Pope Francis grants indulgences for Dublin participants

Participants attending the World Meeting of Families in August can be forgiven their sins or help a relative speed through purgatory.

In Catholic doctrine an indulgence frees you from being punished for your previously committed sins or it can be passed on to dead relatives to shorten their time in purgatory.

Even those following events on TV and radio can achieve a partial indulgence as long as they recite the Our Father, the Creed and other devout prayers.

Martin Luther's opposition to the sale of indulgences was one of the main causes of the Protestant Reformation in the 16th Century.

The Sacred Apostolic Penitentiary, the Vatican body dealing with forgiveness of sins, said pilgrims would have to attend confession and Mass, pray for the Pope's intentions and participate in some function during the five-day event.

The use of indulgences in Catholicism is a tradition that goes back to the Crusades in the 11th Century.

Glancing over the thread over a cuppa coffee and some home grown Nebraska beef for breakfast, I note that pretty much all the differences we have on this thread with each other start with whether or not Scripture is sufficient for salvation, or whether more must be added.

Correct me if I’m wrong, of course. Perhaps Scripture is sufficient but Mrs. D believes that we’re just missing some things by denying tradition? Or something else entirely.

But to me at least it all seems to come down to that.

From that the questions follow about temporal punishments, discipline, et cetera.

My own position is that traditions, sacred or otherwise, are useful and should be studied. But there is only one source that we KNOW is Apostolic, prophetic, and divine teaching from God, and that is Scripture. The ancient ekklesia had very strict requirements for what was to be included in canon, and because most of it had been assembled when at least a few of the Apostles were still alive, it can be trusted. Especially the letters of Paul and the Gospels.

The Apostles or their assistants did not write things in code, or in a special way, and definitely did not write to contradict themselves. If they write something, it says what it means and means what it says, and a simple understanding is best because it was written so even simple people could understand.

Over my life I’ve had to swallow my pride when faced with the awesome power of the Word of God. Many times I’ve had to do so, from having to abandon the idea that I can earn God’s favor, to my mistaken embrace of leftist theology during my teenage years, to the realization of the importance of Baptism and Communion in the life of faith.

In general, I’ve found that when my theology has to try to turn the Word to say something it doesn’t say, or to ignore the plain words, then it’s my theology that’s wrong. And seeming contradictions must be answered with cultural context, textual context, et cetera.

And sometimes I have to admit there are verses I just can’t understand and will need to study deeper on, or wait until eternal life.

Anyways, a little bit of a ramble, but I figure that it may help to focus the discussion. It’s not often that we get a debate thread that doesn’t turn into a flame war as of late.

Just wish I could participate more, but VBS is more important right now, even if the kids always leave me whupped!

Acts 15    Version 1.6

The Council at Fresno...

¹ Certain Catholics came from all across the world to FreeRepublic and were trying to convince the believers: "Unless you are Catechized, according to the custom taught by Rome, you cannot be saved." ² This brought Elsie and Metmom ETAL into sharp dispute and debate with them. So Elsie and Metmom were appointed, along with some other believers, to lurk on FR to see the Catholics and NON about this question. ³ The Holy Spirit sent them on their way, and as they traveled through the Religion Forum, they told how the NON-Catholics had been converted. This news made all the Protestants very glad. ⁴ When they came to FR, they were scorned by members of the ONE TRUE church, to whom they reported everything God had done through them.

⁵ Then some of the believers who belonged to the party of the Catholics stood up and said, "The Protestants must be baptisted correctly and required to keep the laws of Rome!"
⁶ The posters met to consider this question. ⁷ After much discussion, Metmom got up and addressed them: "Brothers, you know that some time ago God made a choice among you that the Protestants might hear from our fingers the message of the gospel and believe. ⁸ God, who knows the heart, showed that he accepted them by giving the Holy Spirit to them, just as he did to us. ⁹ He did not discriminate between us and them, for he purified their hearts by faith. ¹⁰ Now then, why do you try to test God by putting on the necks of Protestants a yoke that neither we nor our ancestors have been able to bear? ¹¹ No! We believe it is through the grace of our Lord Jesus that we are saved, just as they are."
¹² The whole of FR became silent (Yeah; THAT's gonna happen!) as they listened to Elsie and Metmom telling about the signs and wonders God had done among the Protestants. ¹³ When they finished, Boatbums spoke up. "Brothers," she said, "listen to me. ¹⁴ MGinTN has described to us how God first intervened to choose a people for his name from the Gentiles. ¹⁵ The words of the prophets are in agreement with this, as it is written:
¹⁶ "'After this I will return
   and rebuild Rome's fallen tent.
Its ruins I will rebuild,
   and I will restore it,
¹⁷ that the rest of mankind may seek the Lord,
   even all the Protestants who bear my name,
says the Lord, who does these things'
¹⁸ things known from long ago.
¹⁹ "It is my judgment, therefore, that we should not make it difficult for the Protestants who are turning to God. ²⁰ Instead we should write to them, telling them to abstain from vision and apparations, from Brown Scapulas, from the endless repetitions of the ROSARY and from so-called blood. ²¹ For the laws of Rome has been preached in every city from the earliest times and is read in the sanctuaries on every Sunday."
The Council's Letter to Gentile Believers
²² Then the posters and lurkers, with the whole church, decided to choose some of their own men and send them to Fresno with Mark17 and Tennessee Nana. They chose Daniel1212 (called Wise) and eagleone, and Luircin,  Mark17; as well as aMorePerfectUnion; folks who were leaders among the believers. ²³ With them they sent the following letter:

   The apostles and elders, your brothers,
   To the Gentile believers in Antioch, Syria and Cilicia:
   Greetings.
²⁴ We have heard that some went out from us without our authorization and disturbed you, troubling your minds by what they said. ²⁵ So we all agreed to choose some men and send them to you with our dear friends Barnabas and Paul— ²⁶ men who have risked their lives for the name of our Lord Jesus Christ. ²⁷ Therefore we are sending Judas and Silas to confirm by word of mouth what we are writing. ²⁸ It seemed good to the Holy Spirit and to us not to burden you with anything beyond the following requirements: ²⁹ You are to abstain from food sacrificed to idols, from blood, from the meat of strangled animals and from sexual immorality. You will do well to avoid these things.
   Farewell.

³⁰ So the men were sent off and continued to post on FR, where they gathered the people together and delivered the GOSPEL. ³¹ The people (most all except ebb tide, piusv, Salvation; Steelfish; Mrs. Don-o and Vlademir998) read it and were glad for its encouraging message.

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