Two Questions for Freepers...Please Respond!!!

[The Black Knight]

Hello, fellow freepers. I have two questions for you all, and hopefully you can help me out here. I thank you in advance.

First of all, I am a conservative (duh) Christian, and, as such, I oppose abortion on the belief that we do not have the authority to end human life. A liberal co-worker whom I usually argue politics with calls me a hypocrit, because I believe in the death penalty. He says that I can't believe in both. PLEASE HELP ME!

Second of all, has anybody heard anything from over at Klamath Falls? The water problem? I'm not trying to downplay the tragedy and impending military strike, but I was wondering what is going on with our brothers trying to win a victory for their rights in our own country.

[The Black Knight]

Again, I thank you for your responses.

[clintonh8r]

Fetuses are innocent by any definition. Those receiving the death penalty are not, under our legal system.

[SouthCarolinaKit]

No problem. . . Abortion is the murder of the innocent while Capital Punishment ends the lives of vicious, evil, guilty killers. There's no question that those punished this way do NOT kill again.

[ThinkDifferent]

A liberal co-worker whom I usually argue politics with calls me a hypocrit, because I believe in the death penalty.

That's a completely inane argument. Ask him who a fetus has murdered.

[jackbill]

Fetuses are innocent by any definition. Those receiving the death penalty are not, under our legal system.

Ditto.

[xm177e2]

has anybody heard anything from over at Klamath Falls? The water problem?

I think the farmers got their water hooked up before 9/11. They decided to stop protesting after 9/11 because they didn't want to be seen as anti-gov't at a time like this.

[HiJinx]

Go here for a Klamath Update

[smokinleroy]

Apparently this maroon in unable to distinguish between an innocent infant and a guilty monster.

[dep]

there is the matter, of course, of absolute innocence vs. guilt beyond a reasonable doubt, as has been pointed out above, but there is something else as well: due process. the condemned criminal has been given a full opportunity to present evidence not only in favor if his being found not guilty, but after having been found guilty in favor of his being allowed to live. there is no such procedure, no standard at all, for taking the life of the unborn. it can be done for any reason or no reason at all -- not unlike you or me bumping off a neighbor because we didn't like him or her, or just for the hell of it.

so while the innocence/guilt comparison is certainly enough to be definitive, the due process issue is, too.

dep

[INSENSITIVE GUY]

JUST THE REVERSE IS TRUE.LIBERALS MURDER THE UNBORN BUT DO NOT BELIEVE IN THE DEATH PENALTY,WELL,AT LEAST ONE OF THEM GOT THE BENEFIT OF A TRIAL!

[SuziQ]

Base your argument on the Commandment "Thou shalt not do MURDER". Taking the life of an innocent human being without due process is murder. Capital punishment is carried out only after many years of trials and reams of evidence have determined that someone is guilty of a heinous crime, usually involving murder. It is society's way of punishing the criminal and warning others who may want to do the same type of crime that they will meet the same fate.

If this person comes back with the argument that some innocent people might be executed, you can counter with the DNA argument. I don't believe anyone who is scheduled to be executed will NOT have access to DNA testing to cement that person's guilt or innocence.

[Common Tator]

Condoning the death penalty and opposing abortion are the same as cuting out canerous tumors and chopping off peoples heads.

Both involve removing parts of a human body. Cutting a cancer out of a human body removes part of a human body. The purpose and result is for the benefit of humans. Chopping of someones head becase it is convienent is removeing a part of a human body for the detriment of humans.

If they can not understand the difference then they are inconsistant. They would have to support a full ban on removing cancer and chopping off inconvienent human heads.

[68-69TonkinGulfYachtClub]

"Second of all, has anybody heard anything from over at Klamath Falls?"

Click Here to pull up all Klamath Threads

[comitatus]

It's easy, and doesn't require opening the Bible. For our state to take a life, there must be due process of law establishing a compelling state interest. A convicted killer has been given full due process, often to the point of absurdity. But abortion takes a human life on the whim of the mother, with no due process and certainly no compelling state interest. BTW, this is also how you can justify allowing abortion in the case of rape or incest or a real threat to a mother's health-if the proper procedures are followed. So the only possible question is whether a fetus is a human life. And ask your liberal friend 3 questions, 1. Is a fetus alive? Yes. 2. Is it human? Yes. Is it the same human as the mother? No. Then how else could it be anything other than a human life? And if it is, it can not be killed without due process of law.

[The Black Knight]

Thanks, all of y'all. I get the point. Considering that I'm minoring in Philosophy, I guess I should have figured something simple like that out by myself, huh?

[sweet_diane]

And when your friend brings up "Thou shalt not kill." (and they usually do)tell them the original writings phrased it as "Thou shalt not murder." That is my understanding at least. Big difference between kill and murder.

[Aedammair]

Along with everyone else I think innocence is the difference and answer. But I have a question for you too. If you think abortion is murder would you be in favor of prosecuting the woman for such murder, and imposing a life time sentence, or 25 to 30 years? And if so, if a woman had more than one abortion would you support the death penalty for her. No deflections about the doctor either; this is a question specifically concerning the woman who chooses to kill her baby.

[Slyfox]

The death penalty is considered societal self-defense.

[Southflanknorthpawsis]

As a Christian you can stand on the Word of God. It might not penetrate the mind of your liberal buddy, but it is Truth. God forbids abortion but allows for capitol punishment.

[Hal.009]

The death penalty in America applies only to Capitol offences such a murder or treason. No one is sentenced to death for shoplifting, robbery, assault, grand theft or even rape unless the offender attempted to murder the victim.
Abortion is sanctioned "murder" of a innocent by the Government. The only crime of the unborn child is to be a inconviece to the potential mother.
Incidentally, does your friend support the death penalty for convicted murderers or just unborn children?