Posted on 02/27/2022 1:48:17 PM PST by Hostage
Patriarch Kirill of Moscow and All Rus is not calling for peace in Ukraine, and the fact that some in the Western media seem to think he has done so is evidence of how much the West has to learn about Orthodox Christianity, church-state relations in Russia, and Kirill himself.
The first time the leader of the Russian Orthodox Church spoke after Russian troops entered Ukraine (but before fighting had officially begun) was during the commemoration for Defender of the Fatherland Day (known, before 1993, as Red Army Day) when Kirill offered a long, nationalist sermon in which he described the “sacred border of Russia” and called our era a “time of peace”—which seems quite inexplicable considering current events.
At the exact moment Putin announced the “special military operation” in (i.e. invasion of) Ukraine, Kirill issued a toothless statement that not only failed to plainly call for the end of violence, but actually re-stated the historical justification for the invasion that had been offered by Vladimir Putin earlier in the week. This shouldn’t be too surprising as it’s the same version of history Kirill has used before to argue against the independence of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church and in favor of keeping Ukrainian Orthodox Christians under the yolk of Moscow.
Kirill’s tepid remarks also stand in contrast to the words of other Orthodox hierarchs. The Ecumenical Patriarch Bartholomew of Constantinople, for example, called the invasion an unprovoked attack and a violation of human rights. Patriarch Daniel of Romania called the violence, “ a war launched by Russia against a sovereign and independent state.” Even Metropolitan Onufry, the head of the Ukrainian Orthodox Church that’s still tied to the Moscow Patriarchate—literally, Kirill’s Man in Kyiv—compared the Russian invasion to Cain killing his brother Abel and addressed Putin directly.
This difference has not gone unnoticed by those in Russia and Ukraine and throughout the Eastern Christian world.
The Orthodox are also not centralized. They are mostly united in liturgy and rituals but they have many many Patriarchs that are not under one and only one Patriarch although the Moscow Patriarch would like all Orthodox to acknowledge his patriarchy as the superior one. It doesn't work that way.
In fact, the Moscow Patriarch Kirill is known as a former KGB informant. It's true. The Soviets installed who they liked as Moscow Patriarch. Note the fall of the USSR was 30 years ago. Kirill is now 70 years old.
Here's some insight:
Underneath their faithful devotion to their Orthodox Church (Orthodox are not vertically commanded like Roman Catholics), Russians, Ukrainians, Greeks and Slavic peoples in general, could care less personally about the clergy except that they expect that the clergy adhere to the faith, why? Because the Orthodox faith is 99% liturgical, ritualistic. There is not a prayer or service that deviates from the same script that has gone on for more than a thousand years.
When you are Orthodox and you enter the Church, it really doesn't matter who is the priest, deacon, head of the sisterhood, etc. So, it doesn't matter who is in the Synod, who is the Patriarch of such and such (there are many Patriarchs as the Orthodox Church is not centralized).
There are famous Saints, and there are awesome off-the-grid, self-reliant Monks who are young, strong, capable of building prescription-coded Churches, Monasteries, Convents from scratch, from the middle of nowhere.
There's a lot of great culture and history to the Orthodox Church. In fact, the vestments and manners of the Orthodox Church are following the Jewish Levitical traditions. The Orthodox are very aware that the Roman Jew known as Saul and created as the Apostle Paul is the founder of their Church. The Orthodox feel a direct connection with history and they are not bound to some religious oligarch like Patriarch Kirill.
But the take-away is that their Church is where they come as Orthodox to pay their respects to God and His Son, and not to some Patriarch who is privately known to be untrustworthy, but who nevertheless gets a momentary side nod by the faithful as they proceed to worship in the ancient services. In this way, the Orthodox are polite to clergy but not bowing before the clergy. When you see an Orthodox bowing before the Priest of the Church, it is not the person wearing the priestly vestments they bow to, rather they bow to the tradition of the Church.
Save Thy people, O Lord,
and bless Thine inheritance.
Grant victory to Thy Church over her enemies,
and protect Thy people by Thy Holy Cross!
This religious freak is obviously on Pukins payroll.
Patriarch Kirill is not Putin’s accomplice.
Putin is not a Christian
He's worse, an accomplice would mean he was somewhat equal to Putin, Kirill is a stooge. He does the bidding of Putin.
I thought both Russians and Ukrainians were Greek Orthodox.
JUST IN - Head of the Russian Orthodox Church, Patriarch Kirill, calls Putin's opponents in Ukraine "evil forces," and believes "we must not allow dark and hostile external forces to laugh at us." (Interfax) pic.twitter.com/GrXIW2Asbq— Disclose.tv (@disclosetv) February 27, 2022
Kirril actually is pretty strong on defending Christian civilisation. Unlike the marxist in the vatican
Patriarch Kirill is not a stooge.
All these attacks on the most prolific pro-life leader Russia has are problematic.
Orthodox Russians are part of the Patriarchate of Moscow.
The Ukraine is disputed a disputed territory religiously. One Orthodox faction is loyal to the Moscow Patriarchate.
Most of the country claims autocephalacy which had been granted the Ecumenical Patriarchate, headquartered in Constantinople.
Epiphany of the Kyiv Patriarchate is the leader for Orthodox Ukrainians. Kirill is of the Moscow Patriarch. Ukrainian Orthodox churches are owned by the parish, so they can vote to change allegiance to another Patriarch. With rising Ukrainian nationalism the Moscow church has been losing parishes.
Pro-life? How many Orthodox people are going to die in this stupid Putin inspired invasion? Kirill statement from today, shows he's a willing Putin stooge:
Head of the Russian Orthodox Church, Patriarch Kirill, calls Putin's opponents in Ukraine "evil forces," and believes "we must not allow dark and hostile external forces to laugh at us." (Interfax) pic.twitter.com/GrXIW2Asbq— Disclose.tv (@disclosetv) February 27, 2022
My mom and I were discussing Pat Kirill today. She said she doesn’t think he’s ready for martyrdom (in contrast to St. Tikhon who was murdered after the bolsheviks took Russia). I believe she is right.
There are righteous patriarchs and unrighteous patriarchs. There are righteous priests and unrighteous priests. We believe God will sort it out.
This article makes some statement about the UOC and that objection to it is because of politics. What a lot of heterodox do not understand is that adulterating and child diddling clergy get excommunicated from the Orthodox Church, as they should be. Then they’ll go post up shop in some schism church, like the UOC. Keeping the schism churches out of the Church is how we stay away from Rome’s problems. Oh, and men should be married before they’re ordained to priesthood (unless they’ve become a monk, which isn’t a willy nilly decision).
Point being, the UOC was full of corrupt schismatics who had been kicked out the real Church, from all over the Slavic lands. Almost all the patriarchs objected to Bart making the UOC autocepholus. But Bart is basically the “orthodox” equivalent of Francis. A leftist pushing leftism.
> “I thought both Russians and Ukrainians were Greek Orthodox.”
All are different.
Russian Orthodox under Moscow Patriarch
Ukrainian Orthodox under Kyev Patriarch
Greek Orthodox under Patriarch of Jerusalem
All have different Patriarchs.
Orthodox Church does have a ‘Pope’. They have a Synod but all the various Church hierarchies are under different Patriarchs.
Orthodox Church does NOT have a ‘Pope’.
You left out the ‘first among equals’ the Ecumenical Patriarch of Constantinople (now Istanbul)
https://ec-patr.org/
Also, the Copts (Egyptians) they call Pope.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pope_of_the_Coptic_Orthodox_Church#:~:text=Pope%20%28Coptic%3A%20%E2%B2%A0%E2%B2%81%E2%B2%A1%E2%B2%81%2C%20papa%29%20has%20been%20the%20specific,to%20Constantinople%20in%20the%20East%2C%20to%20his%20guidance.
And the Ethiopians
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ethiopian_Orthodox_Tewahedo_Church#Similarities_to_Judaism_and_Islam
You’re obviously in a faithfully adhering region of Orthodox Churches. Not all Orthodox Churches are as clear.
You might be unfair to certain patriarchy groups because your own local groups are weeding out nonconformists.
My information concerning Kirill (now 70 years of age) as a KGB informant during the USSR 40 years ago, came from those who escaped Soviet control or who had family that were trapped in the Soviet sphere.
This article corraborates the witness of those that suffered in that time. Whether or not the UOC is tainted here is irrelevant to me as I have no experience with UOC nor do I care to. My experience stems from elderly God-Parents who escaped and through others attending a Tsarist Church in Seattle.
Seattle has a very large Tsarist Russian community of more than three generations, how did that happen?
St. John of Shanghai led more than 15,000 orphans of the White Russian Army in the 1920s. traveling across the Trans Siberian frost to China and then to Shanghai where he with other Bishops and clergy nearly perished with the orphans. Through a miracle of God, they were able to buy two dilapidated tanker ships that were barely seaworthy and then set sail towards the United States once they secured sponsorship from the Orthodox Church in San Francisco.
When the ships finally arrived in San Francisco after almost capsizing at sea, it was deemed there were two many orphans to accommodate. Arrangements were made with the Orthodox Church in Seattle to take half of the Shanghai orphans.
Today, there are tens of thousands of descendants from those Russian Tsarist Orthodox and many of them have kept the old Tsarist traditions and language. I can attest these Orthodox are very trustworthy. The refugees they accept are screened.
My Godmother was a Serbian princess fluent in 5 different languages. She was living with her husband in Leipzig, Germany. She was summoned to Berlin when the Soviets occupied East Germany. She was to translate secret documents under Soviet Field Marshal Zhukov which she knew was a death sentence, why? Because all translators were immediately executed after to preserve secrets. She was helped with an arrangement to escape with her husband and others from East to West Germany by hiding under layers of coal in coal rail cars across he border from East to West.
Most escapees came to New York and many of those found their way to Seattle. They met up in the old Tsarist Orthodox Church in Seattle and confirmed their knowledge that Kirill was a KGB informant with blood on his hands.
I have no reason whatsoever to doubt these people and their witness,
I thought Kirill’s worldly name was Col. Gundyaev.
Disclaimer: Opinions posted on Free Republic are those of the individual posters and do not necessarily represent the opinion of Free Republic or its management. All materials posted herein are protected by copyright law and the exemption for fair use of copyrighted works.