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Locked on 09/19/2024 5:26:28 AM PDT by Jim Robinson, reason:
Childishness |
Posted on 09/09/2024 6:28:41 AM PDT by Cronos
No one is seeing an “accelerating rate” - not yet at least
there is zero evidence for any involvement of the statement department.
And 2014 wasn’t a coup - that is clear by the sequence of events.
Finally - Nuland didn’t “pick” the people to install - have you even read the transcripts?
Regarding Georgia’s request to join NATO in 2008 - that’s a fact
Regarding that this was rejected by France and Germany for “fear of provoking Putin” - that is a fact as well
Regarding that Putin invaded Georgia 6 weeks AFTER the rejection is a fact as well.
The net conclusion is that if Georgia was allowed to join NATO, then Putin would not have invaded is the only logical conclusion
The difference is that I take a lot of time and care in writing my posts.
bimboeruption: "Full disclosure: As you can plainly see, the source for this article is The Ministry of Foreign Affairs of the Russian Federation, as opposed to The Ukrainian Ministry of Foreign Affairs, the undisclosed source used by many zeepers."
It took some doing, but I found a link to your article, so I can deal with it directly, it's here.
In my posts I link to any information I think might be challenged, so you can review my sources before you challenge me about them.
bimboeruption: "I'm not defending Russia or Putin in any way. I believe that all views should be presented."
Of course you are defending Russia, it's why you're here, deny that all you wish -- just as turning your back on a murder or rape is effectively supporting the murderer or rapist.
Ukrainian Nazism today: origin and ideological and political typology Eduard Popov, PhD Director of the Independent Non-Profit Organisation "Center for Public and Information Cooperation "Europe" |
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So, I read through your lengthy article, but didn't see a serious argument there.
What it comes down to is that Ukrainian nationalists -- whether socialists or otherwise -- always had to make alliances with whomever would help them achieve independence.
During WWII, those were the very unsavory Nazis, and that's a crying shame.
Of course, the US also made alliances with equally unsavory characters, most notably Joseph Stalin.
So, yes, there's shame for the US in that alliance, but only if you ignore the alternatives.
So, now the good Russian professor Popov wants us to believe that Ukraine today is unduly influenced or controlled by "Nazis", and yet the only evidence I've seen is of Ukrainians honoring WWII freedom fighters, not the Nazism practiced by their allies -- any more than Americans today honor the oppressive Communism practiced by our WWII ally Joseph Stalin.
Indeed, here is a partial list of important Jews in Ukraine's government:
Additionally, there are actions Ukraine's government itself has taken to combat violent extremism, Nazi or otherwise:
** "semi-socialism", meaning government ownership of some "critical" industries and political control over all economic activity.
In 2023 Ukrainians said their casualty exchange rate was three Russians for every Ukrainian and reported some 400,000 Russian casualties by the end of 2023 -- about 200,000 per year.
From this we can estimate Ukrainian casualties (1/3) at around 140,000 of whom some 35,000 (1/4) were KIA, as of end of 2023.
Now, in 2024 Ukrainians say continuous Russian "Meat Wave" assaults increased average casualty exchange rate to six Russians for every Ukrainian.
So, total Russian casualties, year-to-date reported as around 230,000 -- which is nearly double the rate of previous years.
From this we can estimate Ukrainian 2024 casualties at circa 40,000 year-to-date.
This is roughly the same rate as previous years.
Clearly Ukraine's strategy has been to exchange small areas of Ukrainian territory for very large imbalances in casualty ratios, and that is at least what Ukraine's own numbers show for 2024.
Outside observers have not agreed with a six-to-one ratio of Russian to Ukraine casualties, but neither do they report ratios favorable to Russia.
Jumper: "Schultz of Germany and Jake Sullivan want negotiations now.
Blinken and others want to escalate the war."
Neither Schultz nor Sullivan nor Blinken, nor anybody else I know of has a plan for victory over Russia.
Jumper: "The pentagon has said they do not want missile strikes into Russia because it will change nothing, but instead create future problems for the US around the world in the future when Russia responds.
The US intel community mirrors the pentagon’s assessment that deep strikes into Russia will result in future problems for the US all over the world when Russia strikes back."
All of that is purely Russian propaganda fantasy.
The truth is, Russians are already doing everything they can to make the world miserable, most notably:
Kerch Bridge to Crimea after attack:
Jumper: "Even the Kurge Bridge in Crimea could not be destroyed by Ukraine which made it an imperative by the end of June 2024... after previous deadlines failed."
Crimea now has two rail lines to supply it --
There's some speculation on why Ukrainians have not yet destroyed both rail lines -- since the Kerch Bridge alone would change nothing -- and I'd suppose the reasons are a combination of strategic and humanitarian concerns.
Jumper: "There will not be a negotiated solution to the war becasue NEO-Cons will eventually deep strike into Russia... ensuring hostilities around the world for the future.
Leave it to the MIC to make conditions for NEVER-ENDING WARS."
I have no sympathy for Russia's leadership -- zero -- and they deserve whatever evil befalls them now.
But on our side, war without victory is a crime, or should be, and Ukrainians deserve much better than we have done for them so far.
Among the many reasons are Vlad the Invader's "Russkiy Mir" fantasies:
Vladimir Putin awards propagandist Vladimir Solovyov:
Putin's propagandist, Vladimir Solovyov:Jumper: "WE NEED TRUMP."
"If you think we'll stop at Ukraine, think it through 300 times.
I'll remind you that Ukraine is just an intermediate step in the establishment of the strategic security of the Russian Federation."
Of course, but I highly doubt if a just & permanent peace will come as quick and easily as Trump would like.
I also doubt if Trump will attempt to reward Vlad the Invader's aggressions with great swaths of Ukrainian territory.
But, we'll see.
No Russian claim to a square inch of Ukraine's 1991 borders is recognized as legitimate internationally.
The only countries recognizing Vlad's annexation of Crimea are Russian allies & client states of:
As for what more Russians can or will destroy -- in Eastern Ukraine, Russians advance at the rate of roughly one square mile per day, and a cost of now 1,100 Russian casualties per square mile.
Ukraine's total remaining territory is approximately 200,000 square miles.
So, you can do the math, how long will that take before every living Russian is injured or killed trying to conquer Ukraine?
That will change very quickly under Pres. Trump.
Ukraine's eastern strategy is almost 100% defensive, meaning they slowly give up small amounts of land -- roughly one square mile per day -- in exchange for huge numbers of Russian casualties, now up to circa 1,100 per day.
Ukrainians say Russia's "Meat Wave" assaults have increased their casualty ratio to six Russians for every Ukrainian casualty.
But how long either country can keep this up is anybody's guess.
Your cartoon below is how Lyndon Johnson defeated Barry Goldwater in 1964.
I remember the "Daisy Girl" add well.
I thought at the time the political ad meant that Pres. Johnson, unlike Sen. Goldwater, was not willing to do what was necessary to win in Vietnam, and time eventually proved that correct:
Results of 1964 election were defeat in 1975:
TEAM USA, F-Yea! Another Neo-Con cold war mindset. This country is truly in the grip of the DNC MSM.
"Losing" is a matter of definitions.
Arguably, in the US Revolutionary War, the Brits won more battles than they lost up until they lost the war in 1781.
What's certain is, Ukrainians have fought defensively in the Donbas for the past year, while Russians have used "Meat Wave" assaults to gain roughly one square mile per day, at a cost of something like 1,000 Russian casualties per square mile.
Ukrainians say the casualty ratio is now six Russians for every Ukrainian, so a day of 1,200 reported Russian casualties implies about 200 Ukrainians.
Is that winning or losing in the Donbas?
Are Ukrainians winning or losing in Kursk?
It's true that we did occasionally hear Republicans (i.e., Vivek Ramaswami) blindly repeating Russian propaganda, though not recently, and I've never heard any Republican repeat this particularly insane Russian garbage-talk, much less Donald Trump.
ransomnote: "We have audio of CIA Nuland ‘picking’ the people to install in charge of the government. "
What you heard was a casual conversation among diplomats, the sort of things they all do everyday, it does not suggest she or anyone else "picked" Ukraine's leaders.
LA LA LA
ransomnote: "That’s when Putin annexed territory - to keep NATO off his border.
You just sing LA LA LA louder when this is pointed out."
That "LA LA LA" you're hearing is the sound of Russian propaganda loudspeakers broadcasting their garbage-talk.
The fact is that Ukraine's 2013-2014 Euromaidan protests had nothing to do with military or NATO, and everything to do with economics and the European Union.
NATO was not part of events at all in 2014.
ransomnote: "The West overthrew the Ukraine and built/equipped an army to take on Putin, and provoked until he invaded."
All of that is 100% pure fact-free Russian propaganda nonsense, which no reasonable person believes, much less seriously repeats.
The truth is that after Vlad's 2014 invasion of Ukraine, the West (Obama) did almost nothing to help Ukraine defend itself from aggression, beyond blankets and MREs.
After Vlad's 2022 invasion, then the West stepped up and provided some pretty serious military aid, but never, never enough to actually defeat Russia.
Only just barely enough for Ukraine to avoid losing.
I suspect the West is really afraid of victory in Ukraine and will not do what's necessary to achieve it.
ransomnote: "Let’s not forget the bio warfare labs in the Ukraine..."
That is hilarious crazy talk, nothing serious about it.
ransomnote: "and the DNC, Biden, Schumer, Pelosi crime family activities in the Ukraine, which Zelensky refused to investigate. "
Hunter Biden's Ukraine employment is well known, as was VP Biden's interference and bribery there.
The rest of that is just Russian propaganda.
ransomnote: "The Ukraine is the DNC crime hub, although there are some republican traitors involved there too.
I’m not going to forget the thievery, fraud, child trafficking, organ harvesting, bio warfare lab territory of the Ukraine."
Again, all of that pure 100% fabricated Russian propaganda nonsense.
The reality is that 30 years ago Ukraine's corruption seemed identical to Russia's -- the worst in the world -- since they both came from the Old Soviet culture of corruption.
Today Russia is still what it was back then, but Ukraine has made serious progress in cleaning up its act and is no longer among the world's most corrupt.
So all of this Ukraine corruption talk is just red herrings and straw men intended to divert attention from the only point which really matters -- Russia invaded its neighbors, and that cannot stand, or the world itself will descend into chaos.
ransomnote to cronos: "Your assertion about Georgia Ukraine and NATO negating Putin’s moves is too irrational to bother with. "
Naw... your real problem is that you can't process facts, and the fact is that NATO's 2008 Bucharest summit had nothing to do with Vlad's 2014 invasion of Ukraine.
NATO was not the issue in 2014, the EU was.
Finally, I've posted here before, the one part of all this which lately does seriously worry me is the true story behind Maj. Alexander Vindman.
It potentially could change everything:
How the Second World War in Europe started, August 1939 Hitler-Stalin Alliance:
bimboeruption: "Hate Putin all you want, but don’t ignore the fact that the Soviets won WW2 in Europe."
Well, first, Putin had nothing to do with WWII, and second, there's no doubting that Russians suffered incredibly for Stalin's insane alliance with Hitler in 1939.
Estimates are circa 27 million Soviet deaths, or 14% of its population, half of those civilians.
But most important, the Old Soviets didn't fight and win that war by themselves, Stalin got enormous help from the US and UK:
Stalin wanted the higher death count so he could use it as a bargaining chip. “We lost 20 million, so we deserve half of Europe!”
Stalin got mad when the US/Britain tried to make a deal with the Germans late in the war, in order to get them to surrender in the West, so that it would save lives of US and British and German troops and civilians.
Stalin wanted the max possible death count on all sides.
"Mr. Republican", isolationist Ohio Sen. Taft:
Jumper: "TEAM USA, F-Yea!
Another Neo-Con cold war mindset.
This country is truly in the grip of the DNC MSM."
Now again you're just babbling insanely since:
"Mr. Conservative" Arizona Sen. Goldwater:
BroJoeK,
I skimmed your word salad and decided not to read through it after seeing your insistence that the Ukrainians were killing 3 Russians for every 1 soldier their side lost. You keep repeating this kind of ridiculous comment over and over - no need for me to bother reading the rest.
VIDEO
1. Update from Ukraine | Amazing! Ruzzian Army Fell for the Trap in Kursk and up to be Encircled
Denys Davydov
860K subscribers
9-15-2023 12:05 a.m. EDT
Minutes 28:04
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5tw5PbNgYOg
2a. RUSSIAN COUNTER-OFFENSIVE IN KURSK HAS BLOWN OFF STEAM, UKRAINIANS BREACHED THE BORDER AGAIN || 2024
Warthog Defense
672K subscribers
9-14-2024 9:00 a.m. EDT
Minutes 8:19
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4W7eaM4HgnM
2b. UKRAINIAN UNITS BREACHED THE ANOTHER PART OF THE BORDER WITH RUSSIA AND ADVANCED 2 KILOMETERS | 2024
Warthog Defense
672K subscribers
9-14-2024 1:00 p.m. EDT
Minutes 9:02
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sulbTlowO7U
2c. RUSSIANS ARE STUNNED BY SUDDEN UKRAINIAN BORDER ATTACK AND A NEW BREACH INTO KURSK REGION || 2024
Warthog Defense
672K subscribers
9-14-2024 6:30 p.m. EDT
Minutes 8:03
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rs_BEWjGYOs
3. Putin Can’t Hide Devastating Losses Anymore. He Doesn’t Even Try!
The Russian Dude
245K subscribers
9-14-2024 6:00 a.m. EDT
Minutes 16:08
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=r5tI-YjqLSs
4. Japan Just Dealt Russia a DEVASTATING Blow!
The Military Show
1.04M subscribers
9-14-2024 1:00 p.m. EDT
Minutes 22:01
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6eHRi4fJA6s
“In this video, we explore Japan’s growing role in opposing Russia during the Ukraine conflict. Japan, once hesitant to engage directly in foreign conflicts, is now a key financial supporter of Ukraine, providing billions in aid.
We’ll cover the latest blow Japan has dealt to Russia with a new investment treaty, examine its long-standing tensions over the Northern Territories, and question whether Japan may soon escalate its involvement by providing military aid. Watch to understand Japan’s evolving stance against Putin.
Nooooo.... not really.
Sure, Germans wanted to surrender in their West and keep fighting Soviets in the East.
I can think of at least twice when they offered that deal to Western Allies.
And for sure, Stalin was paranoid and willing to believe anything suspicious, so he accused his allies of whatever he feared.
However, I've never seen evidence that any western leader seriously considered German offers for "western only" surrenders.
Now, if you wish to discuss Operation Unthinkable, we can, but that was planned after German surrender, not before.
I thought Denys Davidov was verboten on FR. 🤔
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Looks like you're back on Draft Dodging Denys' payroll, mommy.
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