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The Neverending Story (The New Christian Chronicles)
Southern Baptists ending talks with Catholic Church ^ | 3/24/01 | AP

Posted on 10/15/2001 6:54:40 AM PDT by malakhi

The Neverending Story
An ongoing debate on Scripture, Tradition, History and Interpretation.


Statesmen may plan and speculate for liberty, but it is religion and morality alone which can establish the principles upon which freedom can securely stand. The only foundation of a free constitution is pure virtue. - John Adams


Thread 162
TNS Archives


TOPICS: Culture/Society; Miscellaneous
KEYWORDS: christianlist; michaeldobbs
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To: Wordsmith
Unfortunately, the quality of the discourse here often seems to tank late at night, so I'm off to bed.

I'll try not to take that personally. :-)

24,381 posted on 02/05/2002 7:41:51 PM PST by Iowegian
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To: Invincibly Ignorant
I just want to say a couple of more things regarding the Bible and the Catholic faithful.

There is such a wealth of information on Jesus Christ and Christianity out there - I read the Bible slowly and I will be the first to admit that I am not nearly as well read in that respect as my non-C brethren. But I grew up reading the lives of the Saints, information about other religions, christian history books, any history books, catholic history books, ancient christian writers, etc. Of course one can go on and on.

My point is that although the Bible is paramount, IMVHO, Catholics are also encouraged to read broadly (kind of like Havoc does, only not so slanted ;-)), and be well rounded. Rereading the above, it kind of sounds snotty and I do not mean it that way - but sometimes it seems to me that some people read the Bible to the exclusion of other wonderful ways to find God. I think knowledge is Truth and Truth is God - he gave us such a wonderful sense of curiousity, why limit it to only the Bible.

24,382 posted on 02/05/2002 7:42:26 PM PST by american colleen
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To: Iowegian
Mail returned. Insufficient postage. Check yer box
24,383 posted on 02/05/2002 7:43:49 PM PST by the808bass
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To: american colleen
If I wasn't Catholic I would definately choose to be Orthodox.

Orthodox is Catholic. It just isn't the "R" version.
24,384 posted on 02/05/2002 7:45:11 PM PST by OLD REGGIE
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To: Havoc
Havoc - Thank you for the response. The parable, and the story, are instructional. I'm afraid I don't see at all how they relate to the quote of mine that you excerpt. I read the Bible daily. My priest requires it, and I believe that you are right and that my God requires it as well.

The person I was replying to said that every believer must read the Scripture. I asked him if that meant that if you cannot read the Scripture, does that mean that you cannot be a believer. As you'll see in my later posts, my point is that in societies where literacy is the exception and not the rule the Church developed other means of delivering the Gospel.

24,385 posted on 02/05/2002 7:45:47 PM PST by Wordsmith
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To: SoothingDave
I'll tell you guys what. Next time some Catholic tries to rewrite history and the Greek language I'll be the first in line to give 'em a talking to

Oh boy, Dave will be talking to himself every time he opens his mouth. That's it folks, he's purposedly going senile! :)

24,386 posted on 02/05/2002 7:48:31 PM PST by Havoc
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To: Iowegian
Gosh, can you tell I'm tired? Present company excluded, of course! Preparing to slink sheepishly away from the keyboard, I remain:

Your Humble Servant,

WS :-)

24,387 posted on 02/05/2002 7:48:37 PM PST by Wordsmith
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To: All
I recently purchased a book called, “Out of the Shadows”, by J.Thomas Lapacka, a former high ranking minister in the World Wide Church of God, Herbert W Armstrong’s church out of Pasadena Ca the Church I was in for over 11 years active, and a total of 16 years including the inactive part, before they established a local church.

Lapacka is a great writer, and he hits all my switches and memories from those years, and it seems like another life time ago. Regardless of how much you learn and grow in spiritual knowledge, it’s still humiliating to remember you were suckered by a man who I thought represented God on earth..

I had left just a month or so prior to the Jim Jones, Jonestown Massacre, and I remember how I felt when I realized I had been in an organization that could have ended up the same way.

That is why I have come to trust no man, and if I’m wrong, I will take full blame for it, and will never point the finger at anyone for my beliefs.

In starting to read the book, I was surprised to read a list of what they call traits of a cult, and how familiar they sound.

They claim divine revelation apart from the Bible as a source of authority.

Claim there is only one true church, and we are it, and this type of thinking promotes a we against them attitude, and that we’re the bastions of truth that must be protected at all cost.

Belief that salvation is achieved through a combination of grace and works.

The Deity of God is diminished or denied.

The doctrine of the Trinity is diminished.

God is humanized, and man is deified.

The leaders wields complete and total power and authority.

Leader allows members to venerate him.

They are kept occupied all the time with meetings and etc.

They use psychological mind control..

they do a sociological study of people and cultures.

I know of a lot of religions that have several of these cult signs, but most of the big ones are controlled by lawyers that in protecting their $ interest, thankfully end up protesting the members.

FYI, JH

24,388 posted on 02/05/2002 7:50:10 PM PST by JHavard
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To: american colleen
I think knowledge is Truth and Truth is God - he gave us such a wonderful sense of curiousity, why limit it to only the Bible.

Seek ye first the kingdom of God, and all these things will be added to you as well. First read the Scriptures, pray and then start over. Once it is understood, it allows you to see the other things (other than the Bible) in their true and proper light. That's my 2 cents FWIW.

24,389 posted on 02/05/2002 7:51:37 PM PST by Iowegian
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To: OLD REGGIE
f I wasn't Catholic I would definately choose to be Orthodox.

Orthodox is Catholic. It just isn't the "R" version.

I do know that! Just because I am a Red Sox fan doesn't mean I am completely stupid...

24,390 posted on 02/05/2002 7:51:55 PM PST by american colleen
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To: american colleen
other wonderful ways to find God

"There came to St. Antony in the desert one of the wise men of that time and said: 'Father, how can you endure to live here, deprived as you are of all consolation from books?' Antony answered: 'My book, philosopher, is the nature of created things, and whenever I wish I can read in it the works of God.'" - Evagrius of Pontus

24,391 posted on 02/05/2002 7:52:22 PM PST by Wordsmith
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To: american colleen
but sometimes it seems to me that some people read the Bible to the exclusion of other wonderful ways to find God.

But sometimes it seems to me some people don't read the bible because they spend to much time reading theology books and books about saints and etc. There is no more wonderful way to find God (the only way IMO) then from HIS WORD.

If you wanted people to get to know you, wouldn't they accomplish that best by reading a book that YOU wrote about yourself rather then a book written by another person about themselves but that you were a part of.

BEcky

24,392 posted on 02/05/2002 7:53:11 PM PST by PayNoAttentionManBehindCurtain
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To: OLD REGGIE
Orthodox is Catholic. It just isn't the "R" version.

It's the PG version?

24,393 posted on 02/05/2002 7:53:47 PM PST by Iowegian
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To: OLD REGGIE
so a moral unanimity only is required

And as we've seen in regards to Peter and the rock, a majority of the surviving opinion is not even necessary.

24,394 posted on 02/05/2002 7:53:57 PM PST by the808bass
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To: Iowegian
Thanks, Iowegian. I agree with you!
24,395 posted on 02/05/2002 7:53:58 PM PST by american colleen
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To: OLD REGGIE
"Orthodox is Catholic. It just isn't the "R" version."

LOL! Too true. My wife was teaching my boys to recite the Nicene Creed tonight. Even my 3 year old loves trying to say, "And I believe in One Holy Catholic and Apostolic Church."

24,396 posted on 02/05/2002 7:54:46 PM PST by Wordsmith
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To: Woodkirk
"Theotokos" means literally "God of usury, or God of interest on money loaned" or by extension "God of moneylenders or moneychangers" -- and which one of those three meanings a person chooses depends on the context?

Thank you for your philosophy. .

You are rapidly descending to Havoc's level of irrelevance.

Pray for the Vicar of Christ

24,397 posted on 02/05/2002 7:57:59 PM PST by dignan3
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To: the808bass
I responded to your quote to another and quoted part of what you said and then responded. Christ own words are the truth to me, no one elses. God cannot lie. Sorry you got confused.
24,398 posted on 02/05/2002 8:03:17 PM PST by Irisshlass
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To: dignan3
What was relevant about that, other than trying to slam 2 NC's at the same time?
24,399 posted on 02/05/2002 8:04:43 PM PST by Iowegian
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To: Irisshlass
I was confused because you said my interpretation was the Roman Catholic interpretation and I quote....

But you're assuming that your (the RCC) interpretation of the verse is true.

Did you or did you not type those words?

24,400 posted on 02/05/2002 8:06:13 PM PST by the808bass
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