Going to be way more than 20,000.
Posted on 12/10/2025 4:26:14 PM PST by MinorityRepublican
Ukraine delivered its response to the latest US-drafted peace proposal aimed at ending the war with Russia to the Trump administration on Wednesday, US and Ukrainian officials told CNN, as the contours of a tenuous potential deal take shape and the US president continues to make clear he wants the conflict resolved quickly.
Efforts to end the yearslong war have sharply accelerated in recent weeks. President Donald Trump on Wednesday suggested a solution could soon be “figured out,” telling reporters at the White House that “a lot of people say it’s closer than it’s ever been.”
He said he “discussed Ukraine in pretty strong words” with his British, French and German counterparts, whom he said had floated the idea of Trump flying to Europe for a meeting, along with Ukrainian President Volodymyr Zelensky, this weekend.
“We’ll make a determination, depending on what they come back with,” Trump said. “We don’t want to be wasting time.”
A European diplomat also described discussions as “progressing quickly” amid continuing pressure and impatience from the US president.
There has been a frenzy of diplomacy following the revelation less than a month ago of a US-drafted, Russian-backed 28-point draft proposal to end the war.
After a series of consultations with Kyiv and a meeting in Moscow, the 28-point plan was winnowed down to 20 points meant to make it palatable to both warring parties. It is among a set of three documents being negotiated, along with one on security guarantees and another on economic recovery. Zelensky said he had a meeting on the latter on Wednesday.
(Excerpt) Read more at cnn.com ...
Russia can probably take all of Donbas, but is it worth ~20,000 more Russian dead so the ~60,000 who now live under Zelensky but would rather live under Putin can live and work where they do?
If Putin’s military could manage to take the cities unconquered as of now, they would lie in ruins. Russia would have to build new housing and factories for both pro-RF residents and anti-RF residents.
The ~60,000 could move ~15 miles to the east where Putin could build brand new apartments and factories just for pro-RF people for far less cost than fighting the war for even two more months.
The ISW maps from 2025 should be used to show Putin the difficulties Russian forces will continue to face in Donbas.
I would suggest making up two 3x4 map charts of ISW Donbas maps, one going back 11 months and one going back 110 days.
The Donbas seems to be the most difficult issue to resolve, but it should not be.
The Donbas is the most expensive real estate in Ukraine in terms of Russian lives per hectare.
No, dump Ukraine. Enough of this.
Going to be way more than 20,000.
No need. Your circus now.
still using NATO math?
“Russia can probably take all of Donbas, but is it worth ~20,000 more Russian dead “
Putin is a KGB thug. Lives mean nothing to him.
Long live the RUSSIAN EMPIRE
“still using NATO math?”
Still defending Putin?
Zelensky is a manipulating, corrupt A-hole. He went to Italy to get the “Chicago pope” on his side which is a no brainer….Giorgia Meloni was not pleased.
Chicago fake pope/DNC/Obummer=America haters. AND they all hate Trump. He’s a threat.
The globalist establishment is in panic mode and could attempt assassinations as a last resort.
Meanwhile, the Obummer shadow pres. plays Santa Claus…….as a cover up.
Putin has no money for new apartments and factories. He has no money to stop Ukraine from blowing up Oil Refineries. He has no money to protect ships in the Black Sea. He has no money to keep the trains from being blown up. He has no money to keep from getting 1,000 Russian soldiers being killed and wounded every day.
Eh, whatever. Let’s see how they and the Ewwww do without our cash.
Only upon reading the comments did I realize this is a comedy thread.
Since the West doesn’t bother to try to understand the Russian position, I’ll try to explain, as best as I can.
Basically, the Russians do not want any NATO Forward Bases right on top of the prime invasion routes to Moscow. This is based on their past experience with Europe, and is very well justified.
So when the people who bombed the shit out of Serbia for the hell of it tell Russia to not worry about their forward positions against Moscow, one can understand why Russia is not, exactly, taking them at their word.
Bottom line - the BEST GIFT to Russia is Zelensky, who will continue to let his people get chewed up as Russia widens their control, likely to the point where Russians will be safe for another 100 years or so.
I want our money back from the thieves in Kiev.
hush, Neocon
I want our money back from the thieves in Kiev.
*************
Unfortunately, a substantial amount of House & Senate Republicans like the Kievan Thieves & want a continuation of our idiotic foreign policy.
“There’s the Rub.”
I’m not overly optimistic, but I try to remain hopeful that a just peace can be agreed to soon.
There will not be a just peace.
There will be a winner and a loser.
Zeepers say Ruzzia has lost a million solders.
What’s 20,000 more losses compared to a million already lost?
A drop in the bucket.
Ruzzia will press on.
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