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Don’t Sweat Russia’s Stealth-Fighter-Detecting New Radar
War is Boring ^ | July 11, 2016 | DAVID AXE

Posted on 07/11/2016 10:51:10 AM PDT by sukhoi-30mki

Russia is the latest country to claim that it has developed a new radar system that can detect stealth warplanes. But the Sunflower low-frequency over-the-horizon radar likely suffers all the same drawbacks that have plagued previous generations of similar sensors. Namely, Sunflower might be able to detect a low-observable airplane. But it probably can’t do so with great fidelity — nor generate a useful targeting track for a missile to follow. Despite Russia’s claim, stealth aircraft are no less difficult to find, target and destroy now than they were before the Sunflower’s introduction.

Russian media touted the Sunflower radar in a series of article in early July 2016. “Russia’s powerful over-the-horizon … Sunflower radar is capable of detecting and tracking the stealth fifth-generation plane or any other fighter jet that was designed to avoid detection,” state-owned website Sputnik News reported on July 2, citing an earlier article in Svobodnaya Pressa, an independent Russian tabloid.

Sunflower and similar radars “see stealth fighter jets as clearly as World War II-era aircraft,” Svobodnaya Pressa claimed.

Sunflower radar. Photo via RT

Technically speaking, that’s almost certainly true. Fighter-size stealth aircraft are optimized to avoid detection by radars in higher-frequency bands such as the C, X, Ku and part of the S band.

Low-frequency radars with larger wavelengths aren’t really affected by the stealth features that tend to defeat higher-frequency sensors. There’s a resonant effect with low-frequency radars that can generate a significant signal return despite an aircraft’s low-observable shaping and radar-absorbing coating.

But the same qualities that allow a low-frequency radar to detect a stealth fighter also prevent it from detecting the same aircraft with great precision. Mike Pietrucha, a former U.S. Air Force an electronic warfare officer, told reporter Dave Majumdar from The National Interest that early low-frequency radars could poinpoint a target’s location to within only 10,000 feet or so — not nearly accurately enough to guide a missile.

For that reason, low-frequency radars such as Sunflower are useful only as early-warning systems. All they can do is alert air-defenders to the likely presence of low-observable aircraft in a general area.

To be fair, that’s not an insignificant contribution to a counter-air campaign. But it’s also not new. The United States, Russia, China and Iran — among other countries — have long deployed low-frequency radars for early-warning purposes.

Stealth fighters have always been visible to these sensors and always will be. Sunflower’s supposed counterstealth prowess speaks more to the strict physical limitations of low-observable fighter-design and less to a stealth-defeating breakthrough on Russia’s part.

What’s perhaps most impressive about Sunflower isn’t its ability to detect stealth fighters, but its comparative compactness. Many low-frequency radars installations are huge and power-intensive — and big, fat targets during a shooting war.

Sunflower, by contrast, is small and portable, according to media reports. “The system could be put online in 10 days and needs a team of just three people to stay operational,” Sputnik explained. “It does not need much power, it is easy to operate and it does not have much equipment.”

Sunflower clearly trades performance for portability.

Where larger low-frequency radars can detect targets thousands of miles away, the new Russian system reportedly has a range of just 300 miles or so.

But there are clear tactical advantages in being able to quickly set up large numbers of smaller, low-frequency radars. Russia could, on short notice, deploy batteries of Sunflowers on the periphery of conflict zones in order to begin getting a vague idea of where U.S. and allied stealth fighters are operating.

That’s hardly a sure-fire way of defeating stealth.

But it’s not nothing.


TOPICS: Foreign Affairs; News/Current Events; Russia
KEYWORDS: aerospace; russia; stealth
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1 posted on 07/11/2016 10:51:10 AM PDT by sukhoi-30mki
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To: sukhoi-30mki

How long until war with Russia?


2 posted on 07/11/2016 10:55:12 AM PDT by PGR88
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To: sukhoi-30mki

The fact is that no ‘stealth plane’ is immune to detection from all wavelengths. The problem becomes one of the resolution of detection. With enough locators with the right areas of coverage and coordination can locate platforms that are supposed to be stealthy.

These low frequency arrays have been around for a long time. Often used for OTH and the odd use. The fact is that stealth planes are optimized for expected RF locator sources. That usually means from head-on incursion angles. Detection from underneath, or overhead (think satellites my friends) and the game gets trickier.

The truth is that stealth is for use against non sophisticated targets. They are not invulnerable from passive systems using ubiquitous sources, nor are they completely radar invisible. To believe ‘stealth’ is the panacea is foolish.


3 posted on 07/11/2016 10:57:20 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: sukhoi-30mki

perfect. they’re spending money that they don’t have. it’s sort of what defensive spending is all about; our economic engine can drive our defense industry, while theirs cannot.

that’s what caused their first collapse. it’s likely to cause a second one.


4 posted on 07/11/2016 10:58:35 AM PDT by JohnBrowdie
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To: sukhoi-30mki
Combine stealth with ECM and you can still get a flying "black hole".

One legend in the EWO community was that one of ours overflew one of theirs and blanked both out to ATC thereby revealing it's presence.

5 posted on 07/11/2016 10:58:59 AM PDT by pfflier
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To: PGR88

Get back to me on Nov. 9th.


6 posted on 07/11/2016 10:59:06 AM PDT by dp0622 (The only thing an upper crust conservative hates more than a liberal is a middle class conservative)
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To: sukhoi-30mki
The author made an error.

Detection has nothing to do with tracking. This RADAR type is Early Warning (EW) and is meant to hand off to a Target Tracker (TT) by providing range, bearing and altitude.

7 posted on 07/11/2016 11:02:16 AM PDT by rjsimmon (The Tree of Liberty Thirsts)
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To: sukhoi-30mki

Can’t get enough data for target resolution?

Well, if ya got a gazillion sites and missiles...

5.56mm


8 posted on 07/11/2016 11:05:24 AM PDT by M Kehoe
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To: Gaffer

Don’t forget that the lower the return signal from the stealthy target, the higher gain required by the receiver to reliably detect a signal. This also makes such radar more susceptible to jamming, and the jamming signal doesn’t need to be as powerful, making jamming pods smaller.

It would also be fairly easy to deploy decoys that could passively or actively emulate a larger target in the lower frequencies, further complicating any attempted intercept.


9 posted on 07/11/2016 11:06:09 AM PDT by Yo-Yo (Is the /sarc tag really necessary?)
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To: Yo-Yo

You start jamming and they you absolutely tell them something is up. I’m just telling you that stealth isn’t the cure all. I know better.


10 posted on 07/11/2016 11:08:37 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: Gaffer

“First Secretary, the infrared guidance system is not the most accurate means of aiming. It may be necessary for a Soviet aircraft to act as a target. Will you give that order?”

(Pause)...”Of course.”

“Very well, First Secretary, then the American is bound to fly into our trap.”


11 posted on 07/11/2016 11:10:03 AM PDT by elcid1970 ("The Second Amendment is more important than Islam. Buy ammo.")
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To: sukhoi-30mki

Detecting “something” in the air with a high-power radar is one thing; locating it with the precision necessary to destroy it is something else entirely.


12 posted on 07/11/2016 11:14:08 AM PDT by ManHunter (You can run, but you'll only die tired... Army snipers: Reach out and touch someone)
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To: elcid1970

Are you aware that cellular system signals can be used to form a passive location system?


13 posted on 07/11/2016 11:17:32 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: JohnBrowdie
that’s what caused their first collapse. it’s likely to cause a second one.

Hurray! Then we can impose a progressive, leftist, George Soros-sponsored Goldman Sachs President, and force them to be all-in on the gay-marriage and Muslim immigration thing which we tried before. Can we bring Pussy Riot out of retirement? In fact, no country will fold faster with a few million mid-east Muslims, given its own Muslim population.

No more worries about Russia frustrating Saudi plans in the Mid-East either or being a counter-weight to EU/Brussels plans for Europe. Once that happens, Russia will be broken up and will never bother us again.

14 posted on 07/11/2016 11:17:42 AM PDT by PGR88
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To: ManHunter

All one needs is a general location in which to focus assets with better resolution, longer signal integration times and the like. Add multi-banded capability to bear the same resources and you aren’t stealthy any more.


15 posted on 07/11/2016 11:19:29 AM PDT by Gaffer
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To: Gaffer

My wife gave me a cellphone years ago, also known as a male tracking device.

;^)


16 posted on 07/11/2016 11:26:53 AM PDT by elcid1970 ("The Second Amendment is more important than Islam. Buy ammo.")
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To: PGR88

yeah, that’s exactly what I said. hysteria much?


17 posted on 07/11/2016 11:37:24 AM PDT by JohnBrowdie
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To: Gaffer

“all you need to know is where it is, and then you will be able to find out where it is!”


18 posted on 07/11/2016 11:42:51 AM PDT by JohnBrowdie
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To: JohnBrowdie

just thinking about logical consequences...


19 posted on 07/11/2016 11:46:58 AM PDT by PGR88
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To: rjsimmon

That is true with all IADS, but with a resolution that can only get you within 10,000 meters you are asking a lot of most Target Track platforms that only have a 1 degree beam width. 10km is a lot of damn sky to search. Plus you will have to have multiple systems up radiating. Those systems have now told the enemy where they are.


20 posted on 07/11/2016 11:56:23 AM PDT by sean327 (God created all men equal, then some become Marines!)
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