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New Floyd Murder Charges Will Be Tough to Prove and May Imperil Good Cops
National Review ^ | June 4, 2020 | Andrew C. McCarthy

Posted on 06/04/2020 1:15:38 PM PDT by karpov

Prosecutors in Minnesota have filed an amended complaint against Derek Chauvin for the killing of George Floyd, adding a second-degree “felony murder” charge. This dangerously flawed theory could be used to portray any police restraint of a resistant suspect as criminal assault.

The amended complaint against Chauvin also re-alleges the two homicide charges originally filed last week: third-degree “depraved indifference” murder and second-degree manslaughter, both of which better fit the facts of the case while posing no risk of criminalizing the legitimate use of force by good cops.

Separately, the other three fired Minneapolis police officers involved in the killing have been charged, after a week of demands by the Floyd family, as well as intense anti-police rhetoric (and worse) by Black Lives Matter activists and protesters.

Tou Thao, J. Alexander Kueng, and Thomas Lane are charged with aiding and abetting both second-degree murder (the new charge against Chauvin) and manslaughter. Weirdly, under the circumstances, the three are not charged with the “depraved indifference” murder count; nor are they accused of committing manslaughter as principals — they are charged only as aiders and abettors, a theory that does not jibe with a negligence charge such as second-degree manslaughter (which is negligent homicide under Minnesota law).

Felony Murder: Criminalizing Police Restraint of Suspects

The second-degree murder charge is now the main charge against all four officers. Essentially, the theory is that they committed a felony assault when they subdued a suspect who was resisting arrest. During the course of carrying out that “crime,” prosecutors allege, Floyd’s death resulted.

While the point may be subtle, this is saliently different from the theory of third-degree murder — i.e., depraved-indifference murder.

(Excerpt) Read more at nationalreview.com ...


TOPICS: Crime/Corruption; News/Current Events; US: Minnesota
KEYWORDS: keithellison
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To: Mathews
He wants the cops to go free so the riots will continue through the election.

This is a murder trial. It's not going to be wrapped up by November. It probably won't be wrapped up by November 2021. It took well over a year for the Noor case to go from indictment to sentencing, I expect this will easily take that long or longer.

21 posted on 06/04/2020 1:50:15 PM PDT by DoodleDawg
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To: karpov

Listeniing to the mob, they are going to elevate the charges beyond what they can prove. then we really will have a mess.


22 posted on 06/04/2020 1:51:25 PM PDT by Midwesterner53
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To: karpov
Criminalizing the use of force to restrain suspects would hamstring the police

Applying any of the "Choker Holds," where you cut off one or both carotid arteries absolutely should not be allowed. You can render a person unconscious in about 30 seconds and in some cases kill him in a minute.

Eight minutes? He was trying to kill him. Or send Floyd's IQ down to rutabaga territory.

They knew each other. Probably hated each other, and this killing stems from that. imho

Outlaw the choker hold and all its variants. There are literally hundreds of other effective holds and restraints police can use that aren't as lethal.

23 posted on 06/04/2020 2:01:14 PM PDT by LibWhacker
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To: DoodleDawg

There were no Riots during the Noor case and it didn’t fit the leftist agenda. They have the opportunity to defend police departments, convince folks private property rights are stupid and they literally have white bowing down to them.

They want the riots...


24 posted on 06/04/2020 2:06:33 PM PDT by Mathews (ItÂ’s all gravy, baby!)
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To: Samurai_Jack

Overcharge=plea bargain leverage.

Usually

This is not a usual case.

These guys can’t get a fair trial

They have already been tried and convicted in the public opinion and by many here.


25 posted on 06/04/2020 2:07:45 PM PDT by RummyChick ( Yeah, it's Daily Mail. So what. AND I AM NOT FACT CHECKING POSTS. I AM NOT TWITTER)
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To: Samurai_Jack

I concur, Ellison taking over the prosecution almost guaranteed this outcome.


26 posted on 06/04/2020 2:09:57 PM PDT by Fireone (Build the gallows first, then the wall!)
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To: karpov

......... Because they chose the harder to prove charge ...... The not guilty verdict will come out a month or so before the election ... That’s when the new riots will begin.


27 posted on 06/04/2020 2:12:54 PM PDT by R_Kangel ("A nation of sheep will beget a nation ruled by wolves")
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To: karpov

They are not going to have to prove anything.

Any jury would be too scared not to convict.

Just show up, show all the videos and say the prosecution rests.


28 posted on 06/04/2020 2:13:22 PM PDT by skinndogNN
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To: skinndogNN

What if they all get convicted, imprisoned and released due to the Covid sare?


29 posted on 06/04/2020 2:16:48 PM PDT by wolfman
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To: skinndogNN

In a normal case these nuances discussed in this article are pertinent..and important.

https://thedispatch.com/p/derek-chauvins-actions-were-cruel

It is not a slam dunk case...NORMALLY

But this time, it might be. They need a very skilled and likeable lawyer.


30 posted on 06/04/2020 2:17:07 PM PDT by RummyChick ( Yeah, it's Daily Mail. So what. AND I AM NOT FACT CHECKING POSTS. I AM NOT TWITTER)
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To: RummyChick
"After studying the Minnesota statutes and cases, my criminal law students often express exasperation—I don’t understand what these crimes mean. All I can tell them is: It’s a matter of degree. Both crimes cover unintentional homicides caused by risky, dangerous acts. Accidental deaths caused by merely negligent behavior are not homicide at all. At some point, if the degree of negligence is more extreme, it crosses the blurry line into manslaughter. And at some further point, when the defendant’s conduct is even more outrageously risky, it crosses another blurry line into murder. It’s a judgment call. Jurors get to decide, and there’s no telling what they’ll do in any given case.

If law students struggle with these definitions, jurors struggle even more"
31 posted on 06/04/2020 2:20:04 PM PDT by RummyChick ( Yeah, it's Daily Mail. So what. AND I AM NOT FACT CHECKING POSTS. I AM NOT TWITTER)
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To: RummyChick

and here is the analysis after the new charges

https://thedispatch.com/p/explaining-the-new-second-degree


32 posted on 06/04/2020 2:24:30 PM PDT by RummyChick ( Yeah, it's Daily Mail. So what. AND I AM NOT FACT CHECKING POSTS. I AM NOT TWITTER)
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To: karpov

Ellison is a corrupt racist rat bastard communist muslim. Any questions?


33 posted on 06/04/2020 2:30:43 PM PDT by 43north (Its hard to stop a man when he knows he's right and he keeps coming.)
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To: SMARTY
Honest cops were in peril the day that murderer was hired

What country are you from?

34 posted on 06/04/2020 2:32:43 PM PDT by ladyjane
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To: GrandJediMasterYoda

City Council resolution to take $100-150M from the police budget this year and redirect the money to various social justice crap. Also no increase of the police budget for next year.


35 posted on 06/04/2020 2:37:37 PM PDT by 17th Miss Regt
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To: Samurai_Jack

he’s going to be a sacrificial lamb sent to slaughter no matter the law....


36 posted on 06/04/2020 2:40:08 PM PDT by cherry
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To: karpov

A man was in police custody and was having an acknowledged medical crisis and died. All that is needed to be proved is that the cops were negligent in providing proper care.

Abuse is a side issue. Negligence will be the deciding factor.

The man died while the cops did nothing. They could have sat him up and tried to calm him. They may have even had oxygen in their trunks of their cars. They could have done just about anything but pin him to the ground during a breathing issue. They also continued their pinning of him even after signs that he had passed out or died.

Negligence. That is that is going to hang these cops.


37 posted on 06/04/2020 2:47:01 PM PDT by CodeToad (Arm Up! They Have!)
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To: Jimmy The Snake

no way this gets tried in 2020.


38 posted on 06/04/2020 2:51:47 PM PDT by yldstrk (Bingo! We have a winner!)
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To: karpov

His conviction is guaranteed. He will not get a fair trial.


39 posted on 06/04/2020 2:54:05 PM PDT by I want the USA back (Never forget Justine Damond, murdered by a NON-WHITE, NON-CHRISTIAN cop. (Oh, and no riots))
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To: karpov
At least one of them is guilty of *something* but *none* of them are guilty of anything *remotely* resembling what they're being charged with by that moslem Antifa supporter.
40 posted on 06/04/2020 3:53:12 PM PDT by Gay State Conservative (The Rats Just Can't Get Over The Fact That They Lost A Rigged Election!)
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