Posted on 10/04/2001 8:54:17 AM PDT by jerod
Former Conservative prime minister Baroness Thatcher has criticised Muslim leaders in Britain over their response to the terror attacks in America.
Lady Thatcher said Muslim leaders had not spoken out strongly enough about the September 11 atrocities.
Muslim leaders have said they are very sad at what they view as an unprovoked attack from the Baroness.
They say they condemned the atrocities immediately and unequivocally.
"The people who brought down those towers were Muslims and Muslims must stand up and say that is not the way of Islam," she told The Times.
"Passengers on those planes were told that they were going to die and there were children on board. They must say that is disgraceful.
"I have not heard enough condemnation from Muslim priests."
Her remarks come at a sensitive time with Prime Minister Tony Blair about to embark on a new round of shuttle diplomacy to bolster support for the international coalition against terrorism.
US Defence Secretary Donald Rumsfeld is also in the Middle East trying to reassure Muslim allies like Saudi Arabia and Egypt who are deeply concerned about the fall out in the Islamic world of any military action against Afghanistan.
Lady Thatcher left office more than ten years ago but her international stature ensures that her views still attract attention around the world.
Muslims in Britain reacted with sadness and surprise at the outburst.
Dr Ghayasuddin Siddiqui, leader of the Muslim Parliament, said: "I am very sad and surprised that she has said this sort of thing.
"Coming from a person like Baroness Thatcher it is very hurtful.
"People need to know that out of over 6000 people who died in this terrible incident, over 1500 of them were Muslims.
"The Muslim community has had to suffer twice - once when someone dear to them died, the second time when people say things like this.
"On the question of terrorism, we are all on the same side.
"We all want the people who did this to be identified, brought to trial and given whatever punishment they deserve.
"All Muslim organisations expressed immediately their horror and shock at what happened. Like the PLO did??
" We have said it once, why do we need to keep on saying it? We have also been mourning our dead."
Sher Azam, president of the Bradford Council of Mosques, said: "I am not aware of any Muslim leaders in Britain who did not condemn this attack.
"Many Muslim lives have been lost in America. We don't see this attack in terms of nationality, colour or creed, just as loss of lives.
"It is very sad that Baroness Thatcher has made Muslims a target at a time when the Home Secretary has given us comfort by announcing legislation against religious hatred.
"As a result of the US attacks the lives of ordinary Muslims have been affected.
"Women wearing the traditional dress are more or less housebound. We have stepped up security at mosques and for children coming to and from the mosque because people are very, very frightened.
"At a time when Muslims need support and sympathy from people of influence, it is very sad that she has felt the need to launch this unjustified attack."
Where are the Fatwas calling for death to Osama, for example?
Your post referred to Moslem clerics reacting to the mass murder of civilians by Moslem terrorists in a "business as usual" manner. My response commented on their attitudes.
I'm not sure I understand your attempt to make it personal, but it's quite offensive.
There is proof: the list of names of the missing, but of course that doesn't list religious affiliation, and no one should go bothering the victims' families for such IRRELEVANT info. Yes, I agree with you. However, why would a Muslim leader state what can only be utterly false statement? Sorry, but 1 out of every 4 victims WAS NOT MUSLIM.
No, it was just an accident that it happened in New York, Washington D.C., and Pennsylvania. Duh!
No. She's calling the phonies to account for their crocodile tears and lack of any change in their behavior.
There is serious division within the Muslim world. In the West we heard a couple of formal apologies, and are now expected to act as if NO Muslim supports the terrorists. In fact, many Muslims DO support such acts of terrorism. Lady Thatcher (as always) has the courage to say so, while the rest of the West wants to ignore reality to avoid political incorrectness.
I have taken part in a lot of anti terrorist operations, and the aim is to destroy the terrorist and the chances of there being any further terrorist groups arising.
The most important aim of the terrorist is to identify his act with a political or religious cause, this is intended to cause dissension and hopefully divert effort from attacking the terrorist into attacking the host or target population in this case the Muslim population of the world
re : Where are the Fatwas calling for death to Osama, for example?
He attacked America, America will deal with him, the calling of Fatwas are usually done by some Islamic group more to get publicity than anything else.
If we aim to destroy the terrorist we can win if on the other hand we widen this war to include Islam we could be in for a nasty brutal long war, which as well as causing the deaths of many on both sides, will be a complete waste of time.
We have lived with Islam for a long time, yes they are not as tolerant as us, but most of the Islamic population live in very brutal countries they live a subsistent life style.
We in the West have not bothered with the type of governments these people live under, if they are bad Dictators like Saddam we demonise them, they are our dictators like the Saudi Royal family we support them, they are just as brutal.
If Islam is the enemy once we have struck back we should pull out of that whole region, it is there’s any how. Let them fight each other, and they will, there is a lot of regional Arab Nationalist resentment for each other and Iran
If we want to deal with them, and get cheap oil of them, instead of demonising the religion we should be supporting the move towards more democratic reforms.
Tony
Dittos!
Here's the kinds of questions I want answered on NATIONAL, and world-wide, prime-time TV:
The first question I would ask of all the "respected" leaders who hold to the Islamic religion / the Islamic world-view is this:
According to your holy book, the Koran, who is an *infidel*?
Allah teaches you in the Koran that infidels are his enemies. Do you view infidels as your personal enemies?
Does Allah teach you in the Koran to love your enemies, like the Christian God does?
We know the Koran teaches you to live and relate to other people in peace and tolerance. Do these "other people" include those who aren't members of the Islamic religion ("infidels")?
Does Allah teach you in the Koran that it is NOT OK to kill people UNLESS they are infidels?
Do you approve of, and support those of the Islamic religion who kill infidels (those not of the Islamic religion)?
And here's the big one:
Will you denounce, here and now, in no UNCERTAIN terms, Islamics who kill, and seek to kill, those who don't believe in Allah, don't believe in the Koran, and aren't members of the Islamic religion (a/k/a "infidels")?
I would guess that it has affected all of us. I would agree with the Ms. Thatcher about the lack of outrage in the muslim community. All that I have heard from them is about how Americans deserve this because...........(insert various political/economic reasons), or hear of them celebrating the wounding of "the great satan."
Sorry you took it as offensive what I mean is what more can they do, those who have expressed sorrow and outrage have been drowned out by those pictures of uneducated ill-informed masses dancing in the street, most of those on those anti American marches have been fed a tissue of lies and anti American propaganda.
What we are seeing is that what ever the moderates do or say will not be good enough.
Sorry if you thought it was a personal attack, it was not meant to be like that.
Tony
That bears repeating.
Moslem clerics - of the "moderate" variety - were the subject of your post to which I responded. A polite note to the bereaved, in my opinion, is more of an insult than a comfort from Moslems positioned to stand in pulpits and decry such hatred to the faithful throughout the world. I've seen pictures of Moslems self-flagellating en masse at the funerals of individual victims of violence. Their performance, in this case, is underwhelming. I'm gratified with Baroness Thatcher's statement.
And they should be condemning Muslim aggression throughout the world.
If a group claiming to be Catholic did the same thing to a skyscraper in Saudi Arabia, how long would it be before the Pope repudiated the attack? And then imagine the Catholic bashing that would be going on here.
That's bugging me.
And where I work, I notice that those screaming the loudest that YOU CAN'T SAY "Islam is violent" have never read the Koran.
That's really bugging me.
And I'm going to scream if I hear, "every religion has its extremists" again.
The British have produced Neville Chamberlain and Winston Churchill, both of whom could be called 'old-fashioned.'
Of course it was Chamberlain who took the 'moderate' course in the face of extreme evil.
Extraordinary evil calls for extraordinary condemnation, and the Muslim clerics have not delivered it. My guess is they're afraid of assassination.
Not, You must of went to the million man march.
Me: I think we have to consider taking a good hard look at Islam and its responsibility for this kind of mindset-
Them: (breaking in immediately cause you can't even finish a sentence like this in a university setting, free speech be damned) You can't say that! You can't blame a religion, that's their RELIGION! And besides, look at all the things done by Christianity!
Me: What? Name ONE atrocity that Christianity is responsible for!
Them: The Inquisition? Hello?!
Me: Okay, why is it okay to say that Christianity is responsible for the Inquisition but NOT okay to say that Islam is responsible for terrorism?
Them: (sputter, stammer, wires-crossing....)
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