and the US is not amused.

How many of the 9-11 hijackers were Saudis again?

And if this article is too probing for you try the Pee Wee Herman thread.

[Lent]

It's easy to throw around names like "frauds" and "cowards." Why does the paleoconservative part of the movement upset you so? I sense a lot of passion in your post.

Maybe you should not conflate "paleoconservatism" with "America first" rhetoric. Most of the time around Free Republic the latter is used as as SWORD against U.S. foreign policy supportive of Israel and such a foreign policy no more vitiates the notion of "paleoconservatism" then does any foreign policy which is supportive of democratic processes. With respect to "passion", so what?

I've read "Republic not an Empire," and thought it an excellent case for putting America first.

Nothing wrong with putting "America first". But when its used as a political ploy for anti-Israel propaganda (and I assure you it has almost exclusively been used in that context on Free Republic) then it is a vacuous notion.

So you know what side I'm on...but why all the invective and hysteria from you?

Why don't you ask you "buddies" that? Better yet, if you think rhetoric and invective is a one way street here then stick around for a further education. Moreover, given the posts I have made against this AGAviator character, for you to chime in for him, in whole or part, makes me believe you don't give a flying *&*^(^ about the U.S. (how do you like that invective?) But maybe you missed all his anti-American propaganda which I pasted above.

What are you afraid of losing if PJB had become president...as remote a possibility that may be?

It looks like the guy couln't make dog-catcher right now.

I'm interested in the source of your passion about the issue, and would enjoy the dialogue, so if you respond, try
to take a deep breath and keep it civilized. I'll do the same.

Don't patronize me. Read the anti-American propaganda and maybe you'll understand the "passion". Or maybe you haven't gotten excited or concerned about anything in your life. Welcome to Free Republic

[Mark17]

I cant remember the exact date I think it was Autumn 1984 but I went parachuting with a number of your guys in Peterborough. It would be funny if you were one of those guys.

It was Nov of 83. By Autumn of 84, I was already at Travis AFB, CA. I was stationed in Wiesbaden, Germany at the time, and went on Temp duty to Lakenheath, Mildenhall, and Geenham Common. It was just a few weeks after the Marine barracks in Beirut was bombed. I have never jumped before, but would love to try it.

[AGAviator]

Do you read them?

There. Just read them cover to cover. So what is it about this region that produces such ghoulish literature?

[Cachelot]

There. Just read them cover to cover.

You read Hebrew?