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AMERICANS SHELL REICH, ENTER LUXEMBOURG; ZEEBRUGGE WON; FRENCH FIGHT NEAR BELFORT (9/11/44)
Microfilm-New York Times archives, Monterey Public Library | 9/11/44 | Drew Middleton, Frederick Graham, Harold Denny, George Axelsson, Alexander P. de Seversky

Posted on 09/11/2014 4:14:18 AM PDT by Homer_J_Simpson

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TOPICS: Extended News
KEYWORDS: history; milhist; realtime; worldwarii
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To: colorado tanker; Homer_J_Simpson; Steven Scharf; PapaNew
And where did I find this map in Junior High School?

Airborne Carpet Cover photo Airbornecarpetcover_zpsdad5b3ea.jpg

Yep, these books only cost a dollar for 160 pages of history, photos and maps. Damned good historians like Geoffrey Jukes, Earl Ziemke and John Keegan were contributing authors. I still have about two dozen in my library. I started my history library with these gems. Now you know where my allowance money went. These books and giant Sweet Tarts and Charms Big Pops. Forget girls; not on the radar screen. Me on theirs, that is.

21 posted on 09/11/2014 5:16:15 PM PDT by henkster (Do I really need a sarcasm tag?)
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To: PAR35

I think the first step was to isolate the Germans in western Holland and then turn south as part 2.


22 posted on 09/11/2014 5:17:12 PM PDT by henkster (Do I really need a sarcasm tag?)
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To: Steven Scharf
Yes, “Bridge too Far” is a fictional account of MG.

There may be some artistic license in the film, but it is not 'fictional'. And the book certainly is not. You can learn a lot of history watching the film.

23 posted on 09/11/2014 5:17:22 PM PDT by PAR35
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To: PapaNew

XXX Corps basically started on the Albert Canal in Belgium and the target was Arnhem on the far side of the Rhine.


24 posted on 09/11/2014 5:26:18 PM PDT by PAR35
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To: PAR35; PapaNew

Cornelius Ryan based his books on interviews with the principals involved, as well as the common soldier. Since he did his research in the early 1960s, most of the generals were still alive to be interviewed. That’s what made his books such popular movies.

For “The Last Battle,” he was allowed by the Soviets to interview Marshals Konev and Chuikov, as well as some regular front line soldiers. He was not granted access to Zhukov.


25 posted on 09/11/2014 6:26:50 PM PDT by henkster (Do I really need a sarcasm tag?)
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To: colorado tanker
de Seversky actually got something right in his last paragraph as to whether we can sustain the progress we've been making in France as we prepare to enter Germany.

It will depend on "whether the Germans are as ready to defend every inch of their soil as the British and the Russians were.

I think he was referring to whether or not the Allies could maintain their lines of supply. The Red Ball Express had been in the news for a few weeks. Looking at the magnanimous task of supplying two Army Groups and the 7th Army (Patch) with the one mulberry harbor and Cherbourg harbor (both way down south) even a reporter (in those days) would know you would need a bigger harbor closer to the fighting.

As it turns out, and as has been in the news the last few days as many surmised, not only Antwerp, but the Scheldt must be taken. Monty took Antwerp, but failed to understand the importance of the Scheldt. The Schedlt will not be taken until after Market Garden.

We will see the Allies sitting at the doorstep of Germany until next year because of this ommission by Monty.

26 posted on 09/11/2014 6:43:19 PM PDT by occamrzr06 (A great life is but a series of dogs!)
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To: Steven Scharf

The movie might have been fictionalized (slightly), but it was not fiction. Individuals, units and events are closely based on historical fact.


27 posted on 09/11/2014 7:23:06 PM PDT by Lonesome in Massachussets (This is known as "bad luck". - Robert A. Heinlein)
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To: colorado tanker

:-)


28 posted on 09/11/2014 8:54:17 PM PDT by PapaNew (The grace of God & freedom always win the debate over unjust law & government in the forum of ideas)
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To: henkster; PapaNew; Homer_J_Simpson; Steven Scharf
I think that's the best map of the Market-Garden operation I've ever seen. Thanks!

"Pencil-like thrust." I think I'll leave that one alone!

It was an absurd plan. There was one two lane road for the entire advance. Much of the road was elevated above squishy polders that could not support heavy armor, so there was no room to maneuver. Any stop of the advance leaves airborne troops dangling in Arnhem. The Brits had no sense of urgency and no idea how to pull off such a daring operation. In my opinion the only commander who would have had a chance to pull this off would be Patton, who would kick butt pushing the advance 24/7 until he either got to Arnhem or it fell.

But I agree with you that Patton was too good a commander to adopt such a foolish plan.

It is also interesting to note that the British never even bothered to finish the plan and get over the neder-rijn. They abandoned the plan and turned east to the more direct route into Germany. If you think about it, isn't the more direct route, going over one big river, better than an indirect route through watery Holland? Arnhem finally fell as sort of an afterthought in the aftermath of Operation Plunder, when Monty finally got across the Rhine, but I am getting way ahead of myself.

29 posted on 09/12/2014 10:47:43 AM PDT by colorado tanker
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To: colorado tanker

“MESSINA is reserved for the British army...and ME.”


30 posted on 09/12/2014 1:09:23 PM PDT by PapaNew (The grace of God & freedom always win the debate over unjust law & government in the forum of ideas)
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

2.4 million pounds of good beef??


31 posted on 09/12/2014 1:14:04 PM PDT by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans)
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

page 10-

I was thrown off by the “United Nations” communiqué


32 posted on 09/12/2014 1:14:58 PM PDT by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans)
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To: henkster

He didn’t think the airborne troops would be spread too thin?


33 posted on 09/12/2014 1:19:10 PM PDT by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans)
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To: GeronL

How come? We started seeing United Nations communiques in early 1942.


34 posted on 09/12/2014 1:40:44 PM PDT by Homer_J_Simpson ("Every nation has the government that it deserves." - Joseph de Maistre (1753-1821))
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To: Homer_J_Simpson

I hadn’t released noticed them lol


35 posted on 09/12/2014 1:41:14 PM PDT by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans)
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To: henkster; colorado tanker

henkster, do have a link to this map? I agree with colorado tanker, it is a helpful map.


36 posted on 09/12/2014 2:40:15 PM PDT by PapaNew (The grace of God & freedom always win the debate over unjust law & government in the forum of ideas)
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To: GeronL
2.4 million pounds of good beef??

I noticed that too. Given the shortages now occurring in Germany that must have been a big loss. I suppose they couldn't move it. From what I'm reading they have lost so much equipment many Germans are fleeing on foot or bicycle.

37 posted on 09/12/2014 2:45:16 PM PDT by colorado tanker
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To: PapaNew

The map is not online, except in my photobucket account. I scanned it out of the book last night.


38 posted on 09/12/2014 2:51:01 PM PDT by henkster (Do I really need a sarcasm tag?)
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To: colorado tanker

Another article in todays poster paper said German soldiers were told to dump the loot and keep their guns.


39 posted on 09/12/2014 2:52:44 PM PDT by GeronL (Vote for Conservatives not for Republicans)
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To: GeronL

I wonder how Monty thought the Germans would not be able to cut the highway at several points and isolate XXX Corps as it moved north of Arnhem. Maybe Monty read too many press clippings about the Germans being finished.


40 posted on 09/12/2014 2:53:05 PM PDT by henkster (Do I really need a sarcasm tag?)
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