Sanhedrin Petitions to Govt to Blow Shofar on Temple Mount for First Time Since Temple Destruction

Breaking Israel News ^ | 24 Aug 20 | Adam Eliyahu Berkowitz

[jjotto]

Somehow, Rav Kanievsky, and Ravs Mazuz and Shalom Cohen aren’t really impressed.

[Cronos]

Whatever Works No Christians are mentioned after chapter four in Revelation.

And this is a false rapturist belief that Jesus' teachings do not apply to (as you put it) Christians

Some of you rapturists like Clarence Lakin even believe that hte Sermon on the Mount has "no application to the Christian, but only tot hose who are under the Law" -- furthermore your claim of the reign being purely corporeal completes misunderstands the message of Isaiah, Jermiah, Ezekiel and Daniel and the message of the entire New Testament.

The vision of Daniel teaches that there will be (in Daniel's future) one Messiah who will come and then be "cut off". The Messiah's career is preceded by the second Temple, which must first be rebuilt for Him and will then be destroyed. There is only ONE Messiah and ONE temple (the second temple that was destroyed in 70 AD) and their rise and fall are described in relation to each other

Daniel's vision clearly says shall cause sacrifice and offering to cease -- and that is what HAPPENED in 70 AD with the destruction of the temple

[Cronos]

The book of revelations is about the Roman destruction of jerusalem in 70 AD - triggered by the Jewish attacks on romans in 66 AD

Go back to 70 AD and see how the commander of the world's most powerful army looked over a great city burning.

August 10, 70 AD is the day that Revelation speaks of

Until 63 AD, the Empire considered the jesus-movement (Christians) as a sect within Judaism - a recognized religion within the Empire.

But in July of 64 AD, Nero agreed with the Sanhedrin that the Jesus movement, the Christians were NOT a part of Judaism and the persecution of Christians started.

This state-sponsored persecution lasted from July 64 to Feb 67 AD

Then in 66 AD the Jews revolted.

The Jewish-Roman war lasted 42 months, 3.5 years, 1260 days as we read in Daniel and Revelations

The first three chapters give the historical setting -- and remember the numbers are critical - it is a symbolic book

7 = sign of completeness

3 number of God

4 number of earth

6 incompleteness.

repeat 3 times means the Most - so 666 is the MOST incomplete.

===============

Revelations chapters 4 through 18 mention the saints - those who make up the church, on average almost once every chapter. These saints, the church are ON EARTH - not 'raptured away'

In 5:5 we read that the Lamb Has conquered so that He can open the scroll and its seven seals - He has already established a Kingdom - present tense. The Kingdom is in existence even before the events of the Apocalypse take place, even before we get to the description of the Millennium

God's Kingdom WAS established whn the Lamb "didst ransom men for God from every tribe and tongue and people and nation'

Then 144,000 - remember the book of Revelations is filled with symbolic numbers. 144,000 is twelve squared times ten cubed. These are the Jesus-movement Jews in the Church before the fall of the temple in 70 AD.

[babble-on]

My understanding is that the Jews themselves don’t fare all that well in this hypothetical run.

[Jim W N]

Sorry Pal, you can’t spiritualize away the fact that God’s Word says the whole earth is dead after the seven-year tribulation (except for Israel’s remnant hiding in the mountains).

You’re stuck on your doctrine which I think you hold more dear than the plain Word of God, but either way this discussion has come to a dead end.

I’ll look for your surprised face in Heaven prior to the utterly unimaginable horror that will take place during the seven-year period of the Wrath of the Lamb to which God’s children are not appointed according to I & II Thessalonians.

Good luck.

[Elsie]

Tombs or homes?

[Elsie]

there are enough carved-out dwellings there to hold a few million

It'll be a little snug...

---

20,000 inhabitants

Petra flourished in the 1st century AD, when its famous Al-Khazneh structure – believed to be the mausoleum of Nabataean king Aretas IV – was constructed, and its population peaked at an estimated 20,000 inhabitants.

Petra - Wikipedia

[Jim W N]

Elsie, you started out saying you knew of no evidence of dwellings in Petra and came across you had no clue what Petra was at all. Now you acknowledge dwellings are there.

As I said do you research.

It doesn’t really matter the location. God has prepared a place and any one who does good-faith research will find Petra is a good candidate.

I find your responses to show less than good faith and more just contentious and argumentative.

See ya.

[Cronos]

Sorry pal, you haven't read the book of revelations. It doesn't say the whole world is dead.

And the hiding in the mountains is of Christians

12 I watched as he opened the sixth seal. There was a great earthquake. The sun turned black like sackcloth made of goat hair, the whole moon turned blood red, 13 and the stars in the sky fell to earth, as figs drop from a fig tree when shaken by a strong wind. 14 The heavens receded like a scroll being rolled up, and every mountain and island was removed from its place.

15 Then the kings of the earth, the princes, the generals, the rich, the mighty, and everyone else, both slave and free, hid in caves and among the rocks of the mountains. 16 They called to the mountains and the rocks, “Fall on us and hide us[f] from the face of him who sits on the throne and from the wrath of the Lamb! 17 For the great day of their[g] wrath has come, and who can withstand it?”

you, Jim W, haven't read the book at all, have you?

• The first horseman (v6:1-2) talks of the false hope of conquest - as the Jewish Zealot rebels thought of their early victories in 66 AD
  
  
• The second horseman (6:3-4) is civil unrest - Josephus recounts how civil unrest abounded in Judaea. In addition there was civil unrest in Rome that was so great, it was though that the Roman empire (the beast on which the woman, i.e. the Sanhedrin rides) itself would collapse and be conquered
  
  
• The third horseman (6:5-6) - famine, exactly as happened when the legions came in from 67 to 70 AD
  
  
• the fourth horseman (6:7-8) - Pale, chloros in Greek - which is better translated as green - meaning sickness. Josephus describes the state of Jerusalem before it fell

  The madness of the seditious did also increase together with their famine, and both those miseries were every day inflamed more and more; for there was no corn which anywhere appeared publicly, but the robbers came running into, and searched men's private houses; and then, if they found any, they tormented them, because they had denied they had any; and if they found none, they tormented them worse, because they supposed they had more carefully concealed it... a table was nowhere laid for a distinct meal, but they snatched the bread out of the fire, half-baked, and ate it very hastily.

  Violence and famine afflicted Jerusalem in 67-70 AD, JUST as in the book of Revelations<
  
  
• The fifth SEAL - the souls under the altar (6:9-11) -- this is related to Jesus's words to the pharisees in Mt 23:32-25 Fill up, then, the measure of your fahters... that upon you may come all the righteous blood shed on earth, from the blood of innocent Abel to the blood of Zechariah the son of Barachiah, whom you murdered between the sanctuary and the altar. Truly I say to you, all this will come upon this generation
  
  
• The Sixth seal - the Wrath of the Lamb - 6:12-17 --> this echoes chapter 2 where the destruction is given in apocalyptic exaggerative terms - just as in Isaiah 34:4,10

  4. All the stars in the sky will be dissolved
  and the heavens rolled up like a scroll;
  all the starry host will fall
  like withered leaves from the vine,
  like shriveled figs from the fig tree.
  
  5 My sword has drunk its fill in the heavens;
  see, it descends in judgment on Edom,
  the people I have totally destroyed.
  6 The sword of the Lord is bathed in blood,
  it is covered with fat—
  the blood of lambs and goats,
  fat from the kidneys of rams.
  For the Lord has a sacrifice in Bozrah
  and a great slaughter in the land of Edom.
  7 And the wild oxen will fall with them,
  the bull calves and the great bulls.
  Their land will be drenched with blood,
  and the dust will be soaked with fat.
  
  8 For the Lord has a day of vengeance,
  a year of retribution, to uphold Zion’s cause.
  9 Edom’s streams will be turned into pitch,
  her dust into burning sulfur;
  her land will become blazing pitch!
  10 It will not be quenched night or day;
  its smoke will rise forever.
  From generation to generation it will lie desolate;
  no one will ever pass through it again.
  

  In fact the wording of 6:12-17 is taken almost verbatim from Isaiah 34, where Edom is told of God's coming judgement -- the message that john writes in 66 AD is that Jerusalem soon, by 70 AD will experience the same judgement God leveled against the Edomites, because Jerusalem of 67 AD has become like them

  Mountains and islands were places of refuge - hence the usage here that there will have been in 70 AD no place to hide.

  This echoes Jesus' warning to the women in Luk 23;28-31 Then they will begin to say tot he mountains, 'Fall on us'; and to the hills 'Cover us'.

[Cronos]

hiding in the mountains of Petra

That's biblically false - Jesus told the Christians to hide in the mountains and that's what they did - have you never heared fo the flight of Christians from the Jerusalem seige to Pellas?

Do you not realize that this prophecy of jesus' was seen as further proof of his deity and a further impetus for Christianity to stop being just another sect of 2nd temple Judaism - in fact 2nd temple judaism ended in 70 AD and it's daughter religions - Christianity and Pharisee-ism (what we call Judaism today) remained.

[Cronos]

Then the entire Petra nonsense - you don't seem to know how far Petra is from Jerusalem

And you don't seem to realize that there are other mountains before that

Furthermore Petra is built along a gully - while to the north there are plenty of caves -w here Christians fled to during the seige

Jim The Bible says that for whatever reason, the “beast” can’t get to them there in Petra. - the Bible says nothing of that sort. you, Jim, are adding to the words of John in the book of revelations and sinning as John wrote about in 22:18 For I testify to every one that heareth the words of the prophecy of this book: If any man shall add to these things, God shall add unto him the plagues written in this book

- Then you quote Daniel 11:41 - without having read what comes before with the prediction of Khorush, the King of Kings of Persia - And he shall enter into the glorious land, and many shall fall: and these only shall be saved out of his hand, Edom, and Moab, and the principality of the children of Ammon - this is about the King of the north, of Fars

[Elsie]

I admit that I didn’t know of dwellings there; but you typed there were MILLIONS, and it didn’t sound right to me.

I was born in Indianapolis, and live just one county away now. INDY has slightly over 1,000,000 pop. and I know how much area that takes up.

It was YOUR initial input here that got me to looking for anything about Petra.

I don’t like being found wrong after I’ve posted something; but I usually don’t blame the other fella for my mistake; and he’s helped me to learn something new.

I think we both have and perhaps have shown others about Petra that they were unaware.

It does look like a really cool place to visit!

[Jim W N]

A good, well-researched book on the subject is "Petra" by N.W. Hutchings.

[Elsie]

Thanks!

[Jim W N]

You’re welcome. Fascinating stuff.

Real truth is more interesting than fiction IMO and what’s coming is mind blowing but for the believer only good things in store.