Posted on 06/19/2019 7:57:08 AM PDT by Hostage
A key part of the Brexit negotiations has been the border that separates Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland.
The border is a matter of great political, security and diplomatic sensitivity in Ireland.
Therefore the UK and EU agreed that whatever happens as a result of Brexit there should be no new physical checks or infrastructure at the frontier.
This is where the controversial "backstop" comes in.
Go on then, what is the backstop? The backstop is a position of last resort, to maintain a seamless border on the island of Ireland in the event that the UK leaves the EU without securing an all-encompassing deal.
It would involve the UK retaining a very close relationship with the EU for an indefinite period.
The EU have insisted that any Brexit deal must contain the backstop.
(Excerpt) Read more at bbc.com ...
As it is, there is now a free flow of people, goods, and services between Ireland (which is part of the EU) and Northern Ireland which would leave the EU as part of Brexit. The 'backstop' is this free flow.
A 'hard' Brexit means leave the EU and let the chips fall where they may. The British people favor this but their Ministers of Parliament are bought off by globalist deal makers who seek endless debate with all talk and no action.
Brexiteers say the flow of things and people between Ireland and N. Ireland can be made efficient via technology. EU supporters say nyet.
I for one believe that it is about time that Northern Ireland be integrated with the Republic of Ireland to form one Island Nation. Britain would be a lot better off not having to deal with that issue. But, then again, I am just a dumb American that thinks common sense should prevail.
At the moment the border between Northern Ireland and the Republic of Ireland is virtually invisible. If you land at Dublin Airport and drive north to Belfast (in Northern Ireland) you will cross the border with the only thing you notice is that the signs start using miles rather than kilometers.
Posted 3 weeks ago with slides:
BURGER KING BREXIT (HILARIOUS!)
http://www.freerepublic.com/focus/chat/3751883/posts
The problem is that there is a significant number of people in Northern Ireland who desperately want to be part of the UK.
That number is diminishing.
In a generation or two, it will likely be insignificant if a straight line projection happens. Of course, it never does...so we don’t really know what the future holds.
But as I see it, the number of people who built a life around being a UK citizen in Northern Ireland is still way too large to do that, at least not quickly....perhaps a twenty or twenty-five year plan would work and be a commonsense solution (to your point...).
Now all that said.....as I mull this over....seeing as there is no “Ireland” as such (for border/customs purposes), there is only the EU...
It seems that realistically...the only path to Brexit is this.
The UK has to dump Northern Ireland.
Then it can Brexit.
Amazing how little old Ireland is still causing problems for the Empire after so much time.
Used to be that way between the US and Canada.
9-11 changed it and technology made it easy to continue as before.
NEXUS
https://www.cbp.gov/travel/trusted-traveler-programs/nexus
FAST
https://www.cbp.gov/travel/trusted-traveler-programs/fast
The UK Remainers do not have a leg to stand on in opposing Brexit.
Karma.
Anglican vs. Catholic cultures determine elections, who serves, works in government, who gets contracts.
There is no US Constitution type of governing law there.
Although the Church is in decline at the moment in both religions in Ireland, history shows a historical wax and wane, flow and ebb, to and from the Church. In other words, it’s a near certainty that future generations will flock back to their faiths reinforcing the historical divisions. The way that peace has been achieved is to respect the divisions administratively.
The answer is for the U.K. to simply leave with no agreement and conduct widespread background checks on anybody police even think may be in the country illegally - and as a matter of course for anybody traveling from Northern Ireland to the rest of the U.K.
Those in Northern Ireland would have to accept this as the price of not having a hard border. That then leaves it to the EU to take the very unpopular step of building a border wall which the Irish will hate. (The UK’s concern is to control immigration while the EU’s concern is over the flow of cheaper goods not subject to all the EU’s regulations flowing from the U.K. into Ireland)
Having a seamless border with an EU country is essentially the same thing as being in the EU.
The UK currently has a seamless border with the EU.
That’s the Ireland/Northern Ireland border.
If that border is to stay the same, then the UK (meaning Northern Ireland, sort of, but really the UK) has to REMAIN merged with the EU in every respect. Same as not leaving.
But if the border stays open as it were, and goods/people whatever go into the U (whetehr arriving first in England, then going over to Northern Ireland), and then spill over into Ireland (meaning the EU), then that basically means the EU is dissolved because now goods people whatever can slip into the EU (seamless border between Ireland and say Germany) via England (via Northern Ireland, via Ireland, and from there into the rest of the EU).
Interesting really. Seems Brexit could, on one hand, bring down the whole Monster that is the EU.
Or it could result in Northern Ireland just being dumped from the UK. (May couldn’t do that because DUP was part of her thin coalition).
Logically, Ireland could sort of become a second tier EU member, sort of dragged along with Brexit, but the Irish, in love with their beloved global socialism/gay stuff, wouldn’t allow that. And the EU is not going to allow one of their member states to be demoted.
Or it could result in nothing ever happening on Brexit, because all of those scenarios are sort of impossible.
I think it’s relevant here: what happens when Swiss goods (non EU) go into Austria and Italy (EU)? I know there is a hard border with military personnel, but I don’t know about all the other stuff.
Of course we all know that Switzerland is not as non-EU as they used to be, and it is currently being forced to comply with various EU matters simply because it doesn’t have the bargaining power to resist.....
One final thought....doesn’t Scotland want to be out of UK...but in Europe?
So back to the point...if you gut the UK and dump Northern Ireland, then you likely start a socialist uprising in Scotland to get out of the UK also....and back into Europe....and you have the same problem yet again. How does England/UK share a border with an EU country (or more precisely, with the EU...countries don’t really matter in that context)?
This is not easy stuff.
That’s a perspective.
Another one would be, no good deed goes unpunished.
I’m not advocating one or the other....just sayin there are many perspectives out there on that difficult history and all of them have some merit.
Strongbow never should have set foot on the island.
I’m not so sure.
Catholicism in Ireland, what with Maynooth and the love affair that the Irish have with islam together with their gay PM and rush to embrace abortion and everything else probably forever kills Catholicism in Ireland.
Catholicism in Northern Ireland, while somewhat a separate animal, will likely be pulled down by these same forces.
As for historic Protestantism in Northern Ireland, I think demographics and history make the decline irreversible. A deep and historic Protestantism (meaning vitally connected to historic Protestantism) is basically gone from the rest of the world...but in Northern Ireland it lasted longer than most places. For all of his faults, Ian Paisley was a genuine, recognizable and authentic historic Protestant. (I’m not saying anything else good or bad about him....I’m only noting that he truly channeled the spirit of Protestantism [at least one spirit, a historic strand], in a living historic sense...and obviously the conflict that surrounded him helped him forge that identity).
NOW....what could happen?
Something like a South American non-Catholic but hardly historically Protestant revival could occur in Northern Ireland.
But I don’t see that sort of reupping the historic Catholic or Protestant cultures that were once so identifiable over the entire island.
All that said....we are both simply trying to predict the future lol.
And the future is always filled with surprises. So I submit the above humbly and non-dogmatically...just for food for thought. :)
So we’ll have a united Ireland,not due to the IRA,but because the Orangeman are pissed at the Brits...strange days indeed
A united Ireland....but not no autonomy whatsoever. No Irish punt. No nothing.
Ireland, united, is merged into “Europe”. Talk about winning the battle, but losing the war.
For years, I have been making this same point. You are quite right. I’m not sure anyone cares, though, because Irish Republicans seem to have gotten on the path of simply International Socialism, and left Irish Autonomy in the dust.
After all...you gotta remain relevant.....
Yep. Agree, see #9 above.
See #9 above.
It is easy stuff. It’s just sinecured busybodies making it more complicated than it is.
The simple political solution for U.K. is to just not put any hard border facilities on the English side. Any border would then be on the EU and the folks not liking it can take the complaints to them. UK can just put a few MI 5 guys about to keep an eye out for serious smugglers which they can do unobtrusively.
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