Posted on 12/11/2023 4:51:35 PM PST by delta7
Sen. J.D. Vance said Sunday that U.S. officials should accept the notion that Ukraine is likely to “cede some territory” in its fight against unprovoked Russian aggression. The Ohio Republican’s remarks come as Congress weighs more aid for Ukraine, with Democrats calling for additional assistance with few if any strings attached and Republicans trying to link aid to more funding to secure the southern U.S. border. “What’s in America’s best interest is to accept Ukraine is going to have to cede some territory to the Russians and we need to bring this war to a close,” Mr. Vance, who opposes more aid, said on CNN’s “State of the Union.” “But when I think about the great human tragedy here, hundreds of thousands of Eastern Europeans innocent have been killed in this conflict, the thing that’s in our interest and in theirs is to stop the killing.” President Biden has requested another $60 billion for Ukraine as part of a $110 billion national security package that also includes money for Israel and Taiwan. “On the Ukraine question, in particular, everybody with a brain in their head knows this was always going to end in negotiation,” Mr. Vance said. “The idea that Ukraine was going to throw Russia back to the 1991 border was preposterous. Nobody actually believed it.”
What we’re saying to the president, and really to the entire world, is ‘You need to articulate what the ambition is. What is $61 billion going to accomplish that $100 billion hasn’t?’” he added.
OK. I’m starting to think some folks around here are related to Denys...in a hillbilly sort of way.
“Uncle grandpa”
Oh, lookie here! A brand new Zeeper who signed up less than a week ago.
What are your other handles on here? Just curious.
The Vloddy has got purty lips.
“they did it by over-running all their neighbors.”
Do you mean during WWII? Yes, they did, because those countries were between The SU and Germany, or actively helping Germany. Also, you neglect to mention they voluntarily left in 1991 so your claim is faulty.
The clock starts in 1547 with Ivan the Terrible. Moscow has been expansionist ever since. Which points up the problem with you Putin Pushers. You don’t actually know any history, and to make matters worse you don’t even seem to care.
100 years ago we taught Greek and Latin in high schools. Today we teach Remedial English in COLLEGE. Is that the problem? That you don’t read because you can’t?
I admit that the definitive history of “Russia” by George Vernadsky is five volumes, but you don’t have to read them all. This condensed version should be enough to open your eyes:
You can buy it used on Alibris for pocket change.
https://www.alibris.com/A-history-of-Russia-George-Vernadsky/book/2944719?qsort=p&matches=46
So how Mongolian are the Russian leaders in the Kremlin? By blood and by inspiration from Mongolian barbarism? It is said that 10% of Mongolians are decedents of Genghis Khan.
The Mongols did occupy Moscow for a while. And ruled brutally from there....
A very clear 1991 PDF version is better. I will read as much as I can >>>>
Can be downloaded to hard drive or NVMe to read anytime.
A very clear 2011 PDF version is better. I will read as much as I can >>>>
Can be downloaded to hard drive or NVMe to read anytime.
The real descendants of the Mongols are the Tatars. There wasn't a lot of interbreeding with Muskovite Slavs at first, since the Mongols (the Golden Horde, really) didn't occupy Moscow or any of the other forest zone cities. Their economy and their military were tied to their herds, which required steppe country. They weren't even big on cities, but they did have a bureaucratic capital at Sarai, on the Volga. From there they extracted tribute from the forest zone cities under threat of massive cavalry raids. Moscow sometimes allied themselves with the Mongols to suppress other cities in the region, and when the Golden Horde disintegrated (due largely to the invasions of Tamarlane), Moscow was in the best position to become dominant. The principle legacy the Mongols left Moscow was the idea of the khanate, which was religious observance of total, absolute dictatorship of one man. They have never broken that mold, even during the Soviet era. The collapse of the Soviet Union could not have resulted in any sort of representative government, because the people had no experience of it. Hence Putin.
In 500+ years of course, Slavs and Tatars inevitably interbred to some extent, although Slavs consider them an enemy people, they being Muslims where the East Slaves were Greek Orthodox. (West Slavs, e.g. the Poles, were Roman Catholics, and thereby hangs a tale.)
A much shorter but very enlightening read is: https://ricochet.com/1214468/finnish-intelligence-officer-explains-the-russian-mindset/
I honestly knew nothing of this Raisonovsky fellow. Vernadsky was the text for the high school course I took in 1963. My copy has of course long since been lost, and my memory dimmed, so I've ordered one off Alibris for a refresher. I cannot read long stuff on a computer. It's much too slow.
Looky, a retread troll.
This supposedly conservative campaign against Ukraine and Zelensky makes me sick. It’s lending substance to the charge that the Republicans are Putin’s best friends.
We haven’t lost a single American life in Ukraine. Putin is not your friend. This website is becoming about as bad as Fox News as far as Ukraine is concerned.
Kazan: "That's question you should have asked when Boris Johnson and the Biden regime killed a peace deal Ukraine had worked out with Russia in March of last year."
Allegations that Biden "killed a peace deal" are only a Russian propaganda claim.
No one on the Ukrainian side has ever confirmed it.
The real truth is probably something like this: Ukraine's leadership, political and military, didn't like the deal its diplomats reached with Russia.
They may have turned to Americans asking, how long will we support them if they continue to fight to liberate their territories?
The answer from Biden et al came back, as they said publicly, "for as long as it takes".
Based on American assurances, Ukrainians decided to reject what Vlad the Invader was offering.
Of course, one problem Ukrainians may not have realized is, they were talking to our Democrats, and Democrats are not very good at keeping their promises.
When the going gets tough, Democrats often run for the hills, especially when they can find a way to blame their defeats on Republicans.
Now is a time of testing, how strong was the Democrats' promise to Ukraine?
Kazan: "This idea Ukraine has ever been in charge of making its own decisions in this proxy war is lunacy.
This has been a NATO proxy war against Russia from the start."
Those words are pure Russian propaganda insanity.
Only the likes of Vlad the Invader could even imagine such words.
None intended. 👍
To The Marines that is 😉
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.