Posted on 12/07/2019 5:02:01 PM PST by karpov
...
When students realize that they will get into college no matter what they learn in grade school or high school, they will have no incentive to forgo activities that are more fun than attending school, listening to teachers, and doing homework.
As Albert Shanker, the late president of the American Federation of Teachers, wrote in 1993, “Kids are just like adults: they will work to get what they want. If they know they have to work hard, listen in class, and come to school every day with their homework done to get into college, they’ll do that. If they know they can get by with less and still get into college, that is what they’ll do.”
New York’s City College was once known as “the Harvard of the proletariat.” As the flagship college of the City University of New York, it charged no tuition but admitted only applicants who scored well on an academically difficult test. After African-American and Puerto Rican protesters chained shut the gates of the college in 1969 to call attention to the relatively low numbers of minority students, in 1970 City College adopted a policy of “open admissions” and began accepting underprepared students.
By 1978 the New York Times reported that “two out of three students entering City College now require remedial work in writing, mathematics or reading, and one in five needs it in all three.”
...
National studies show that the worse the academic preparation of admitted students, the lower the college graduation rate. Syracuse University’s Vincent Tinto, an expert on student attrition, reported in 1993 that colleges with an average SAT score of 1100 or higher have a first-year attrition rate of 8%. For colleges with an average SAT score of 700 or below, the first-year attrition rate is 45.5%.
(Excerpt) Read more at wsj.com ...
In this article he cites the book "City On A Hill: Testing The American Dream At City College" (1994) by James Traub when discussing what happened to City College of New York after it went to open admissions.
I think 10% of the jobs out there require a 4 year degree. We have 30% of adults walking around out there with the sheepskin meaning 20% of them wasted a lot of time learning useless stuff suck as gender studies. Just think if those young folk went right to work ingot an early start building their nest egg.
in 1992 when I graduated with a “business management” degree from Pace University, I found it important because there were a LOT of jobs in the business world that REQUIRED a college degree, regardless of what the major was.
I got a very good job at the commodities exchange because of that degree.
I DONT think there are as many jobs that say “College Degree required” anymore.
I don’t know.
But i’m GLAD i went to Pace to get the diploma as it was pretty cheap then.
NOT NOW!!
If you just want a general degree go to a state college so at least you have it and you’re not in a billion dollars debt.
A) Financial aid should not be tied to performance. It should be ended.
B) The number of students in college should be reduced by 90% . The number of students in high school should be reduced by 50%.
This is not rocket science.
Some company will create a highly successful cloud university using AI technology that will make all education free. Imagine employers knowing which applicants are fast learners, dedicated, ambitious, and self-motivated. They’d pay for that. It’s amazing how little classroom learning has changed from 100 years ago. There’s very little technology being used and too many Democrats with their hands in the cookie jar.
I used the G.I. bill to park my ass in a classroom for 45 months. Didn’t want to work. Didn’t have to. A lot of the time was just plain wasted. After k-12 why would anybody want to go to work?
It was a disaster. CCNY went from the only public university considered in a class with the Ivies to such a disaster that nobody wanted to admit that their degree was from City. If you admitted it, you’d always specify, “Before open admission.”
DeBlasio is trying to do the same thing to New York’s special high schools and programs. Black and Hispanic kids can get into them like everybody else, by working at it, without having the standards erased, and nobody seems to realize how insulting it is to imply that they can’t. But DeBlasio simply wants to destroy excellence because it’s a threat to his reign of stupidity.
Sounds noble but ill founded, I have worked in developing, deploying and managing teams developing “Educational models” for a broad array of subjects and levels.
Counting on them to do this is a fools errand in my view. College is known as the “New HS” in the corporate world and the need for a diploma from a college or university to be considered is because the quality and content of that which passes for education in the US today. Training organizations lack the depth and breadth of real wisdom to provide the foundations needed in the model you posit.
Even Apprentice programs are based on foundational knowledge and simple things like reading comprehension, numbers skill and others that create major issues in developing something that works and is cost effective.
JMHO but having done it at the teaching and leading level it is a challenge and in many cases the talent is not there in the company Training/Education Department, so called
If you can crawl into a public library and make the effort you can learn anything ... anything ... and I mean anything ... including nuclear physics, AI, rocket surgery ...
I need a plumber or an electrician more than a college grad.
If you can crawl into a public library and make the effort you can learn anything ... anything ... and I mean anything ... including nuclear physics, AI, rocket surgery …
Far more jobs now require a college degree. Even jobs years ago that didn’t require them put them as a prerequisite now.
I’ve had applicants with degrees that cannot compose a simple letter. It is painful reading resumes full of errors.
College is not what it used to be.
Some company will create a highly successful cloud university using AI technology that will make all education free. Imagine employers knowing which applicants are fast learners, dedicated, ambitious, and self-motivated. They’d pay for that. It’s amazing how little classroom learning has changed from 100 years ago. There’s very little technology being used and too many Democrats with their hands in the cookie jar.
Wow so it’s MORE
Yeah people who think a BS in management or marketing or one of the “useless” degrees are not worth anything are wrong.
I could NOT have gotten 2 of my most important jobs without a college degree.
And YES, I’ve seen some writing samples of recent grads...my friend’s kids ask me to look over their resumes.
Truly frightening.
L8r
I have no idea how many do it. I just stated that the opportunity is there. Schools aren’t necessary to obtain knowledge.
Yeah....no doubt about that. I’m sure there are a lot of “rocket surgeons” who got their knowledge exclusively from a public library. [/s]
By the way, I’m not saying you can’t pick up a lot of knowledge at a public library. But, I highly doubt you can pick up enough to be a practicing professional. Especially if it involves some kind of internship.
Free education is right here.
Y’all are literally looking at what can give you education in any subject you like, free.
Never has more information been more accessible for more people instantly at no cost.
Yet they complain about the vast sums they committed to by signing knowingly on the dotted line.
On any given day, me too.
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