Posted on 06/12/2022 4:46:31 PM PDT by UMCRevMom@aol.com
Amen to that.
I am intrigued by the Shroud, and would love it to be genuine, smack in the face of all the doubters.
Having said that, I've seen suggestions that the image could have been formed by a sudden burst of intense energy that emanated outwardly in every direction and "scorched" (for want of a better word) the Shroud in a manner in which the intensity of the "scorch" at any given point was indicative of the distance between that point and the surface of the Body's skin. Therefore, the points where the image is darkest (or lightest, in the negative) are those where the Shroud was in actual contact with the skin ... while the points where there is little or no color in the image were not in direct or close contact with the skin.
Thanks for the kudos and the great input on this thread, folks! :-)
I believe the scripture, King James, ASV, and some of the others. I cannot cite chapter and verse on much of anything, but I study often, and have for many years.
I do not care for or trust the shroud. It does not have the top of the head. I see two images, front and back, without the space for the top of the head. There does not seem to be any depth to whatever may have been between the folded cloth could not be more than an inch or two thick.
Also, looking at the face reminds me more of a painting by a less than accurate artist. It does not look ‘photographic’ in any way.
And scripture is enough to lead to belief. Differing translations may cast shadows on certain specifics, but an honest quest will lead a student to the truth in all matters.
Guess that's possible. However, I still think the facial image would be distorted once laid flat. There is a lot of shadow in the positive image that the Shroud may not be touching, but wouldn't that alone show some distortion, rather than a 2 dimensional face with shadows in proportion?
“...smack in the face of all the doubters.”
That would help a few, but not as many as you’d hope.
Consider: Revelation describes events that ARE COMING. ANYBODY can read it and learn what’s going to happen. The Church has been proclaiming what will happen for centuries. Yet, WHEN it happens, there’s not a wholesale turning TO Christ, but polarization: revival and apostasy simultaneously. MANY who didn’t believe finally “Get it” but in the ranks of churches around the globe, there’s the greatest falling AWAY from Him EVER; it will be crystal clear that you CANNOT live in compromise AND follow Christ, and MANY will throw Christ under the bus, and walk away. And the rest of the Doubters aren’t suddenly won over in recognition that what they now see with their own two eyes has been in print for two thousand years, instead THEY’RE OFFENDED, and ANGRY that it’s really real, because their worldviews DEMAND that it NOT be real, and they KNOW it.
And not just all the events, but then YOU vanish just like you said you would; vindicating every truth you ever uttered about the gospel and The Kingdom of God. Like that’s not going to impact your neighbors and the people you work with?
The GREATEST VINDICATION of The Church, of Christians, and of Christ Himself, is going to play out in physical reality before the eyes of the entire world in the cataclysms of the Seals, the Trumpets, and the Bowls of wrath; and whereas there are MANY who will finally turn and be saved, yet there are many who will retreat into obstinate unbelief.
NOW it becomes a matter NOT that they don’t have enough information to believe, NOW it’s that they have enough information to KNOW, but they HATE what they now cannot deny, and actively, intentionally, obstinately REFUSE to believe.
I have so many questions; I wish we could sit and talk for a while...
But it "can" do so. All that is necessary is to carbon date the pollen grains, which really is doable and requires no new sampling of the shroud. If the geographical pollen type matches the age of the pollen grains, it would provide solid proof.
“I have so many questions...”
You aren’t the only one, and your questions are likely the same ones many others have.
“I wish we could sit and talk for a while...”
Well, it’s an open forum; we can chat here, if you feel the Q&A might benefit others, or take it offline via Private Reply. I’m working, but poke my nose in here often enough that exchanges don’t drag too much.
Your call.
https://talesoftimesforgotten.com/2020/02/24/sorry-the-shroud-of-turin-is-definitely-a-hoax/
Great post!
Thank you!
Already provided in post #12. You’ll note that quite a few of the commenters on that blog were quite critical of his supposed claim that the Shroud of Turin is “definitely” a hoax, for what it’s worth.
“...could have been formed by a sudden burst of intense energy that emanated outwardly in every direction...”
Many researchers also think the burst of energy is the mechanism - but iirc it was only in the vertical orientation (both up and down). They were able to replicate a similar image using a standard copy machine or similar. (That was from the TV show where they made the 3-d image of the head.)
I read somewhere that some woman researcher - nuclear physicist or something, thought that it may have been like a mini “Big Bang”. I can’t remember if it was her or someone else that made the correlation between the original “Big Bang” (Creation) and Jesus’ Resurrection being a “new creation”.
Clearing cache worked. Thanks!
RE: your questions
Let me point you to the website of Mike Bickle, a reliable teacher in whom I have confidence. And let me tell you this, too: Mike is the same guy off stage as he is up there with the mic in his hand; he’s the genuine article, not a performer.
Anyway, the website has notes, transcripts, video, downloadable audio — probably, at least initially, just watching the videos will be enough; perhaps with the associated notes in-hand to follow along. ALSO, I HIGHLY recommend if you hear something that makes you go “Huh?” rewind the video and play that part again to ensure you heard right, then maybe pause it and search out the related scriptures listed in the notes. Mike has NEVER advocated anybody just take his word for it; he’s ALWAYS saying — and you’ll see this in the notes — “I urge you to refuse any teaching that you do not clearly see with your eyes in your Bible.”
Feel free to explore the website more broadly; there are thousands of resources posted on many many topics.
This link is to an introductory series within a resource area dealing with the book of Revelation:
https://mikebickle.org/resource/introduction-and-overview-of-the-book-of-revelation/
And scripture is enough to lead to belief. Differing translations may cast shadows on certain specifics, but an honest quest will lead a student to the truth in all matters.
>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>....
Two points re the above comments: (1) the shroud to my knowledge, whether it’s the real deal or not, has never been presented for the purpose of convincing anyone of the truths of the faith. It is simply an historical relic which some believe to be genuine while others question its origin. And (2) most educated people would consider it quite naive to believe that an honest quest will inevitably lead one to the truth. That is because an honest quest itself does not bear any relationship whatever to the truth of any matter much less “all” matters!
Your link refers back to this thread.
My God, that author is pig-fornicatingly stupid.
And uninformed to boot.
Many thanks.
You are very welcome!
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