Fables of the Ancients?-"The most renowned folklorist of his time" tackles the Qur'an [Long]

Frontpagemag ^ | March 1, 2024 | Danusha Goska

[SJackson]

Middle East and terrorism, occasional political and Jewish issues Ping List. High Volume If you’d like to be on or off, please FR mail me.

Alan Dundes, not all that fat.

[AndyJackson]

Thanks for posting this and bringing attention to a foundational figure in international scholarship.

[Red Badger]

The Qur’an’s devotion of so much verbiage to inculcating hatred against non-Muslims is unique in world scriptures.

The bottom line of the world's great religions is "Leave other people alone."

...and then there's Islam...................

[Notthemomma]

??? How to “FR mail” you? I don’t know that, and your profile has a hotmail email.

RE: Please add me to ping list: Middle East and terrorism, occasional political and Jewish issues Ping List.

notthemomma

[PIF]

his followers, who, after his death, did their admittedly flawed and incomplete best to gather their memories together into a written document.

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Oral traditions were woven into tapestries, and 200 years later gatherer into a written form (Syriac). Later translated into Arabic. Many mistranslations: like the Syriac word for ‘white fig” ( a valuable commodity in those days ) became ‘virgins’.

The article mentions the koran is the Islamic Bible, but fails to mention it needs 4 other holy books.

To understand what is being said you must read the Hadiths and Sunnahs which chronicle the life and sayings of Muhammad, these are Talibari, Muslim, Isaq and Bukhari; Hadiths are Mohammed’s word to his followers, the Sunnahs are the history of Muhammad and his motto (sic) was “Kill, kill, kill” ...

Or you could safely go with just killing, converting, or collecting money from everybody who is not a muslim, or not in your sect, or not in following the particular version preached by your imam; see Victor Mordicai: “Islam operates in this way: Kill the Jews on Saturday, the Christians on Sunday, the Buddists and Hindus are pagans - so kill them first, then everybody else. Next we kill each other.”

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One of the sayings of Mohammad is that Paradise can hold 72,000 jihadis, no more.

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“In respect to their treatment by scholars, the Bible and the Qur’an are not comparable.”

Also not comparable are Jesus and Mohammad, the mass murder ( he personally beheaded 40 Jewish captives after one battle ).

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“Love is very much not the book’s theme”
and has only one (1) mention.

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Dr. Bill “Warner compares canonical Muslim scripture with Mein Kampf and discovers that there is more antisemitic material in the former”

also see Prophet of Doom, Entire Book.pdf
http://prophetofdoom.net/pdf/Prophet_of_Doom_Entire_Book.pdf

Understanding The Koran by Bill Warner from New English Review, June 2008
https://www.politicalislam.com/understanding-the-koran/

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The main differences: Christianity is about love, life and creation. The koran is about death, murder and absolute obedience.

[Tell It Right]

Wonderful article contrasting the Bible with the Qua’ran.

[nopardons]

BTTT

[chajin]

I have learned a ton about Islam and the Quran this morning. As Jesus said, this kind only comes out by prayer and fasting. May our Lord continue to miraculously show Himself among the Muslim people.

[Verginius Rufus]

Very interesting.

I was a student at Berkeley while he was teaching there but never heard of him--I would have enjoyed hearing one of his lectures. Albert B. Lord was a visiting professor there one quarter and I did hear him lecture. I had never before encountered the idea that Parry's wife might have killed him.

[Robert A Cook PE]

Long. Intriguing. Thank you.

The writer’s infatuation with his professor is distracting, but must be waded through first.

[Red Badger]

Her..........

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SHjJKrBTB-8

[KamperKen]

I recently read “Did Muhammad Exist?” by Robert Spencer which touched on many of the points in the article. A fascinating read and it’s hard to believe that people will die for that incoherent nonsense.

One of Islam’s incentives to get men to wage war on non-Muslims is the ‘72 virgin reward in Paradise. In the Koran the reward is 72 “whites” and virgin is never mentioned. A ‘white’ at that time was a rare delicacy, a white raisin. So that had to be conveniently interpreted as ‘virgin’.

[SunkenCiv]

Thanks RACPE.

• Why an ISIS Propagandist Abandoned Islam [04/06/2022]

[Elsie]

The bottom line of the world's great religions is "Leave other people alone."

OH?

[Elsie]

(I think he meant PRIVATE REPLY)

[Elsie]

The article mentions the koran is the Islamic Bible, but fails to mention it needs 4 other holy books.

 

Golly!  Sounds like MormonISM!

 

 

 

 

 

The Qur’an is said to be the product of one man, Muhammad,

 

Golly!  Sounds like MormonISM!

 

 

 

 

 

Some Muslims, like the highly placed and influential Yasir Qadhi, do acknowledge that Muslim leaders have not been telling their followers the truth about the unchanging Qur’an. Qadhi, though, recommends that this information not be communicated to average Muslims, because it might cause them to lose faith.

 

 

Golly!  Sounds like MormonISM!

 

 

 

 

 

 

Contemporary Islamic dogma insists that Christians and Jews, out of perversity and defiance of God, “corrupted” scripture, and the contemporary Bible is the result of this wicked “corruption.” 

...Muslim leaders insist that wicked Christians and Jews corrupted the Bible in order to subvert the will of Allah.

 

Golly!  Sounds like MormonISM!

[Elsie]

 Golly!!

 

 

"I Will Be a Second Mohammed"

In the heat of the Missouri 'Mormon War' of 1838, Joseph Smith made the following claim,

           "I will be to this generation a second Mohammed, whose motto in treating for peace was "the Alcoran [Koran] or the Sword". So shall it eventually be with us: "Joseph Smith or the Sword!" [1]

It is most interesting that a self-proclaimed Christian prophet would liken himself to Mohammed, the founder of Islam. His own comparison invites us to take a closer look as well. And when we do, we find some striking and troubling parallels. Consider the following.

• Mohammed and Joseph Smith both had humble beginnings. Neither had formal religious connections or upbringing, and both were relatively uneducated. Both founded new religions by creating their own scriptures. In fact, followers of both prophets claim these scriptures are miracles since their authors were the most simple and uneducated of men.[2]

• Both prophets claim of having angel visitations, and of receiving divine revelation to restore pure religion to the earth again. Mohammed was told that both Jews and Christians had long since corrupted their scriptures and religion. In like manner, Joseph Smith was told that all of Christianity had become corrupt, and that consequently the Bible itself was no longer reliable. In both cases, this corruption required a complete restoration of both scripture and religion. Nothing which preceded either prophet could be relied upon any longer. Both prophets claim they were used of God to restore eternal truths which once existed on earth, but had been lost due to human corruption.

• Both prophets created new scripture which borrowed heavily from the Bible, but with a substantially new spin.   In his Koran, Mohammed appropriates a number of Biblical themes and characters, but he changes the complete sense of many passages, claiming to 'correct' the Bible. In so doing he changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place. In like manner, Joseph Smith created the Book of Mormon, much of which is plagiarized directly from the King James Bible. Interestingly, the Book of Mormon claims that this same Bible has been substantially corrupted and is therefore unreliable. In addition, Joseph Smith went so far as to actually create his own version of the Bible itself, the 'Inspired Version'  in which he both adds and deletes significant portions of text, claiming he is 'correcting' it. In so doing he also changes many doctrines, introducing his own in their place.

• As a part of their new scriptural 'spin', both prophets saw themselves as prophesied in scripture, and both saw themselves as a continuation of a long line of Biblical prophets. Mohammed saw himself as a continuation of the ministry of Moses and Jesus. Joseph Smith saw himself as a successor to Enoch, Melchizedek, Joseph and Moses. Joseph Smith actually wrote himself into his own version of the Bible by name.

• Both prophets held up their own scripture as superior to the Bible. Mohammed claimed that the Koran was a perfect copy of the original which was in heaven. The Koran is therefore held to be absolutely perfect, far superior to the Bible and superceding it. In like manner, Joseph Smith also made the following claim. "I told the Brethren that the Book of Mormon was the most correct of any book on earth, and the keystone of our religion, and a man would get nearer to God by abiding its precepts, than by any other book." [3]

• Despite their claim that the Bible was corrupt, both prophets admonished their followers to adhere to its teachings. An obvious contradiction, this led to selective acceptance of some portions and wholesale rejection of others. As a result, the Bible is accepted by both groups of followers only to the extent that it agrees with their prophet's own superior revelation.

• Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith taught that true salvation was to be found only in their respective religions. Those who would not accept their message were considered 'infidels', pagans or Gentiles. In so doing, both prophets became the enemy of genuine Christianity, and have led many people away from the Christ of the Bible.

• Both prophets encountered fierce opposition to their new religions and had to flee from town to town because of threats on their lives. Both retaliated to this opposition by forming their own militias. Both ultimately set up their own towns as model societies.

• Both Mohammed and Joseph Smith left unclear instructions about their successors. The majority of Mohammed's followers, Sunni Muslims, believe they were to elect their new leader, whereas the minority, Shiite Muslims, look to Ali ibn Abi lib, whom they consider Divinely appointed, as the rightful successor to Muhammad, and the first imam. (Ali was the cousin and son-in-law of the Islamic prophet Muhammad). Similarly, the majority of Joseph Smith's followers, Mormons, believed their next prophet should have been the existing leader of their quorum of twelve apostles, whereas the minority, RLDS, believed Joseph Smith's own son should have been their next prophet. Differences on this issue, and many others, have created substantial tension between these rival groups of each prophet.

• Mohammed taught that Jesus was just another of a long line of human prophets, of which he was the last. He taught that he was superior to Christ and superceded Him. In comparison, Joseph Smith also made the following claim.

"I have more to boast of than ever any man had. I am the only man that has ever been able to keep a whole church together since the days of Adam. A large majority of the whole have stood by me. Neither Paul, John, Peter, nor Jesus ever did it. I boast that no man ever did such a work as I. The followers of Jesus ran away from Him, but the Latter-day Saints never ran away from me yet." [4] In light of these parallels, perhaps Joseph Smith's claim to be a second Mohammed unwittingly became his most genuine prophecy of all.

---

[1] Joseph Smith made this statement at the conclusion of a speech in the public square at Far West, Missouri on October 14, 1838. This particular quote is documented in Fawn M. Brodie, No Man Knows My History, second edition, (New York: Alfred A. Knopf, 1971), p. 230-231. Fawn Brodie's footnote regarding this speech contains valuable information, and follows. except where noted, all the details of this chapter [16] are taken from the History of the [Mormon] Church. This speech, however, was not recorded there, and the report given here is based upon the accounts of seven men. See the affidavits of T.B. Marsh, Orson Hyde, George M. Hinkle, John Corrill, W.W. Phelps, Samson Avard, and Reed Peck in Correspondence, Orders, etc., pp. 57-59, 97-129. The Marsh and Hyde account, which was made on October 24, is particularly important. Part of it was reproduced in History of the [Mormon] Church, Vol. III, p. 167. See also the Peck manuscript, p. 80. Joseph himself barely mentioned the speech in his history; see Vol. III, p. 162.

[2] John Ankerberg & John Weldon, The Facts on Islam, (Eugene, OR: Harvest House Publishers, 1998), pp.8-9. Eric Johnson, Joseph Smith & Muhammed, (El Cajon, CA: Mormonism Research Ministry, 1998), pp. 6-7.

[3] Documentary History of the [Mormon] Church, vol.4, pp.461.

[4] Documentary History of the [Mormon] Church, vol.6, pp.408-409.

[PIF]

Well Ms Golly, Mormonism is a product of the 19th century, while Islam is a product of the 7th. Therefore, Mormonism is a product of Islam.

[Albion Wilde]

bump